American Association of Comicbook Collectors

[GertHammink-migration]

I think this is an organization headed by David Armstrong who used to work for Robert Rogovin. Michael Naiman can be seen by the table in San Diego at times. The only dealer who makes an attempt to add this to his/her list of credentials when selling is Marnin Rosenfeld. That fact alone tells you how unimportant people feel the organization is.

[esquirecomics]

I think this is an organization headed by David Armstrong who used to work for Robert Rogovin. Michael Naiman can be seen by the table in San Diego at times. The only dealer who makes an attempt to add this to his/her list of credentials when selling is Marnin Rosenfeld. That fact alone tells you how unimportant people feel the organization is.

 

What is your basis for the assertion about Marnin? I am not aware of any such effort by him to do so. And while this organization does indeed appear to have faltered, your last comment does not accurately reflect the significant reptuations of the major players who were affiliated with the organization. These included (according to the website):

 

Erik Andresen

David Armstrong

Jon Berk

Greg Buls

Steve Carey

Gary M. Carter

Pat S. Calhoun

Bob Casali

Susan Cicconi

Russ Cochran

J. Keith Contarino

Mike Dalessandro

Shel Dorf

Alan Dulfon

Bruce Edwards

Steve Fishler

Steve Geppi

Ernst Gerber

Michael Goldman

Bruce Hamilton

Roger Hill

Jef Hinds

Beth Holley

Richard Holley

Bill Howard

Tom Horvitz

Rob Hughes

Jerry Jacobs

Bill Jourdain

Pat Kochanek

Jeff Lande

Paulette Lane

Stan Lee

Joe Mannarino

Jay Maybruck

Duncan McAlpine

Anthony Murfet

Michael Naiman

James Payette

Greg Pharis

Jim Pitts

Ron Pussell

Mick Rabin

Todd Rezmik

Robert Ronin

Robert Roter

Michael Sanchez

Jim Saunders

Dave Smith

John Snyder

Tony Starks

John Townsend

Jerry Weist

Mark Wilson

Mark Yturralde

 

Your comments raise a more intriguing point. You've made 3 posts so far. I've seen them all. They were all on threads I am directly involved with, and 2/3 were implicitly, if not explicitly, negative concerning topics somewhat related to me. I have no objection to anyone saying anything critical of me or something I've said. That is the beauty of the First Amendment I defend in my legal practice every day. If the criticism is worthy, I'll respond directly and without hesitation.

 

But your posts appear to have been deliberate and targeted. You also give the impression you know the players. I asked you previously, and you conveniently ignored me, but how about identifying yourself so we know who you are? If you are going to make comments such as you have, it is only fair that the playing field is level for any responses someone may choose to make.

[FFB]

I thought Gert was saying that most dealers don't use AACC as a selling point -- not that there weren't major dealers associated with the organization.

[esquirecomics]

I thought Gert was saying that most dealers don't use AACC as a selling point -- not that there weren't major dealers associated with the organization.

 

Perhaps. I'm not trying to read into the intent of the comment beyond his clear, at least to me, effort to denigrate Marnin, who is someone that I have been associated with and is obviously controversial to many.

 

I just find it suspect, given the ease by which someone can create a false id on this system, that the few posts (3) this person has made over a period of weeks seem to have something negative in common. We saw this happen recently with some new user continually attacking Bob Storms, and this person was kicked off by the administrators.

 

I could be completely wrong. But if I am, then Gert should not be uncomfortable in telling us about him/herself. Don't you think?

[FFB]

I thought Gert was saying that most dealers don't use AACC as a selling point -- not that there weren't major dealers associated with the organization.

 

Perhaps. I'm not trying to read into the intent of the comment beyond his clear, at least to me, effort to denigrate Marnin, who is someone that I have been associated with and is obviously controversial to many.

 

I just find it suspect, given the ease by which someone can create a false id on this system, that the few posts (3) this person has made over a period of weeks seem to have something negative in common. We saw this happen recently with some new user continually attacking Bob Storms, and this person was kicked off by the administrators.

 

I could be completely wrong. But if I am, then Gert should not be uncomfortable in telling us about him/herself. Don't you think?

 

I looked at this three posts and didn't see what you are seeing. His first post was a "Hello, interesting forum, but I'm not sure I understand this 18-page thread" message. He also asked about the grade on one of your CGC 9.2 books that has two spine splits. Then his third post pointed out that the only dealer he has seen try to use AACC as a selling point was Marnin -- which I didn't view as a slam on Marnin so much as an indication that none of the other big dealers use AACC as a selling point.

 

I am not a big fan of the "lay it all out on the line and tell us all about yourself" line of questioning. Lots of people like to lurk and don't necessarily want to talk about themselves to a bunch of people they don't know. I know that I didn't when I first joined. Face it -- you people are all a bunch of scary weirdos.

 

I think you just need another beer, Mark.

[esquirecomics]

I looked at this three posts and didn't see what you are seeing. His first post was a "Hello, interesting forum, but I'm not sure I understand this 18-page thread" message. He also asked about the grade on one of your CGC 9.2 books that has two spine splits. Then his third post pointed out that the only dealer he has seen try to use AACC as a selling point was Marnin -- which I didn't view as a slam on Marnin so much as an indication that none of the other big dealers use AACC as a selling point.

 

I am not a big fan of the "lay it all out on the line and tell us all about yourself" line of questioning. Lots of people like to lurk and don't necessarily want to talk about themselves to a bunch of people they don't know. I know that I didn't when I first joined. Face it -- you people are all a bunch of scary weirdos.

 

I think you just need another beer, Mark.

 

Another beer would suit me just fine! Especially if Steve B. is buying. I expect him to buy me a scotch (preferably Johnnie Walker Blue) at the forum dinner in Phila.

