Answer from CGC.........

[jkrk]

I purposely stayed away from posting my views until I can see which way the wind was blowing. It seems most posters are not too happy to see CGc enter the pressing business. I admit that I will have to take the other side from a selfish point of view. I have two main points: 1) Looking at the census for ASM 1, I observed 20 books graded 9.0 or above. Let's say all books can be pressed then maybe the number doubles to twenty? Sure it's a problem for high grade collectors as prices slip. I'm a lower/mid grade collector. If books in my collecting grade are pressed some will upgrade. That leaves fewer books available in the grade I collect. Ultimately there could be a shortage of VG+ books. The price will clearly rise as mainstream colllectors find my grade in short supply. There will be no trick in finding higher grade copies so the scarcity value diminishes. They'll be a dime a dozen. Who'll have a corner on the lower grades? Soon everyone will be begging for my copies at any price. If I'm in a good mood maybe I'll let a copy out to tease the markets? 2)When I send in books to CGC to be pressed I can also send in my shirts. Therefore I pay only 1 freight charge. Do I have to insure my shirts?

[The Brain]

I purposely stayed away from posting my views until I can see which way the wind was blowing. It seems most posters are not too happy to see CGc enter the pressing business. I admit that I will have to take the other side from a selfish point of view. I have two main points: 1) Looking at the census for ASM 1, I observed 20 books graded 9.0 or above. Let's say all books can be pressed then maybe the number doubles to twenty? Sure it's a problem for high grade collectors as prices slip. I'm a lower/mid grade collector. If books in my collecting grade are pressed some will upgrade. That leaves fewer books available in the grade I collect. Ultimately there could be a shortage of VG+ books. The price will clearly rise as mainstream colllectors find my grade in short supply. There will be no trick in finding higher grade copies so the scarcity value diminishes. They'll be a dime a dozen. Who'll have a corner on the lower grades? Soon everyone will be begging for my copies at any price. If I'm in a good mood maybe I'll let a copy out to tease the markets? 2)When I send in books to CGC to be pressed I can also send in my shirts. Therefore I pay only 1 freight charge. Do I have to insure my shirts?

 

OH....OH....OH.....THIS IS TO FUNNY, BUT YOU FORGOT THIS: : ..............................

[lou_fine]

 

Jim

 

Boy, I can't believe you guys are complaining about THESE ads. They are going to look like bargain basement deals in comparison to the new ads coming out from the new CGC pressing company.

 

I can just imagine what the price multiples are going to show for pre-pressed CGC 7.5 books in comparison to the post-pressed CGC 9.4 books. No doubt the ads will also specify that the book is completely untouched and unrestored.

[Red Hook]

[blowout]

No doubt the ads will also specify that the book is completely untouched and unrestored.

 

Not sure about the untouched part, but certainly the unrestored part...

[drbanner]

I have waited a few days before posting because I was hoping to be able to tell you a finalized decision about the hot board topic of the week. I am also posting a new thread so no one has to wade through all the other posts to get to my reply.

 

A few months ago, Chris Friesen informed Mark Haspel and me that at some point he will be leaving CGC to open up a new collectibles service. Chris said that while at first his primary focus will be on comic books, eventually he will be working with other collectibles as well. He told us that his departure has nothing to do with any problems with CGC, as he loves this company, enjoys the work he does, and really likes the people he works with. Chris said that it was purely a personal decision; he wants to do something more challenging with his time.

 

When Chris made this known to the owners of the Certified Collectibles Group, they asked Chris if he would like to establish his new business under the Certified Collectibles Group banner of companies. At this point in time, Chris and Steve Eichenbaum (CEO of the Certified Collectibles Group) are still negotiating to see if this will work.

 

I don’t know everything yet, but I can tell you some things:

 

I (at CGC) have been a part of the Certified Collectibles Group for almost six years now and have the utmost confidence in the honesty, integrity, ethics, and professionalism of the heads of the company; Steve Eichenbaum and Mark Salzberg. The mission statement of the Certified Collectibles Group is to provide a wide range of services to the collectibles industry and to make sure that whatever services are offered are in the best interest of the industry. If they agree to undertake another venture, it will be done correctly and above board. The Certified Collectibles Group is a services company (NGC, NCS, SGC, CGC) and will be adding many other services under their company banner in the next few years. This new company would be just one of them.

