• When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Walkthrough and FMV on high dollar books?

Started by The-Collector,

59 posts in this topic

ImageMask

ImageMask

Posted
Posted
Hey guys

 

If I have a book worth 20-40k Slabbed is there any other service I can use besides Walkthrough? As 3% of FMV seems excessive is a significant fee.

 

And if not, how is FMV determined? Ospg? In house valuation? Gpa?

 

Thanks in advance

 

 

Sincerely

 

 

Jake

 

You must trust the CGC to be impartial. Coz FMV is what they say it is. How FMV is determined is as secret as their grading standard. Just negotiate it like you would a BSD book with an auction house. (thumbs u

Link to comment
Share on other sites
ciorac

ciorac

Posted
Posted
I think as long as you specify a value that can be reasonably justified and isn't ridiculously low, CGC won't nitpick it.

 

I think this is about spot-on. (thumbs u

 

Now you thnk it is spot on? On the prior page you stated that CGC made the dertermination AFTER the grading process.

 

Have you ever submitted a book for walk-through? Apparently not, so you are just hazarding guesses I assume.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
bababooey

bababooey

Posted
Posted
I think as long as you specify a value that can be reasonably justified and isn't ridiculously low, CGC won't nitpick it.

 

I think this is about spot-on. (thumbs u

 

Now you thnk it is spot on? On the prior page you stated that CGC made the dertermination AFTER the grading process.

 

Have you ever submitted a book for walk-through? Apparently not, so you are just hazarding guesses I assume.

Actually his "Hulk 1 @ $1000" was a "ridiculously low" FMV example - the way I read the statement is that a ridiculously low book could attract a higher fee after grading. (shrug)

 

Are you saying the FMV is assessed when you physically drop the book at CGC prior to walk-through grading?

I don't understand the 'walk-through' process, I'm guessing there is the on-site version you're referring to but there are also cases where books that won't fit in any other service level (over 3K) might be mailed/couriered to CGC for walk through service level simply because of their value. Is there a distinction you're making or something I am missing?

 

:popcorn:

Link to comment
Share on other sites
VintageComics

VintageComics

Posted
Posted
I think as long as you specify a value that can be reasonably justified and isn't ridiculously low, CGC won't nitpick it.

 

I think this is about spot-on. (thumbs u

 

Now you thnk it is spot on? On the prior page you stated that CGC made the dertermination AFTER the grading process.

 

Have you ever submitted a book for walk-through? Apparently not, so you are just hazarding guesses I assume.

 

He's more or less right.

 

You set a value of your own for insurance purposes in case your book gets damaged in CGC's possession.

 

If it's not ridiculously low, it usually goes through with the grading fee undisturbed.

 

If it's ridiculously low, they'll bump it to roughly fair market value after grading and charge the applicable grading fee.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
ciorac

ciorac

Posted
Posted
I think as long as you specify a value that can be reasonably justified and isn't ridiculously low, CGC won't nitpick it.

 

I think this is about spot-on. (thumbs u

 

Now you thnk it is spot on? On the prior page you stated that CGC made the dertermination AFTER the grading process.

 

Have you ever submitted a book for walk-through? Apparently not, so you are just hazarding guesses I assume.

 

He's more or less right.

 

You set a value of your own for insurance purposes in case your book gets damaged in CGC's possession.

 

If it's not ridiculously low, it usually goes through with the grading fee undisturbed.

 

If it's ridiculously low, they'll bump it to roughly fair market value after grading and charge the applicable grading fee.

 

 

I agree that mycomicshop is fairly accurate. It's what I said on the other page as well. I've not been nitpicked, but then again I've tried to be relatively accurate when I submit comics for walk-through. My comment was about FTs dual position.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
WEBHEAD

WEBHEAD

Posted
Posted
I think as long as you specify a value that can be reasonably justified and isn't ridiculously low, CGC won't nitpick it.

 

I think this is about spot-on. (thumbs u

 

Now you thnk it is spot on? On the prior page you stated that CGC made the dertermination AFTER the grading process.

 

Have you ever submitted a book for walk-through? Apparently not, so you are just hazarding guesses I assume.

 

He's more or less right.

