Was this a steal?

[tth2]

What was I missing here? CGC 9.6 Detective 315 just sold on eBay for barely over 1X Guide?! This is a major title and is an issue from 1963! With white pages!

 

I just put in a tracking bid equal to the 9.2 Guide price, even though I don't collect Batman titles, because I rarely see early SA Detectives (or any DCs) in this kind of grade for sale. I was amazed when I saw what it just went for. When I saw almost no movement going into the final hours, I was almost tempted to put in a "real" bid to really try to win it cheap, and then flip it. But I don't know enough about the Batman market and was afraid of getting burned.

 

Opinions? Was this just bad timing, bad luck, bad seller, or what? Or is this the standard type of price that a 9.6 pre-1964 DC SA book goes for these days?

[Silver Surfer]

How was the printing numbers back in the day. Did DC have the same kind of print numbers/issues (I suspect not) that Marvel did pre-1965? I guess what I'm asking is it harder to find high grade DC's pre-1965 than it is for Marvel's?

[tth2]

How was the printing numbers back in the day. Did DC have the same kind of print numbers/issues (I suspect not) that Marvel did pre-1965? I guess what I'm asking is it harder to find high grade DC's pre-1965 than it is for Marvel's?

 

I have no idea what the print numbers were. Is it relevant? Print runs of many GA titles were much bigger than SA and modern runs, and yet fewer copies survived in NM and NM+ grades. The general consensus on these boards, however, is that pre-1965 DCs are much harder to find than pre-1965 Marvels.

 

In any event, I'm hoping for comments from members who are familiar with the Batman market, particularly HG SA market. I'm just curious whether this is an anomaly or commonplace, or whether 'Tec #315 is the ASM 33 or DD 9 of the Batman world. The census shows 2 9.6 copies and 1 9.4, but I don't know Batmans well enough to know whether this is considered to be a fairly common issue in high grade.

[drdonaldblake]

tim

 

that was a cheap buy compared with other 9.6 prices

 

tecs and bats late 50's and early 60's in 9.2 or better are very tough but theyre just filler issues........................nothing especially key aobut them or even classic covers...hence low demand

 

i sold a 9.2 tec 298, 1st modern clayface in 2000 for a little over 2.5 guide.........which was a steal @ the time.........given that cgc 9.2's were getting sometimes 3-4 x guide

[Zonker]

tim

 

that was a cheap buy compared with other 9.6 prices

 

tecs and bats late 50's and early 60's in 9.2 or better are very tough but theyre just filler issues........................nothing especially key aobut them or even classic covers...hence low demand

 

 

See, I think that's it exactly. Though I don't play in the uber-high-grade arena, I do have a nice mid-grade Silver DC collection put together over the last couple of decades. It would never occur to me to chase any of the 1960s pre-Julie Schwartz Batman or Detectives. That's the space alien / giant robot period when Sheldon Moldoff was ghosting all of Bob Kane's stuff.

 

I know the readers' market is different than the 9.6 slab market, but it stands to reason the underlying demand for the latter is driven by the former.

[Aman619]

this sale price is the voice of sanity in the market. Finally a high-fallutin' 9.6 copy of a filler issue gets no bump from its almighty 9.6 label!. I feel bad for the seller of course who must have expected the usual 6x Guide sale, but really, only Detective completists want this issue and theres no need to get it in 9.6 if you have to pay a huge premium to do so. Just MHO.

 

So Im wondering if the buyer feels he saved $300 or so and is really worth way more than he paid, and will flip it?

[sfilosa]

I think he got a steal.

 

Probably put the book on a consignment site and double his money easily.

[blazingbob]

spoken like a true dealer.

 

Pssst, Steve you are blowing your Collector cover.

[g-man]

I think he got a steal.

 

Probably put the book on a consignment site and double his money easily.

 

[sfilosa]

spoken like a true dealer.

 

Pssst, Steve you are blowing your Collector cover.

 

I readily admit that I sell some books. But if I told you how much I spent on "COLLECTION BOOKS" vs. books that I try to FLIP, I'm still firmly in the COLLECTOR CAMP.

[Forbush-Man]

I'd say it was a very good buy.

 

Probably could have gotten more for the book though if the seller had listed it with a bigger scan.

[COI]

Besides the fact that it's filler, most Detective completionists probably wouldn't bother with it because it's too much of an anomoly. If you have a run of FN - VF late 50's and early 60's issues, why throw a 9.6 in there? It dosen't fit. If you'll never have a 9.4/9.6 run, why bother with a non-key 9.6? It would be like having a VG run of ASM's, and buying a 9.8 copy of #95.

