BATMAN THE KILLING JOKE 2 2

[TJ Radford]

Hello Aszumilo.

Yesterday (October 16) I received a 4th printing Killing Joke without the back cover text from a Canadian seller. Inside was no BOMC text. That is 2 for me and one drom Canada that Stronguy has. I did some looking, and found an article on The Canadian Encyclopedia on book clubs. According to it, BOMC had 100,000 members in Canada in 1987. Also, the Book Club Division of Doubleday Canada had 250,000 members in 1987. Could Doubleday bee the source of the copies without BOMC text?

And let us throw some more gasoline on this fire. A few months ago, I received a 4th BOMC as part of a 2 book lot. The other was a copy of the Batman Year One trade 2nd printing. Something struck me as odd about it. I couldn’t find a price anywhere. So I looked on the publication information page, and there is the BOMC text. So I looked through the Ebay listings and found 4 copies that had no price, including one from Canada. I ordered them and waited. The first two had BOMC text. The third came from Shenksville, PA, and did not have the BOMC text. And when the Canadian book came, it too did not have the BOMC text. I will try to get pictures to post at some point, if I could figure out how to get my phone to hook up to e-mail.

I have searched for book club edition of the Year One trade, and not have found anything. Two brand new 35 year old books. Maybe. So, should we be trying to find a list of DC trades from the late 80’s\early 90’s, and checking Ebay listings for unpriced copies? A whole new collecting area. Get in on the ground floor. I wonder if any of the early DC Archives got the book club treatment? Someone else can go down that rabbit hole.

 

[aszumilo]

I'm still hunting for one of those non BOMC books.  I thought I found one, but, it was a BOMC version.  We (me and RMA) tried reaching out to BOMC to see if they could give us any info on the KJ books, but, we got no repsonse.

Very interesting on the Year One book.  So far we only found the Killing Joke BOMC

 

Edited November 5, 2023 by aszumilo

[aszumilo]

I just got one of the non-BOMC books in the mail today.  Now to figure out where it came from.

Nothing in the e-bay ad mentioned anything, but, it didn't have the price and mature warning on the back cover, so, I took a chance.  Took a long time to get one, but, seems they (and the BOMC edition) are popping up more frequently lately.

[aszumilo]

Looks like CGC is starting to recognize the Newsstand editions.  Found this auction on E-Bay, where the label states 6th Printing Newsstand Edition.  Looks like I need to resubmit my newssatnd editions.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/404620838271?hash=item5e3548057f:g:pjMAAOSwBOdlOXBg&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA8N6Gprb%2BdympOEKtAPp%2BGY0wITeAMfv3fZGeUhL7IUfOcL8AfodlxdfUxzSnfrKEtwxNoVzDbsKdpJxgit1Y6N7iicfTQX24Sk5vBF0LAErLbHJwSoDt52mJxFTsmEJnDhUGHu8Lo5Lvz15XnPoSEbK%2Bfr1ExXHMx5bWUG6xs98pGM%2Futc2I3GQ5Q7SUeEXaCl9grdcuQkszitwnqt8uqRdHXpoE56ako0VVd2sN4Uz%2F42ENYaogKeQ1z9MiipKMqPz%2FmqGml5Xiwy%2FWpPrwuCl%2FDrycuiw5CXFLKwao7GOUqBpnSvXCkKaMVxNCKkL4bw%3D%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR9bYueuDYw

[Jesse-Lee]

Won this lot for $100 on eBay (schmutz/scratches are on the mylars, not the books themselves):

 

First Oracle:

 

Killing Joke Tie-in

[aszumilo]

@Jesse-Lee They look pretty good, but, hard to gauge a grade for them with those bags.  That Killing Joke 6th print is a newsstand edition.  It is the only printing that has a bar code on the front cover.  CGC is now labeling it as a newsstand (as I saw an auction for one that is labeled "Newsstand"), but, don't have a slot for it in the registry set.  It was told to me that it will go into the regular (direct) edition slot.

[Jesse-Lee]

On 12/15/2023 at 10:32 PM, aszumilo said:

@Jesse-Lee They look pretty good, but, hard to gauge a grade for them with those bags.  That Killing Joke 6th print is a newsstand edition.  It is the only printing that has a bar code on the front cover.  CGC is now labeling it as a newsstand (as I saw an auction for one that is labeled "Newsstand"), but, don't have a slot for it in the registry set.  It was told to me that it will go into the regular (direct) edition slot.

