What Wolverine owes to the Summer of '75?

[shadroch]

Could be. As I recall, I bought the Wolverine from a comic shop. Not sure where I bought the Hercules. Might have been from a newstand- hence thinking it came out a few weeks later.

Must admit I thought the Falcon mini came out not long after , and it turns out it was a full year.

[gsolol]

One of the reasons why it took so long for Wolverine to take off is because in the beginning when Dave Cockrum was doing the book he didn't like using Wolverine that much. His favorite character was Nightcrawler. It wasn't until John Byrne took over that he started to develop Wolverine and feature him more in the book.

[Logan510]

One of the reasons why it took so long for Wolverine to take off is because in the beginning when Dave Cockrum was doing the book he didn't like using Wolverine that much. His favorite character was Nightcrawler. It wasn't until John Byrne took over that he started to develop Wolverine and feature him more in the book.

 

The interesting thing is Claremont and Cockrum were about to write Wolverine out of the book and Byrne fought to keep the only Canadian character in the book being a Canadian himself at the time. Even more interesting is that Byrne has said if he knew what would've become of the book and the character he would tell his younger self to let them write him out of the book.

[gsolol]

One of the reasons why it took so long for Wolverine to take off is because in the beginning when Dave Cockrum was doing the book he didn't like using Wolverine that much. His favorite character was Nightcrawler. It wasn't until John Byrne took over that he started to develop Wolverine and feature him more in the book.

 

The interesting thing is Claremont and Cockrum were about to write Wolverine out of the book and Byrne fought to keep the only Canadian character in the book being a Canadian himself at the time. Even more interesting is that Byrne has said if he knew what would've become of the book and the character he would tell his younger self to let them write him out of the book.

 

Interesting, I never heard about that before.

[kidcolt]

I don't think he would have been as successful if he started in his own comic from the beginning (right after IH181). I think Wolverine and Xmen helped each other equally. I think Wolverine is popular from the X fans and I think Wolverine made the X title better and gave the writers and artist a lot more to work with. IMO WOlverine is now bigger and more important then the Xmen.

[Huskie-migration]

I don't think he would have been as successful if he started in his own comic from the beginning (right after IH181). I think Wolverine and Xmen helped each other equally. I think Wolverine is popular from the X fans and I think Wolverine made the X title better and gave the writers and artist a lot more to work with. IMO WOlverine is now bigger and more important then the Xmen.

 

I don't know if I'd agree with this last part. I would argue to the mainstream public the X-Men are the most iconic comic team. Now that might of changed with the Avengers movie but the X-Men have had several cartoons, the most different related comics on the stands (all through the 90s) of any franchise, a large toyline, several successful movies, etc.

 

Wolverine is iconic but the X-Men would survive without him.

[kidcolt]

I agree with you but would they be as popular? The movies are a result of the popularity maybe without Wolverine they might not have been so popular and maybe no movie. However the cartoons were awesome. I think both certainly benefited from each other just like the Avengers movies are benefitting from the popularity of the ironman franchise

 

I don't think he would have been as successful if he started in his own comic from the beginning (right after IH181). I think Wolverine and Xmen helped each other equally. I think Wolverine is popular from the X fans and I think Wolverine made the X title better and gave the writers and artist a lot more to work with. IMO WOlverine is now bigger and more important then the Xmen.

 

I don't know if I'd agree with this last part. I would argue to the mainstream public the X-Men are the most iconic comic team. Now that might of changed with the Avengers movie but the X-Men have had several cartoons, the most different related comics on the stands (all through the 90s) of any franchise, a large toyline, several successful movies, etc.

 

Wolverine is iconic but the X-Men would survive without him.

[Loki]

As far as it taking so long for him to get his own series, in the early 80s the mini series was still a new concept. Contest of Champions in 1982 was (I believe) the first for Marvel and DC had done a couple before that. Until then, the only option was for characters to be given their own book instead of a mini type "tryout"

 

Actually, there was the Marvel Spotlight / Marvel Premiere / Marvel Feature style of book that was used through the early 70s to introduce solo adventures of existing characters as well as trial runs for new characters. By the late 70s those started being phased out in favor of starting all sorts of short-lived solo series and mini-series titles.