 

You set a value of your own for insurance purposes in case your book gets damaged in CGC's possession.

 

If it's not ridiculously low, it usually goes through with the grading fee undisturbed.

 

If it's ridiculously low, they'll bump it to roughly fair market value after grading and charge the applicable grading fee.

 

 

 

What if you disagree with their value (overstreet/gpa/tea leaves) do they do they notify you of the new price (say you pay by check) so you can say no thanks (shrug) Seems to me that slabbing and if you could not or would not pay the shylock price would be a crime.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
bababooey

bababooey

Posted
Posted
I think as long as you specify a value that can be reasonably justified and isn't ridiculously low, CGC won't nitpick it.

 

I think this is about spot-on. (thumbs u

 

Now you thnk it is spot on? On the prior page you stated that CGC made the dertermination AFTER the grading process.

 

Have you ever submitted a book for walk-through? Apparently not, so you are just hazarding guesses I assume.

 

He's more or less right.

 

You set a value of your own for insurance purposes in case your book gets damaged in CGC's possession.

 

If it's not ridiculously low, it usually goes through with the grading fee undisturbed.

 

If it's ridiculously low, they'll bump it to roughly fair market value after grading and charge the applicable grading fee.

 

 

 

What if you disagree with their value (overstreet/gpa/tea leaves) do they do they notify you of the new price (say you pay by check) so you can say no thanks (shrug) Seems to me that slabbing and if you could not or would not pay the shylock price would be a crime.

You're agreeing to this when you submit. The argument people are talking past each other on is that CGC isn't aggressive when it comes to soaking every penny from submitters who give reasonable prices that aren't "ridiculously low", like the "Hulk #1" example earlier.

 

***In the event that CGC, at its sole discretion, determines that the fair market value is higher than the value stated by the submitter, CGC will move the comic book to the appropriate higher tier and the additional charge will be the responsibility of the submitter.

http://www.cgccomics.com/services/Services.aspx

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
WEBHEAD

WEBHEAD

Posted
Posted

Or is the FMV only in force for walkins can you imagine sending in a book you bought in the early '60 for 10 cents under the standard grading and had to wait months for it to come back only for CGC to make a change to your cost..... lol

Link to comment
Share on other sites
WEBHEAD

WEBHEAD

Posted
Posted
I think as long as you specify a value that can be reasonably justified and isn't ridiculously low, CGC won't nitpick it.

 

I think this is about spot-on. (thumbs u

 

Now you thnk it is spot on? On the prior page you stated that CGC made the dertermination AFTER the grading process.

 

Have you ever submitted a book for walk-through? Apparently not, so you are just hazarding guesses I assume.

 

He's more or less right.

 

You set a value of your own for insurance purposes in case your book gets damaged in CGC's possession.

 

If it's not ridiculously low, it usually goes through with the grading fee undisturbed.

 

If it's ridiculously low, they'll bump it to roughly fair market value after grading and charge the applicable grading fee.

 

 

 

What if you disagree with their value (overstreet/gpa/tea leaves) do they do they notify you of the new price (say you pay by check) so you can say no thanks (shrug) Seems to me that slabbing and if you could not or would not pay the shylock price would be a crime.

You're agreeing to this when you submit. The argument people are talking past each other on is that CGC isn't aggressive when it comes to soaking every penny from submitters who give reasonable prices that aren't "ridiculously low", like the "Hulk #1" example earlier.

 

***In the event that CGC, at its sole discretion, determines that the fair market value is higher than the value stated by the submitter, CGC will move the comic book to the appropriate higher tier and the additional charge will be the responsibility of the submitter.

http://www.cgccomics.com/services/Services.aspx

 

Right who can really determine the correct value... and don't you have the right to refuse the price increase. If you chose to not pay they Have to send the book back Ungraded and Unslabbed!! Otherwise it would be theft.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
bababooey

bababooey

Posted
Posted
I think as long as you specify a value that can be reasonably justified and isn't ridiculously low, CGC won't nitpick it.

 

I think this is about spot-on. (thumbs u

 

Now you thnk it is spot on? On the prior page you stated that CGC made the dertermination AFTER the grading process.

