Consistency in grading??

[joecgcmaniac]

CGC should really provide those of us who use their service their "grading guide". Have it posted on line and if we want to print it we can, if changes are made, then they can amend whatever it may be (i.e. tape policy change). The company has been in business long enough it should be done.

 

 

So by your reasoning, Kentucky Fried Chicken should let the world know exactly what is in their secret herbs and seasonings? Coke should release their secret formula? Do you not know that there is such a thing as "proprietary information?" Companies are not usually in the habit of letting the world in on all their processes and procedures. Why should they provide information that would basically be a blueprint that a competitor could use to go in business against them?

 

The sense of entitlement in some people is pretty pathetic.

[Wall-Crawler]

I personally do not have any beef with CGC or their grading practices, yes you hear and read about the missteps here and there but as a whole, I think they do a pretty good job and so do most people, otherwise we wouldn't be using their service right?

 

I don't see what would be so bad with CGC releasing their standards. It would allow for their customers to make more informed decisions about what we submit and could help bring even more legitimacy to CGC (not that they need it) as their standards are 'out in the open' - Would not take away from the fact that they have dedicated and professional staff who are trained experts who are grading our books.

 

Then again, if they did release their standards, their would be endless threads about how a submitter thinks *their* grade is more consistent with the stated standards than what CGC actually graded the book.

 

Maybe the only win for CGC if they released their standards is they could probably make money if they released a "CGC Guide to Grading Comics".

 

Long story short, I see both sides of the story.

[rodan57]

CGC should really provide those of us who use their service their "grading guide". Have it posted on line and if we want to print it we can, if changes are made, then they can amend whatever it may be (i.e. tape policy change). The company has been in business long enough it should be done.

 

 

So by your reasoning, Kentucky Fried Chicken should let the world know exactly what is in their secret herbs and seasonings? Coke should release their secret formula? Do you not know that there is such a thing as "proprietary information?" Companies are not usually in the habit of letting the world in on all their processes and procedures. Why should they provide information that would basically be a blueprint that a competitor could use to go in business against them?

 

The sense of entitlement in some people is pretty pathetic.

 

I don't believe that the standards by which CGC grade their books is proprietary information. Knowing that three vs. four colour breaking tics on a spine reduces a grade by .5 doesn't give an advantage to a competitor.

 

How a slab is manufactured might better fall into that category.

 

I think that the standards are not released for two rather prosaic reasons.

 

1. It's fundamentally difficult to list all the various permutations and vagaries of how a grade is assigned.

 

2. Posting a set of grading standards, no matter how detailed and complex, leaves the CGC open to endless disputes from its customers.

 

 

The CGC offers a proscribed limited service and assigns a price to that particular service.

 

 

Besides a dedicated student of the CGC grading process can master the skills of a CGC grader given enough time and examples. (I cannot but many on this board can.) And this same student will also be sympathetic to human error or the gradual shifts from hard to soft grading practices.

 

p.s. I think it somewhat unfair to Spideymanfan73 to describe his desire for knowledge as a misplaced sense of entitlement. Wanting to know more about a process for which you pay is due diligence. It's just that a person may have to be satisfied with being unsuccessful in such a pursuit.

 

[Number 6]

Here's what muddies the water for me:

 

CGC is supposed to have their own set of grading standards unique to them. Fine.

 

But in the last few editions of the OS grading guide there are numerous pictures of CGC graded books to illustrate certain OS grades. That would seem to imply that CGC is grading by OS standards. Or at least there's a strong commonality between the two.

 

If they grade by OS standards why not just say that? If they truly have their own standard, why are CGC graded books being held up as an example of OS grading?

[FineCollector]

If they grade by OS standards why not just say that? If they truly have their own standard, why are CGC graded books being held up as an example of OS grading?

 

CGC is far more permissive than Overstreet, especially with regards to chipping, pieces missing, and rust, but everyone has their own grading standard. Pick up a CVM or a different price guide, and look at their grading rules. They've made their own. Overstreet is the grandpappy that everyone starts with, and interprets to their own liking.

 

To the OP: human error plays a factor. Someone I know bought a cheap 10.0 just to see what it looked like, and there were two small but discernable defects that should've disqualified it. It happens. If it bothers you that much, buy pre-graded books, or just stop looking at the numbers...