They're much nicer out of the bags, but a little bit of finger smudges, color rub, etc. The newsstand has a small bend issue on the top-left back cover, and a couple have some spots like a bindery issue on the spine, but in general very good. Not 9.8s, but decent-enough grades. I have a few copies of the 1st and 2nd print now, and overall I have 1st, 2nd 5th, 6th, 7th and 8th prints - I'll probably attempt to at least get a copy of each of the printings at some point, but I'm not going to chase it for now. I'm just happy to finally have a newsie of my favorite book!

Edited December 16, 2023 by Jesse-Lee

[ADAMANTIUM]

On 12/15/2023 at 10:46 PM, Jesse-Lee said:

They're much nicer out of the bags, but a little bit of finger smudges, color rub, etc. The newsstand has a small bend issue, and a couple have some spots like a bindery issue on the spine, but in general very good. Not 9.8s, but decent-enough grades. I have a few copies of the 1st and 2nd print now, and overall I have 1st, 2nd 5th, 6th, 7th and 8th prints - I'll probably attempt to at least get a copy of each of the printings at some point, but I'm not going to chase it for now. I'm just happy to finally have a newsie of my favorite book!

Good eye on the listing 😉 that's for sure.

Congrats and A+  on effort!.

 

[ADAMANTIUM]

Still kind of hard to believe that "suggested for mature readers" would be available on a "newsstand". I've never been carded for a comic though idk...

Just curious given some of the killing joke material ahem, but I guess even comic shops regularly sold it so maybe I'm making a misnomer

Were other LCS's held to a different level when selling compared to a grocery store? Or am I reading too much into it?

Edited December 16, 2023 by ADAMANTIUM

[Jesse-Lee]

On 12/15/2023 at 10:55 PM, ADAMANTIUM said:

Still kind of hard to believe that "suggested for mature readers" would be available on a "newsstand". I've never been carded for a comic though idk...

Just curious given some of the killing joke, ahem, "not in comic shops, but I guess even comic shops regularly sold it so maybe I'm making a misnomer

We're other LCS's held to a different level when selling compared to a grocery spptore? Or am I reading too much into it?

My original copy from when I was a kid is a 7th print. I believe I bought it in 1989 or 1990 (I could be mistaken, I'm not 100% sure what the time frame was for the 7th printing), so I would have been 11-12. I remember my dad taking me to a comic shop in Madison, and it was on a rack, and nobody said a word when I bought it...

EDIT: Actually, I was wrong, it's a 4th print. So I guess I have 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, 6th and 8th printings now.

Edited December 16, 2023 by Jesse-Lee

[aszumilo]

On 12/15/2023 at 8:59 PM, Jesse-Lee said:

My original copy from when I was a kid is a 7th print. I believe I bought it in 1989 or 1990 (I could be mistaken, I'm not 100% sure what the time frame was for the 7th printing), so I would have been 11-12. I remember my dad taking me to a comic shop in Madison, and it was on a rack, and nobody said a word when I bought it...

EDIT: Actually, I was wrong, it's a 4th print. So I guess I have 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, 6th and 8th printings now.

I have a few extras of the other printings you are missing, if you are interested.  I'll have to dig them out to see which ones.

Also, if you take an eyeglass cleaning cloth and a little hot breath, you can get rid of some of the fingerprints.  The longer the prints are there, the harder it is to get rid of them.  I have done it on a couple of books and got thm to come back 9.8.

 

Edited December 16, 2023 by aszumilo

[TJ Radford]

Hello Azumillo,

Well, I have 2 more data points for you. On March 30, I received a lot of a 1st and a Book Club 4th Killing Joke, and today (April 9), I received another Book Club 4th. Both were the Non-BOMC version, and both were from Canadian sellers. So all 4 of my copies have come from Canada, as has Stonguy’s copy. Do you recall if the copy you found was from Canada as well? If so, it would seem that this may have been made for something there. I would still put money (but not too much) on Doubleday Book Club of Canada. San Diego started convention exclusives in the 21st century, so it seems way too early for some sort of Canadian convention giveaway. I looked up the bigger conventions in Canada, and only Hal-Con started early enough, and it ran until 1987 and then did not run again until 2010. If only we could look at Ronald's records...

[RockMyAmadeus]

On 4/9/2024 at 3:38 PM, TJ Radford said:

I would still put money (but not too much) on Doubleday Book Club of Canada.

[DSTransmissions]

Hi all

Fascinating thread guys - I hope you don't mind me dropping in with a few nuggets of info for you relating to the wild, wild world of comic book UPC codes.