 

In the discussions I have had with Chris, there are a few things that have come up. The most important is that if Chris‘s new venture is under the Certified Collectibles Group banner, it will have to be completely separate from CGC as all the companies of the Certified Collectibles Group are independent of one another. Books submitted to CGC will not be evaluated for the service that Chris’s new venture will provide and Chris will not send his customers’ books to CGC once his work is finished. Nor can books be transferred between companies as they are not one and the same. The comic or comics will go directly back to the customer, not to CGC. Nobody who uses the service Chris provides will be told to send their books to CGC. Will we recommend Chris when people ask? Of course, but we would do that anyway. Chris is the best at what he does, that is why we hired him in the first place. If Chris does not become part of the Certified Collectibles Group, we will still recommend him to anyone who asks. Chris has the same honesty, integrity, ethics, and professionalism as the people who run the Certified Collectibles Group do.

 

If this becomes a reality, as usual, a more official statement from CGC and/or the Certified Collectibles Group will be released.

 

I am sure you will have many questions after this has been posted and I will try to answer some of the ones I can over the weekend.

 

Have a great weekend,

Steve

 

Apparently this has become a reality, but where's the more official statement from CGC and/or the Certified Collectibles Group?

[Red Hook]

Thanks for the bump.

[scourge456789-migration]

I agree with the statement that this is untawdry and akin to selling Burglar supplies and house alarms under the same roof. Looks bad.

[comicworm]

I don't mean to sound rude or disconcerning-but to be honest, I like most high end high grade collectors-don't care! I can't speak for all my fellow high end collectors-but I and most others barely even knew about these boards and most of us, me being the exception, rarely have time to look at them let alone post.

 

I will say-it doesn't bother me at all-I wish him well in his new venture...

 

I don't see if negatively effecting the market that much-I have heard such and such will cause a "crash", etc. etc. for years now-nothing has happened...

 

yes-some people are still looking for signs of the end of the world too-quoting the bible everywhere they go...good luck to them and God Bless them....

[sborock]

Not really going to get into a big Q & A about this because I HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS NEW COMPANY. But if I know you all as well as I think I do, without any answer, we will just have more "yadda yadda yadda" and CGC/CCG haters will have more misinformation to spread until others believe it as fact.

 

Yes, Chris is one of my best friends and we do talk at dinner (though, believe it or not, we don't talk that much about business) so from my understanding, the "official announcement" that will come from either the CCG (Certified Collectibles Group) or the PCS (Paper Collectibles Services, the new service) will probably be sent out in a form letter to the clients who PCS wants to "invite" to become customers because, if I understand it correctly, Friesen does not want to take in too much work at the begining so that he does not get overwhelmed with work. This way his work will be up to the high standards he has always held himself to by not having to rush his work and so that he can get books back to his customers in a reasonable amount of time.

[Flaming_Telepath]

I don't mean to sound rude or disconcerning-but to be honest, I like most high end high grade collectors-don't care! I can't speak for all my fellow high end collectors-but I and most others barely even knew about these boards and most of us, me being the exception, rarely have time to look at them let alone post.

 

I will say-it doesn't bother me at all-I wish him well in his new venture...

 

I don't see if negatively effecting the market that much-I have heard such and such will cause a "crash", etc. etc. for years now-nothing has happened...

 

yes-some people are still looking for signs of the end of the world too-quoting the bible everywhere they go...good luck to them and God Bless them....

 

I'm sorry, but just because you don't care, doesn't mean that you're actually representative of 'high end high grade collectors'. Many of the people hear who object to pressing are precisely that. Many people who I sell to are precisely that, and they certainly care.

 

You don't care...fine. Your choice. However, the line of thinking that goes 'well I don't care and Billy doesn't care and Joe doesn't even know about it' does not represent the worldwide market. However, I like to think that the board does represent the worldwide market, with all of its nationalities and collecting fetishes...and it appears that there are a whole load of people lined up on both sides of the fence.

 

And you're one of the ones that don't care. As I said, fine.

 

However, let me lay out four little scenarios for you, and ask whether you'd care if either of these came to pass...

 

(1) Ten years down the road, you decide to sell your high grade ASM #1 and the prospective buyer asks that, as it's in a CGC slab, he wants it to be submitted to the highly respected RD&CG company (Restoration Detection & Company Grading) for confirmation that it is what it says on the label. They examine it and slap it with a Restored label...' book pressed'...it says, because they can do that in 2015, because they now have the technology.

 

(2) You have an ASM #1 in 9.2. It's much sought after when you buy it, and you pay top dollar for it. There's only 11 on the census when you buy it. 12 months on, there's 31. Two years down the line, there's 77. After the ten years, there's actually 571 copies and they guide at $1,200. You can't even sell it for that much, because eBay has more ASM #1s listed every week than Neat Stuff currently manage in total listings!