 

Have you ever submitted a book for walk-through? Apparently not, so you are just hazarding guesses I assume.

 

He's more or less right.

 

You set a value of your own for insurance purposes in case your book gets damaged in CGC's possession.

 

If it's not ridiculously low, it usually goes through with the grading fee undisturbed.

 

If it's ridiculously low, they'll bump it to roughly fair market value after grading and charge the applicable grading fee.

 

 

 

What if you disagree with their value (overstreet/gpa/tea leaves) do they do they notify you of the new price (say you pay by check) so you can say no thanks (shrug) Seems to me that slabbing and if you could not or would not pay the shylock price would be a crime.

You're agreeing to this when you submit. The argument people are talking past each other on is that CGC isn't aggressive when it comes to soaking every penny from submitters who give reasonable prices that aren't "ridiculously low", like the "Hulk #1" example earlier.

 

***In the event that CGC, at its sole discretion, determines that the fair market value is higher than the value stated by the submitter, CGC will move the comic book to the appropriate higher tier and the additional charge will be the responsibility of the submitter.

http://www.cgccomics.com/services/Services.aspx

 

Right who can really determine the correct value... and don't you have the right to refuse the price increase. If you chose to not pay they Have to send the book back Ungraded and Unslabbed!! Otherwise it would be theft.

I have color coded questions to previously supplied answers & FMV isn't some wording they are pulling out of their butts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_market_value

 

I think you're expressing your opinions based on either:

- the "buy/sell" gap that exists in this hobby

- the belief that personal items shouldn't have a value determined by the market

 

It's hard to argue that either one are relevant when it comes to CGC proactively advising customers of their terms when publishing their price matrix & compelling all customers to agree to their terms on their submission form.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
The-Collector

The-Collector

Posted
  • Author
Posted
I think as long as you specify a value that can be reasonably justified and isn't ridiculously low, CGC won't nitpick it.

 

I think this is about spot-on. (thumbs u

 

Now you thnk it is spot on? On the prior page you stated that CGC made the dertermination AFTER the grading process.

 

Have you ever submitted a book for walk-through? Apparently not, so you are just hazarding guesses I assume.

 

He's more or less right.

 

You set a value of your own for insurance purposes in case your book gets damaged in CGC's possession.

 

If it's not ridiculously low, it usually goes through with the grading fee undisturbed.

 

If it's ridiculously low, they'll bump it to roughly fair market value after grading and charge the applicable grading fee.

 

 

 

What if you disagree with their value (overstreet/gpa/tea leaves) do they do they notify you of the new price (say you pay by check) so you can say no thanks (shrug) Seems to me that slabbing and if you could not or would not pay the shylock price would be a crime.

You're agreeing to this when you submit. The argument people are talking past each other on is that CGC isn't aggressive when it comes to soaking every penny from submitters who give reasonable prices that aren't "ridiculously low", like the "Hulk #1" example earlier.

 

***In the event that CGC, at its sole discretion, determines that the fair market value is higher than the value stated by the submitter, CGC will move the comic book to the appropriate higher tier and the additional charge will be the responsibility of the submitter.

http://www.cgccomics.com/services/Services.aspx

 

Right who can really determine the correct value... and don't you have the right to refuse the price increase. If you chose to not pay they Have to send the book back Ungraded and Unslabbed!! Otherwise it would be theft.

I have color coded questions to previously supplied answers & FMV isn't some wording they are pulling out of their butts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_market_value

 

I think you're expressing your opinions based on either:

- the "buy/sell" gap that exists in this hobby

- the belief that personal items shouldn't have a value determined by the market

 

It's hard to argue that either one are relevant when it comes to CGC proactively advising customers of their terms when publishing their price matrix & compelling all customers to agree to their terms on their submission form.

 

In Australia, my home, incorporation of a contractual term in a non contractual document like a receipt or submission form is usually ineffective. Dont know the legal position in Sarasota, just saying...

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
bababooey

bababooey

Posted
Posted

In Australia, my home, incorporation of a contractual term in a non contractual document like a receipt or submission form is usually ineffective. Dont know the legal position in Sarasota, just saying...