Post dated January 11th 2020 - 11th print, UPC 9780930289454 50495

Post dated October 20th 2019 - 13th print, UPC 9780930289454 50595

Aszumilo theorizes these are newsstand books, they're actually copies printed for the mainstream bookstore market (i.e. outside of the direct market).

When DC started publishing trade paperbacks and graphic novels in the 1980's, they had no means to distribute them to traditional bookstores.  I'd guess this primarily related to bookstores requiring the books they buy to be returnable, a distribution practice that DC was in the process of running a million miles away from.  Enter sister company Warner Books, who printed versions of various DC trades specifically for bookstores (with fancy new covers) up until around 1993.

After the huge sales successes of the Death of Superman and Knightfall, the bookstores wanted in on the action and agreed to buy from DC directly, without Warner Books needing to act as an intermediary.  DC started parallel publishing a limited range of books for sale to bookstores. As these books could be returned (unlike the Direct Sales versions), separate barcode became necessary for stock destined for the traditional bookstore market.  Bookstore barcodes are constructed as follows -

                978 (the UPC code for 'Bookland') / the book's 10 (later 13) digit ISBN number / a check-sum digit (in this case '5') / the price of the book

A lot of DC's early forays into mainstream bookstore distribution were with Star Trek books - check out any DC Star Trek trade from the 90s on eBay and you'll find lots of examples of the same book printed with a Direct Sales barcode and with a bookstore barcode.  Both are identified in the indicia as the first print.

You can get a pretty good (though definitely incomplete) idea of what DC were selling in mainstream bookstores in the 1990's by searching the GCD for any book with a barcode that starts '978'.

In late 2005, DC started using the bookstore barcode on all of their books, initially with the Direct Sales barcode alongside it (sometimes on the inside front or back cover).  The Direct Sales barcode on TPB's was phased out entirely a little later.  I'd guess DC (or their distribution partners) got better at identifying what stock could be returned and what couldn't.

I'm not sure when the 11th and 13th printings of the Killing Joke went on sale, but if you've already identified Direct Sales versions of them it's probably pre-2005 and these '978' UPC versions are books printed specifically for sale to bookstores.

The 6th print identified earlier in the thread *is* a newsstand copy, as ratified by CGC - newsstand barcodes have 2 digits at the end, usually these represent either the month the book went on sale or the date it should be removed from shelves (but not in this case, where the two digits are '95'.  I've no idea what that means)

The UPC stickers are from books sold in Waldenbooks (possibly also B. Dalton and other mall bookstores).  Lots of DM-only books from the late 80's/early 90's (L.E.G.I.O.N., Deathstroke, Cosmic Odyssey, Legends of the Dark Knight, Sandman, etc.) were sold in Waldenbooks with UPC stickers.

Finally, as someone has mentioned above, Titan (DC's UK licensee) did indeed use the more traditional 'impression' system to track their printings.  So something marked as 'First edition' with '10 9 8 7 6 5 4' inside is actually the 4th print (I think!).  The 'edition' would only change if there's a substantial change to the interior contents, which obviously is not the case here.

[aszumilo]

On 7/28/2024 at 5:09 PM, DSTransmissions said:

Hi all

 

Fascinating thread guys - I hope you don't mind me dropping in with a few nuggets of info for you relating to the wild, wild world of comic book UPC codes.

 

Post dated January 11th 2020 - 11th print, UPC 9780930289454 50495

 

Post dated October 20th 2019 - 13th print, UPC 9780930289454 50595

 

Aszumilo theorizes these are newsstand books, they're actually copies printed for the mainstream bookstore market (i.e. outside of the direct market).

 

When DC started publishing trade paperbacks and graphic novels in the 1980's, they had no means to distribute them to traditional bookstores.  I'd guess this primarily related to bookstores requiring the books they buy to be returnable, a distribution practice that DC was in the process of running a million miles away from.  Enter sister company Warner Books, who printed versions of various DC trades specifically for bookstores (with fancy new covers) up until around 1993.

 

After the huge sales successes of the Death of Superman and Knightfall, the bookstores wanted in on the action and agreed to buy from DC directly, without Warner Books needing to act as an intermediary.  DC started parallel publishing a limited range of books for sale to bookstores. As these books could be returned (unlike the Direct Sales versions), separate barcode became necessary for stock destined for the traditional bookstore market.  Bookstore barcodes are constructed as follows -

 

                978 (the UPC code for 'Bookland') / the book's 10 (later 13) digit ISBN number / a check-sum digit (in this case '5') / the price of the book

 

A lot of DC's early forays into mainstream bookstore distribution were with Star Trek books - check out any DC Star Trek trade from the 90s on eBay and you'll find lots of examples of the same book printed with a Direct Sales barcode and with a bookstore barcode.  Both are identified in the indicia as the first print.