[TC33]

Overstreet was not worried about anyone copying their grading guide/standards, so I don't think that is CGC's problem for not releasing their standards, especially when CGC probably already borrowed 90% of what Overstreet had established for decades on grading. It is the sometimes inconsistent grading (an often subjective art) that is the problem. If they posted exact grading standards, customers would have strong support that some of their books were mis-graded compared to their posted grading standards. I am sure a company the size of CGC already gets plenty of complaints, so why would they want to open that pandora's box that would open with a posted list of grading standards. I know it is hard to get 100+ different graders on the same page, but based on some of the grading inconsistencies I have seen, at least some of those complaints would likely be justified, but it is harder to call and complain when they don't post the grading standards that they use.

[Wall-Crawler]

Perhaps if the published their standards and a customer felt very strongly there was an error in grade, they could submit an appeal and have a CGC Tribunal or Review Board convened that would review the book and possibly maintain or re-assign a grade...Of course, there would be a fee attached to such a service

 

[comixrkool-migration]

Lately Ive had quite a few concerns with their grading. Seems like the discrepancies have been more frequent over the past couple of years. I've stopped sending new and modern age books completely and only send in SA or Bonze age books at this point. And as for why we use CGC and not someone else? CGC is like the power company, they are the only true choice we have at this point. Until another large, credible option arrives we will have to continue to use them. I would use PGX but again, not a credible option in my opinion and books graded through them seem to be 25% less valuable.

[zosocane]

CGC is selling an opinion and a plastic slab. Nothing else. Read the back of one of their labels: "The assigned grade represents our opinion, as grading is subjective." That gives them a fair amount of latitude.

 

And I agree that CGC doesn't want to publish their grading standards, because it would be a clusterspoon if they did. They would be getting complaints constantly, their business would grind to a halt.

 

I think overall they are pretty consistent, when considering the thousands of submissions they process each year.

 

 

[comixrkool-migration]

Selling an opinion or not, it is a business and they need to stand by their opinion. Discrepancies are made so when this happens they need to fix it. They charge a decent fee for an opinion and a plastic case and last time I check CGC wasn't doing me a favor by grading my books, latitude or not. Going by your logic if they posted their grading standards so people were able to actually check their accuracy they would get to many complaints. hmmmmm.

.

[jimjum12]

Consistency.

 

 

Exactly, a freaking laughing joke. I no longer submit for the grade, just for restoration detection. Unfair grading practices and favoritism imo and experience.

There is no favoritism,or unfair grading practices.It's just a subjective art,one mans 9.6 may be anothers 9.0

 

..... Amen, brother. I'm a nobody in the grand scheme of things and have gotten grades that I thought were a little soft and a little tough..... but almost always within a half grade of my estimate, which, to me, is acceptable. Remember, they don't spend an hour grading each comic. To have graded 2 million comics and be as consistent as they've been is commendable. At the 9.0 and above level, with fractional increments, books can OFTEN go one way or the other. I'm not going to lie..... I purposely look for books that may have been slightly undergraded. When speaking to Borock at a show once, he said that his only regret with the grading tiers was not including one more level between 8.5 and 9.0..... since a lot of room is left at a level where the price can get significant. I personally LOVE books that are ALMOST a 9.0....... GOD BLESS...

 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus) (thumbs u

 

P.S. Grading is an art and not a science..... so there probably is no published CGC criteria.... in house or otherwise.

[Calidream'n]

Lately Ive had quite a few concerns with their grading. Seems like the discrepancies have been more frequent over the past couple of years. I've stopped sending new and modern age books completely and only send in SA or Bonze age books at this point. And as for why we use CGC and not someone else? CGC is like the power company, they are the only true choice we have at this point. Until another large, credible option arrives we will have to continue to use them. I would use PGX but again, not a credible option in my opinion and books graded through them seem to be 25% less valuable.

and at least 25% overgraded, especially if buying from DJBrady4U!

[Bomber-Bob]

 

I don't see what would be so bad with CGC releasing their standards.

 

 

The down side would be all the 'discussion' about the standards. Everyone would have an opinion for a change to those standards. I think CGC just wants to be left alone to grade and maybe that's not a bad thing.