[Aman619]

thats what I was trying to say. touche'

[tth2]

Besides the fact that it's filler, most Detective completionists probably wouldn't bother with it because it's too much of an anomoly. If you have a run of FN - VF late 50's and early 60's issues, why throw a 9.6 in there? It dosen't fit. If you'll never have a 9.4/9.6 run, why bother with a non-key 9.6? It would be like having a VG run of ASM's, and buying a 9.8 copy of #95.

 

What is with the bias against "filler" issues? You guys make it sound like there's something wrong with buying high grade copies of non-keys. There's plenty of Marvel fillers, but I don't see this same kind of offhand dismissal when owners put up their nice "filler" copies on display here.

 

COI, regarding your second point, I really don't follow your reasoning. First, surely there are some high grade Detective completists out there? Or people aspiring to have a high grade run? If not, at this kind of price, there should be! Second, there seem to be plenty of GA collectors who as a matter of being practical buy Fs or VFs, but when they get an opportunity to snap up a 9.4 or higher at a decent price, they'll pull the trigger.

 

For the record, please feel free to send me all your 9.4 or better non-key "filler" issues of pre-1965 JLA, Atom, Showcase, B&B, Flash, GL, etc. etc., and I'll happily take them off your hands. Heck, I'll even pay a whole 2X Guide for 9.6 issues!

[Zonker]

I was making a different argument. Basically, I think the immediately pre-327 issues of Detective and immediately pre-164 issues of Batman are drastically over-valued in Overstreet. That's a period that relatively few collectors are chasing, IMHO. And as noted above, these are all pre-Infantino covers, so even the eye-appeal of the slabbed books is I think less than the contemporary Flash, GL, JLA issues.

 

I'd go so far as to say that the pre-New Look Bat-books ought to be priced similarly to the pre-Doom Patrol issues of My Greatest Adventure, or the pre-Thor JIMS: roughly 1/2 of the price of the later, more collectible issues.

 

Feel free to correct me if there is sales data to the contrary-- I'm just offering a possible explanation for this particular auction based on my own DC collecting bias!

[JohnBull]

I was making a different argument. Basically, I think the immediately pre-327 issues of Detective and immediately pre-164 issues of Batman are drastically over-valued in Overstreet. That's a period that relatively few collectors are chasing, IMHO.

 

Yes, I think 50's and 60's Detectives have never really been that sought after and struggle to make guide. I'm like you, a large collection of SA-DC over the years, but I find this stuff almost unreadable. Bad stories, bad art and bad covers.

 

Given the general difficulty in this material, I imagine that this book is as likely to make a collection for curiosities sake, rather than as part of someones attempt to put together a solid, high grade Detective run from this period.

[blazingbob]

The problem with your argument is that pre 1961 Batman's and Detective's in High grade are extremely difficult to find. There aren't that many high grade copies found.

 

What sales figures do you need as proof? Mine/Metropolis?

[Zonker]

Hey Bob, no argument on the supply side. I was just speculating on why there might be even less demand to soak up that supply. If you've been successful getting excellent prices for Bat books of this vintage, I stand corrected!

 

(But any speculation on why the auction in question seemed to fetch a low price?)

[burntboy]

Besides the fact that it's filler, most Detective completionists probably wouldn't bother with it because it's too much of an anomoly. If you have a run of FN - VF late 50's and early 60's issues, why throw a 9.6 in there? It dosen't fit. If you'll never have a 9.4/9.6 run, why bother with a non-key 9.6? It would be like having a VG run of ASM's, and buying a 9.8 copy of #95.

 

What is with the bias against "filler" issues? You guys make it sound like there's something wrong with buying high grade copies of non-keys. There's plenty of Marvel fillers, but I don't see this same kind of offhand dismissal when owners put up their nice "filler" copies on display here.

 

COI, regarding your second point, I really don't follow your reasoning. First, surely there are some high grade Detective completists out there? Or people aspiring to have a high grade run? If not, at this kind of price, there should be! Second, there seem to be plenty of GA collectors who as a matter of being practical buy Fs or VFs, but when they get an opportunity to snap up a 9.4 or higher at a decent price, they'll pull the trigger.

 

For the record, please feel free to send me all your 9.4 or better non-key "filler" issues of pre-1965 JLA, Atom, Showcase, B&B, Flash, GL, etc. etc., and I'll happily take them off your hands. Heck, I'll even pay a whole 2X Guide for 9.6 issues!

 

i'm sure we'll be talking in 4 months when my HG run of NON-KEY DC's begin to get returned from CGC. i better have some 9.4's in there....................

[tth2]

i'm sure we'll be talking in 4 months when my HG run of NON-KEY DC's begin to get returned from CGC. i better have some 9.4's in there....................

 

And I stand by my offer of paying a whole 2X OS for any 9.6s!