Help me figure out where I went wrong

[Griff]

I have a very bad tendency to grade books to harshly. Take this book for example. It just finished the grading process from CGC and came back with the following grade

 

 

here is a raw "albeit not so great photo of the book along with a description of why I thought the grade would be significantly lower.

 

 

I counted 6 color breaking spine ticks. I deducted 1 grade for each tick bringing the grade down to 8.5

 

next there is a non-color breaking crease large crease extending upwards from the patriots hat towards the top of the book. I deducted a full point for that "7.5"

 

There is slight discoloration/shadowing on the word featured. I deducted a point for that "6.5"

 

The Top corner is rounded and I deducted 1/2 a point for that "6.0"

Finally is the tape pull on face of Doc Strange. I deducted 2 full points for that since its noticeable "4.0"

 

 

here is a pic of the highlighted issues

 

Now while I'm ecstatic the book is coming back as a 6.0, I am also very concerned that I keep grading to harshly and losing cash by doing so.

So take a moment and tell me where I went wrong. I would appreciate it

[divad]

I don't think you did anything wrong at all, although it's impossible to determine by photos. Is it even remotely possible that three graders at CGC missed the tape pull? Unlikely, but that would certainly explain it.

 

It may behoove you to get the graders' notes on the book.

[thunsicker]

I think you are taking off too much for the spine ticks. I think you can have two or three minor ones in 9.4 and five or six in 9.2 (if they are the only defects). Personally without the tape pull it looks like a GA 7.5 or so. That said that pull is pretty bad and I'm surprised it's over a 5.0/5.5.

[divad]

The other thing to consider is that grading is not comprised of a series of deductions - your methodology is off. If it were a series of deductions, there would be a lot of negative lower grade books.

[rjpb]

There is no way I would have given a book with a front cover tape pull like that a 6.0, even if it were high grade otherwise, but CGC has shown to be lenient with major eye-appeal detractors like pulls, scribbles and pieces missing.

 

It's hard to see exactly what else effects the grade, though your descriptions are quite helpful. I don't know that grading is so much a process of deduction from a theoretical 10.0 for each flaw, but more how do those flaws in combination work to reduce the grade. I would not automatically deduct .5 for each spine tick or other aggregated flaw, as it would reduce a lot of books to .5 pretty quickly. How much the grade is effected by discoloration has a lot to do with the nature of it. Many don't deduct much at all for slight foxing or dust shadow ( though perhaps they should) whereas a water or grease stain can get hammered.

 

Given what you've described, without the tape pull, it seems the book should be anywhere from a 6.0 to a 7.0 in hand, but I'm with you on considering it closer to a VG with a tape pull that size that defaces cover artwork.

 

Of the four books, was that the only grade you were surprised with?

[1Cool]

You forgot to factor in the Golden Age bump of at least 1 grade.

[rjpb]

You forgot to factor in the Golden Age bump of at least 1 grade.

 

You can't always count on that, as it seems rather randomly assigned, and not always given to just GA books.

[thunsicker]

There is no way I would have given a book with a front cover tape pull like that a 6.0, even if it were high grade otherwise, but CGC has shown to be lenient with major eye-appeal detractors like pulls, scribbles and pieces missing.

 

It's hard to see exactly what else effects the grade, though your descriptions are quite helpful. I don't know that grading is so much a process of deduction from a theoretical 10.0 for each flaw, but more how do those flaws in combination work to reduce the grade. I would not automatically deduct .5 for each spine tick or other aggregated flaw, as it would reduce a lot of books to .5 pretty quickly. How much the grade is effected by discoloration has a lot to do with the nature of it. Many don't deduct much at all for slight foxing or dust shadow ( though perhaps they should) whereas a water or grease stain can get hammered.

 

Given what you've described, without the tape pull, it seems the book should be anywhere from a 6.0 to a 7.0 in hand, but I'm with you on considering it closer to a VG with a tape pull that size that defaces cover artwork.

 

Of the four books, was that the only grade you were surprised with?

 

+1

 

Some times a major flaw doesn't bring down the whole book as much as you might think. Case in point my Black Terror #6. I bought it as a VG and thought it might come back 4.0 or so:

 

[Griff]

The Black terror I had graded at a 2.0 "HEAVY foxing" but I still subbed it since it was one of my first schomburgs and I wanted to get it protected and displayable.