 

(3) The people who don't agree with pressing vote with their wallets and get out of the high end market, instead looking around for nice VFs and VF+s. Half the market for a high end ASM #1 disappears almost overnight. Values tumble. And remember, you paid top dollar for yours.

 

(4) You wake up one morning, feel like checking in with your little baby, pull the slabbed ASM #1 out of the darkened closet...and discover that the spine looks a bit skewed. Actually, it looks a lot skewed. Actually, it appears to have a horrible, pronounced spine-roll that make it look like a rolled-up newspaper. And remember, you paid top dollar for it.

 

Now, if you're happy and fine with any of these scenarios coming true, then you're fine with pressing. If, however, any of these scenarios scare you a little bit, maybe make your palms sweat just a touch, you need to perhaps consider your standpoint.

 

But if you still say you're not bothered...fine, that's your choice.

 

Just don't come back in ten years and complain, because I'll tell you I told you so.

[Red Hook]

Not really going to get into a big Q & A about this because I HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS NEW COMPANY. But if I know you all as well as I think I do, without any answer, we will just have more "yadda yadda yadda" and CGC/CCG haters will have more misinformation to spread until others believe it as fact.

 

Yes, Chris is one of my best friends and we do talk at dinner (though, believe it or not, we don't talk that much about business) so from my understanding, the "official announcement" that will come from either the CCG (Certified Collectibles Group) or the PCS (Paper Collectibles Services, the new service) will probably be sent out in a form letter to the clients who PCS wants to "invite" to become customers because, if I understand it correctly, Friesen does not want to take in too much work at the begining so that he does not get overwhelmed with work. This way his work will be up to the high standards he has always held himself to by not having to rush his work and so that he can get books back to his customers in a reasonable amount of time.

 

Will he publicize who his clients are, or will you guys continue to act covertly?

[awe4one]

So who's CGC resto expert now?

 

Jim

[Red Hook]

 

Will he publicize who his clients are, or will you guys continue to act covertly?

 

 

Actually, I know the answer, because if the clients were publicized the whole shebang would tumble like a house of cards. As long as CGC has "deniablity", and the big clients maintain anonymity, the cash cow will keep mooing.

 

Steve, again....this is a TERRIBLE TERRIBLE idea.

[awe4one]

Yes, Chris is one of my best friends and we do talk at dinner (though, believe it or not, we don't talk that much about business) so from my understanding, the "official announcement" that will come from either the CCG (Certified Collectibles Group) or the PCS (Paper Collectibles Services,the new service) will probably be sent out in a form letter to the clients who PCS wants to "invite" to become customers because, if I understand it correctly, Friesen does not want to take in too much work at the begining so that he does not get overwhelmed with work.

 

Who decides who gets the letter or not? Customers who've expressed an interest or requested their comics be pressed in the past? Have some safeguards been considered or unofficial feelers been put out there so you aren't sending a pressing service offer to someone who might be seriously offended?

 

Jim

[Red Hook]

Yes, Chris is one of my best friends and we do talk at dinner (though, believe it or not, we don't talk that much about business) so from my understanding, the "official announcement" that will come from either the CCG (Certified Collectibles Group) or the PCS (Paper Collectibles Services,the new service) will probably be sent out in a form letter to the clients who PCS wants to "invite" to become customers because, if I understand it correctly, Friesen does not want to take in too much work at the begining so that he does not get overwhelmed with work.

 

Who decides who gets the letter or not? Customers who've expressed an interest or requested their comics be pressed in the past? Have some safeguards been considered or unofficial feelers been put out there so you aren't sending a pressing service offer to someone who might be seriously offended?

 

Jim

 

Trust me Jim, the letters are not coming our way.

[awe4one]

Trust me Jim, the letters are not coming our way.

 

Oh I know...just wondering how they know who to send letters to beforehand...

 

Jim

[comicworm]

or you guys could just buy raw and hope for the best....either way were back at the beginning...

[comicworm]

No offense-but 15 years down the road-they still will not be able to tell wether a book was pressed or sitting under a pile of books for 15 years!

 

Use common sense people! Back at the beginning again!

[comicworm]

I guess all you guys who are bothered by pressing are just going to have to find another high end hobby....

 

I hear coin collecting is fine....

 

Last I checked, and I do aollect coins as well, you cannot press a coin!

 

Good luck to you all!