 

You can get a pretty good (though definitely incomplete) idea of what DC were selling in mainstream bookstores in the 1990's by searching the GCD for any book with a barcode that starts '978'.

 

In late 2005, DC started using the bookstore barcode on all of their books, initially with the Direct Sales barcode alongside it (sometimes on the inside front or back cover).  The Direct Sales barcode on TPB's was phased out entirely a little later.  I'd guess DC (or their distribution partners) got better at identifying what stock could be returned and what couldn't.

 

I'm not sure when the 11th and 13th printings of the Killing Joke went on sale, but if you've already identified Direct Sales versions of them it's probably pre-2005 and these '978' UPC versions are books printed specifically for sale to bookstores.

 

The 6th print identified earlier in the thread *is* a newsstand copy, as ratified by CGC - newsstand barcodes have 2 digits at the end, usually these represent either the month the book went on sale or the date it should be removed from shelves (but not in this case, where the two digits are '95'.  I've no idea what that means)

 

The UPC stickers are from books sold in Waldenbooks (possibly also B. Dalton and other mall bookstores).  Lots of DM-only books from the late 80's/early 90's (L.E.G.I.O.N., Deathstroke, Cosmic Odyssey, Legends of the Dark Knight, Sandman, etc.) were sold in Waldenbooks with UPC stickers.

 

Finally, as someone has mentioned above, Titan (DC's UK licensee) did indeed use the more traditional 'impression' system to track their printings.  So something marked as 'First edition' with '10 9 8 7 6 5 4' inside is actually the 4th print (I think!).  The 'edition' would only change if there's a substantial change to the interior contents, which obviously is not the case here.

 

Good info.  I stand corrected on the "newsstand" 11th and 13th print.  Makes sense.  Where did you get your information from?  Always interested into researching this book and anything that is used to correct/update the info I have found is greatly appreciated.

1 question for you.  On the 4th print, we have the direct edition and the Book of the Month club.  There is another version that is similar to the BOMC edition, but, it is not, as it does not have the BOMC tag on the inside front cover.  Do you have any theories about this book?

 

[DSTransmissions]

Thanks Aszumilo, glad I could be of help.  I worked in a bookstore for a few years in the early 00's, so some of it comes from there and the rest is just joining the dots on stuff from here, the GCD, Mike's Amazing World, eBay/Worthpoint, the Usenet archive on Google Groups etc etc

For the tagless BOMC edition I'd also guess that this was for a different book club - the lack of a barcode or printed price suggests it wasn't sold in a store.  My money's on the Quality Paperback Book Club someone mentioned upthread, as (like the Book of the Month Club) they were owned at that point by Time Warner.  I'm not sure if or how you'd be able to verify that though.

I don't think there are any known printing variants specifically for the Doubleday Book Club, though I might be wrong about that. The (Doubleday owned) Science Fiction Book Club variants like Watchmen, V for Vendetta and Sandman Seasons of the Mist are all hardcovers, so that suggests it's not one of theirs either.

[aszumilo]

On 7/30/2024 at 8:21 AM, DSTransmissions said:

Thanks Aszumilo, glad I could be of help.  I worked in a bookstore for a few years in the early 00's, so some of it comes from there and the rest is just joining the dots on stuff from here, the GCD, Mike's Amazing World, eBay/Worthpoint, the Usenet archive on Google Groups etc etc

For the tagless BOMC edition I'd also guess that this was for a different book club - the lack of a barcode or printed price suggests it wasn't sold in a store.  My money's on the Quality Paperback Book Club someone mentioned upthread, as (like the Book of the Month Club) they were owned at that point by Time Warner.  I'm not sure if or how you'd be able to verify that though.

I don't think there are any known printing variants specifically for the Doubleday Book Club, though I might be wrong about that. The (Doubleday owned) Science Fiction Book Club variants like Watchmen, V for Vendetta and Sandman Seasons of the Mist are all hardcovers, so that suggests it's not one of theirs either.

I agree on the book club, just can't find any relevant information on Quality Paperbacks or any other book club relating to this edition.  Thanks for the info