 

The 2 DWOTN I had graded at 6.5 each. again my bad tendency to be overly critical of the books.

 

at least i got 1 right

 

I can post pre-slab pics of those if ya want

[rjpb]

Please do.

[Griff]

Here is the DWOTN #47 that's coming back as 8.0

 

 

 

 

Again I had this graded at 6.0

 

Primary problems would be the top 2, and bottom left corners. it could have been pressed "and I probably should have" to fix the majority of those issues

 

Also a few spine ticks in the white next to the words.

[Griff]

here is the DWOTN #31 coming back as a 6.5

 

 

I dinged it on a noticeable spine roll. rounded top right corner, 2 spine ticks and shadowing

[Griff]

and finally here is the black terror #12 coming back as a 3.5

 

 

 

some of the issues being: Spine ticks, the cover is attached at top staple and juusssst barely at bottom staple. The biggest problem is the foxing mold that is on the front cover and the right edge of the book and back cover.

 

I had this at 2.0

 

[rjpb]

You're right, all those issues on the DW look pressable. As is, 8.0 may be at the top end of the grading range for such a book, but it's a nice copy and 6.0 seems way too harsh. Keep in mind that Fine is halfway up (or down) the grading scale and while we may argue about how much specific flaws should impact a grade, a 6.0 by definition should be at the border of higher grade and lower grade.

[rjpb]

Your other Don Winslow seems about right, though hard to tell from just a photo, as for the Black Terror, I would agree that that amount of foxing should kick the grade down harder than that, but foxing is one flaw where CGC is notoriously forgiving. It's a bit strange as both foxing and rippling are usually the result of moisture in the storage environment, but CGC seems harsher on the one that is actually fixable.

[divad]

and finally here is the black terror #12 coming back as a 3.5

 

some of the issues being: Spine ticks, the cover is attached at top staple and juusssst barely at bottom staple. The biggest problem is the foxing mold that is on the front cover and the right edge of the book and back cover.

 

I had this at 2.0

 

It looks more like mold than foxing to me. Foxing tends to be rust colored staining due to the iron element; this appears to be gray to black mold spreading in more of a fungal pattern - does the book smell? Foxing is typically odorless (relative to an active mold).

[Point Five]

Keep in mind that Fine is halfway up (or down) the grading scale and while we may argue about how much specific flaws should impact a grade, a 6.0 by definition should be at the border of higher grade and lower grade.

That's an interesting philosophical point in and of itself. From my pre-CGC grading experience in the now-distant past... Overstreet grading definitions, grading guides, etc... I would have said that Fine was closer to high grade than low grade, i.e. the average Fine book is still "well-preserved, glossy and flat with wear just beginning to show" or something to that effect. Might be one reason why I have tended to undergrade midgrades relative to CGC.

 

 

[Griff]

your right Divad I have been using the term foxing to describe it but its essentially moldy. to be honest it didn't smell to me "of anything other than 50+ year old paper :)" but its prominent and the prime reason I hammered the book in my grading

[rjpb]

Keep in mind that Fine is halfway up (or down) the grading scale and while we may argue about how much specific flaws should impact a grade, a 6.0 by definition should be at the border of higher grade and lower grade.

That's an interesting philosophical point in and of itself. From my pre-CGC grading experience in the now-distant past... Overstreet grading definitions, grading guides, etc... I would have said that Fine was closer to high grade than low grade, i.e. the average Fine book is still "well-preserved, glossy and flat with wear just beginning to show" or something to that effect. Might be one reason why I have tended to undergrade midgrades relative to CGC.

 

 

"wear just beginning to show" can mean a lot of things. To someone who collects 9.8 moderns that would describe a lot of 9.4s. To someone who is used to buying 1.5s, it could describe more than a few 4.0s.

[thunsicker]

Looking at the pictures/scans the only ones that surprise me are the America's Best Comics #15 which I would put at a 5.0 at most and the Don Winslow #31 which I would have had at around 7.5. That said its grading from a cover which is never an exact science.