[Dr. Balls]

Even more interesting is that Byrne has said if he knew what would've become of the book and the character he would tell his younger self to let them write him out of the book.

 

That is an incredibly short-sighted comment, even for John Byrne. Granted, Wolverine may not be what Byrne intended, but I'm surprised he could ignore the character's contributions to the comic industry.

 

I'm sure collectors can constantly cite the fact that Wolverine ended up in half of every book published in the 90's, but that was a result of his popularity. And his popularity made money. Yes, the 90's crashed and burned the comics industry, but it's recovered, and Wolverine continues to enamor young audiences, helping to convert their interest in the character into comic-themed content and licensed products.

 

The character Wolverine makes money, raises awareness of the hobby and is a constant contributing factor to the continuing popularity of comic books. I wonder what other grandiose plan for Wolverine was John Byrne thinking would be better for the character?

[Crimebuster]

I have one rule in life that has served me very well so far: Never listen to anything John Byrne has to say.

[bronze johnny]

Agreed- which results in "getting Byrned."

[vaillant]

Well, I don’t know what Byrne had in mind, but surely Wolverine has been hugely banalized in the last 20 years or so…

I understand your commercial observations, Balls, but I still think that by leaning towards "commercial" aspects (which are pretty obscure, and often misleading) you lose sight of the fact that it is inherent quality and integrity in the stories & characters development which make up for their continued success.

 

Personally, I would have had the character age to some point, instead of tossing out absurdities like that Spider-Man storyline…

[Darkowl]

I really like this question, and it's definitely a difficult one to answer. Part of me wants to say that the X-Men exploded because of Wolverine, and another part of me wants to say the opposite. If you read the early Uncanny X-Men issues, you'll see that Wolverine was by no means a star character. In fact, it seemed like they were trying to push Cyclops into being that center ring character. What happened, however, is that more people liked Wolverine. He was an anti-hero, and people responded really well to that. I'm sure Marvel received a ton of fan mail letters asking there to be a solo Wolverine series. Needless to say, their wish was granted.

 

What's interesting is that there are a lot of X-Men fans now who are Wolverine haters. Take the All New X-Men for example, Wolverine seems to be a side character, and the story has focused more on Cyclops. Are we seeing a full circle here?

[DiceX]

Even more interesting is that Byrne has said if he knew what would've become of the book and the character he would tell his younger self to let them write him out of the book.

 

That is an incredibly short-sighted comment, even for John Byrne. Granted, Wolverine may not be what Byrne intended, but I'm surprised he could ignore the character's contributions to the comic industry.

 

I'm sure collectors can constantly cite the fact that Wolverine ended up in half of every book published in the 90's, but that was a result of his popularity. And his popularity made money. Yes, the 90's crashed and burned the comics industry, but it's recovered, and Wolverine continues to enamor young audiences, helping to convert their interest in the character into comic-themed content and licensed products.

 

The character Wolverine makes money, raises awareness of the hobby and is a constant contributing factor to the continuing popularity of comic books. I wonder what other grandiose plan for Wolverine was John Byrne thinking would be better for the character?

 

John Byrne is nuttier than a port-a-pottie at the Planters factory.

Every time I hear some comment he made I hear a chicken clucking in my mind.

 

There's disconnection with reality...and then there's John Byrne waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay the hell on the other side of that.

 

 

[Logan510]

Even more interesting is that Byrne has said if he knew what would've become of the book and the character he would tell his younger self to let them write him out of the book.

 

That is an incredibly short-sighted comment, even for John Byrne. Granted, Wolverine may not be what Byrne intended, but I'm surprised he could ignore the character's contributions to the comic industry.

 

I'm sure collectors can constantly cite the fact that Wolverine ended up in half of every book published in the 90's, but that was a result of his popularity. And his popularity made money. Yes, the 90's crashed and burned the comics industry, but it's recovered, and Wolverine continues to enamor young audiences, helping to convert their interest in the character into comic-themed content and licensed products.