 

I tend to look at things from a customs perspective first, the value of an item (comic) that hasn't been sold is always a point of contention. I think a submission form is a purchase order (for services), so here's where I'd start if looking at it from your perspective.

(shrug)

Also, .Sarasota swamp-law would likely prevail :insane:

Link to comment
Share on other sites
The-Collector

The-Collector

Posted
  • Author
Posted

In Australia, my home, incorporation of a contractual term in a non contractual document like a receipt or submission form is usually ineffective. Dont know the legal position in Sarasota, just saying...

 

I tend to look at things from a customs perspective first, the value of an item (comic) that hasn't been sold is always a point of contention. I think a submission form is a purchase order (for services), so here's where I'd start if looking at it from your perspective.

(shrug)

Also, Sarasota swamp-law would likely prevail. :insane:

 

I might just be thick but I don't understand.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Ebel 1911

Ebel 1911

Posted
Posted

Seems to me this thread started as an interesting question and got some good responses and is now kind of like a study session for law school students debating theoretical possibilities if certain conditions exist.

 

What i get from the thread is if you are able to get your book then it sounds like a reasonable estimate based on your best view of the market price will be accepted by CGC. If they disagree with your estimate then they'll charge you what they believe is fair. Since they are based in Florida then the law would favor their stated submission criteria that you must agree to their pricing terms and if they think the FMV is very different than your idea then you'll be obligated to pay their price. But, it sounds like they are reasonable and if you make a good faith estimate then they are likely to agree to your price. 2c

 

Good luck with your purchase!

Link to comment
Share on other sites
The-Collector

The-Collector

Posted
  • Author
Posted
Seems to me this thread started as an interesting question and got some good responses and is now kind of like a study session for law school students debating theoretical possibilities if certain conditions exist.

 

What i get from the thread is if you are able to get your book then it sounds like a reasonable estimate based on your best view of the market price will be accepted by CGC. If they disagree with your estimate then they'll charge you what they believe is fair. Since they are based in Florida then the law would favor their stated submission criteria that you must agree to their pricing terms and if they think the FMV is very different than your idea then you'll be obligated to pay their price. But, it sounds like they are reasonable and if you make a good faith estimate then they are likely to agree to your price. 2c

 

Good luck with your purchase!

 

That is what I think.

 

I got lost when baba started talking about the standard form contract customs signs with commercial partners. Which has nothing to do with FMV and does not apply to importers.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Flaming_Telepath

Flaming_Telepath

Posted
Posted
I think as long as you specify a value that can be reasonably justified and isn't ridiculously low, CGC won't nitpick it.

 

I think this is about spot-on. (thumbs u

 

Now you thnk it is spot on? On the prior page you stated that CGC made the dertermination AFTER the grading process.

 

Have you ever submitted a book for walk-through? Apparently not, so you are just hazarding guesses I assume.

 

You misunderstand...and then you get sarcastic. Good work all round. :applause:

 

CGC obviously have to determine value after grading and nothing in my agreement with mycomicshop suggests anything different?

 

What are you reading that I didn't write?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
sufunk

sufunk

Posted
Posted

My memory is a little hazy but i'm pretty sure CGC only charged me $150 when i subbed my 8.5 X-Men 1. I sent it in with a lower end 8.0 FMV value on the form which would have only been right around the $150 fee. As a 8.5 though, 3% would have been more like $3-400. I know for a fact they didnt charge me that much and am 99% sure they only charged me the $150 hm

Link to comment
Share on other sites
bababooey

bababooey

Posted
Posted
My memory is a little hazy but i'm pretty sure CGC only charged me $150 when i subbed my 8.5 X-Men 1. I sent it in with a lower end 8.0 FMV value on the form which would have only been right around the $150 fee. As a 8.5 though, 3% would have been more like $3-400. I know for a fact they didnt charge me that much and am 99% sure they only charged me the $150 hm

My guess is that like any business, some of the administrative & billing decisions are made based on the customer's profile in their system.

 

A guy submitting the same book the same way on his first sub might get a fee bump, I don't think there's anything unusual about being a bit less diligent with this "we reserve the right" policy when dealing with repeat customers.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Go to topic listing