 

The character Wolverine makes money, raises awareness of the hobby and is a constant contributing factor to the continuing popularity of comic books. I wonder what other grandiose plan for Wolverine was John Byrne thinking would be better for the character?

 

You don't have to wonder, just go to his web forum and ask him

[rjpb]

Wolverine may have the distinction of being the greatest character to have a 1st appearance in one Age while getting his own ongoing series in another!

 

Punisher is another prime example of this. Granted, he's no longer in the same league as Wolverine but for a time he was supporting three monthly series and guest-starring in every other book.

 

Not bad for a b-list villain/Dirty Harry rip-off who only took off after an epic solo mini-series 12 years later.

 

Frank Miller probably had some influence in popularizing The Punisher via Daredevil 182-184 and ASM Annual 15, but the miniseries still didn't come until four years later.

 

The Punisher was pretty much a direct rip-off of the Executioner pulp novel series.

[shadroch]

Wolverine may have the distinction of being the greatest character to have a 1st appearance in one Age while getting his own ongoing series in another!

 

Punisher is another prime example of this. Granted, he's no longer in the same league as Wolverine but for a time he was supporting three monthly series and guest-starring in every other book.

 

Not bad for a b-list villain/Dirty Harry rip-off who only took off after an epic solo mini-series 12 years later.

 

Frank Miller probably had some influence in popularizing The Punisher via Daredevil 182-184 and ASM Annual 15, but the miniseries still didn't come until four years later.

 

The Punisher was pretty much a direct rip-off of the Executioner pulp novel series.

 

 

Stan Lee created The Executioner.

Wrote the first 100 novels before handing it off to a team of hacks.

[shadroch]

As far as it taking so long for him to get his own series, in the early 80s the mini series was still a new concept. Contest of Champions in 1982 was (I believe) the first for Marvel and DC had done a couple before that. Until then, the only option was for characters to be given their own book instead of a mini type "tryout"

 

Actually, there was the Marvel Spotlight / Marvel Premiere / Marvel Feature style of book that was used through the early 70s to introduce solo adventures of existing characters as well as trial runs for new characters. By the late 70s those started being phased out in favor of starting all sorts of short-lived solo series and mini-series titles.

 

There were no mini-series until 1982.

Marvel Feature ended before Hulk 181, becoming Marvel Two in One- a book that featured The Thing co-starring with another hero every issue.

Off-hand, the only character can think of that was an established player that got an issue of either of those other two books were The Warriors Three. I certainly don't recall every character in every issue, but thats my overall memory. i'll look in Overstreet later, to see what I missed.

[Crimebuster]

As far as it taking so long for him to get his own series, in the early 80s the mini series was still a new concept. Contest of Champions in 1982 was (I believe) the first for Marvel and DC had done a couple before that. Until then, the only option was for characters to be given their own book instead of a mini type "tryout"

 

Actually, there was the Marvel Spotlight / Marvel Premiere / Marvel Feature style of book that was used through the early 70s to introduce solo adventures of existing characters as well as trial runs for new characters. By the late 70s those started being phased out in favor of starting all sorts of short-lived solo series and mini-series titles.

 

There were no mini-series until 1982.

Marvel Feature ended before Hulk 181, becoming Marvel Two in One- a book that featured The Thing co-starring with another hero every issue.

Off-hand, the only character can think of that was an established player that got an issue of either of those other two books were The Warriors Three. I certainly don't recall every character in every issue, but thats my overall memory. i'll look in Overstreet later, to see what I missed.

 

Nick Fury was in Marvel Spotlight #31. Black Panther had a three issue (I think) tryout in Marvel Premiere. There was also the Legion of Monsters, which was made up of established characters. And Marvel Premiere featured Dr. Strange from #3-14 as well.

[Logan510]

John Byrne posted something interesting on this topic today on his message board for anyone inclined to go and look.