 

Gert's post on my thread raised my eyebrows b/c it could reasonably be construed as nothing more than an intent to denigrate one of the better books in my inventory (and, of course, it could be interpreted as questioning CGC's grading too). The thread he posted on had nothing to do with the books on the site, but the site itself. Therefore, his one comment stood out, at least to me.

 

That coupled with the fact that he has only three postings over a period of time just begets further questioning. I wouldn't have thought twice about it in the first few weeks of being on these boards but after now being here for three months I see how people do create ids just to cause trouble, attack specific people or incite a specific controversial topic.

 

I don't need his address or anything, just some info so that we know he is a legit forumite. Maybe he is Hammer?

 

Gert, old buddy, in fact, you can just simply PM me to allay my initial skepticism if you are concerned over privacy matters.

[nearmint]

That AACC list looks ancient. Some folks on that list have left the earthly plane. Others haven't been a part of comics for years.

[tth2]

Preservation Directorate

How 1984 does that name sound?

[Darthdiesel]

Otherwise we wind up with a circle jerk of misinformation and confused people coming up with half-baked theories.

 

[Darthdiesel]

That coupled with the fact that he has only three postings over a period of time just begets further questioning. I wouldn't have thought twice about it in the first few weeks of being on these boards but after now being here for three months I see how people do create ids just to cause trouble, attack specific people or incite a specific controversial topic.

 

 

Paranoia setting in, Mark? Tey're not all out to get you just because they differ in opinion. Relax a bit and unclench, buddy.

[esquirecomics]

That coupled with the fact that he has only three postings over a period of time just begets further questioning. I wouldn't have thought twice about it in the first few weeks of being on these boards but after now being here for three months I see how people do create ids just to cause trouble, attack specific people or incite a specific controversial topic.

 

 

Paranoia setting in, Mark? Tey're not all out to get you just because they differ in opinion. Relax a bit and unclench, buddy.

 

What, me, conspiratorial? Geez, you try to dig up one dead assassin and everyone jumps all over you.

 

Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean someone doesn't want to kill you!

[jbud73]

I thought Gert was saying that most dealers don't use AACC as a selling point -- not that there weren't major dealers associated with the organization.

 

Perhaps. I'm not trying to read into the intent of the comment beyond his clear, at least to me, effort to denigrate Marnin, who is someone that I have been associated with and is obviously controversial to many.

 

I just find it suspect, given the ease by which someone can create a false id on this system, that the few posts (3) this person has made over a period of weeks seem to have something negative in common. We saw this happen recently with some new user continually attacking Bob Storms, and this person was kicked off by the administrators.

 

I could be completely wrong. But if I am, then Gert should not be uncomfortable in telling us about him/herself. Don't you think?

 

Relax Mark you just picked up your very own Troll, it jsut happens after a while . On a more serious note I have questions which I'm sure Scott is more apt to answer as he actually took the initiative to phone the Library.

 

- Currently CGC and recently PGX now both use Barrex as the encapsulation Material for their holders.

 

- Barrex while not an APPROVED ARCHIVAL MATERIAL by the Library, is such because it has not been TESTED by them to date.

 

- Have there been any credible scientific test performed on Barex as a storage material for paper products???

[jbud73]

ok, lemme read Tracey's study and see if I have the same questions??

[esquirecomics]

Relax Mark you just picked up your very own Troll, it jsut happens after a while .

 

Darth, does having my own troll count as one of my flock of sheep or village insufficiently_thoughtful_person, or are trolls in a different category?

[FFB]

I thought Gert was saying that most dealers don't use AACC as a selling point -- not that there weren't major dealers associated with the organization.

 

Perhaps. I'm not trying to read into the intent of the comment beyond his clear, at least to me, effort to denigrate Marnin, who is someone that I have been associated with and is obviously controversial to many.

 

I just find it suspect, given the ease by which someone can create a false id on this system, that the few posts (3) this person has made over a period of weeks seem to have something negative in common. We saw this happen recently with some new user continually attacking Bob Storms, and this person was kicked off by the administrators.

 

I could be completely wrong. But if I am, then Gert should not be uncomfortable in telling us about him/herself. Don't you think?

 

Relax Mark you just picked up your very own Troll, it jsut happens after a while . On a more serious note I have questions which I'm sure Scott is more apt to answer as he actually took the initiative to phone the Library.

 

- Currently CGC and recently PGX now both use Barrex as the encapsulation Material for their holders.

 

- Barrex while not an APPROVED ARCHIVAL MATERIAL by the Library, is such because it has not been TESTED by them to date.

 

- Have there been any credible scientific test performed on Barex as a storage material for paper products???

 

The question isn't whether it has been tested specifically for archival storage of paper products. The question is whether the Barex used in the CGC holder (Barex 210) is chemically inert, without any harmful additives such as plasticizers, UV absorbers, etc. Unlike several other "inert" plastics, Barex 210 has excellent sealability so no extra plasticizers need to be added in order to seal two sheets together. But that doesn't answer the overarching question re whether Barex 210 is an inert plastic.

 

I will do some checking to see if I can find an answer to this question.

[esquirecomics]

Perhaps we should post a question in the "Ask CGC" board about the internal holder.

[chrisco37]

Gaaahhhh!!!!!

 

You guys are driving me nuts! One of the current projects I'm working on is the Nat'l Archives Renovation.

 

If you guys would like to make a list, I can see if I can get one of the archivists there to address these issues.

[FFB]

Perhaps we should post a question in the "Ask CGC" board about the internal holder.

 

BP Chemicals, the manufacturer of Barex, touts its "chemical resistance" and the fact that it is chemically inert.

 

Some of the technical specs you can view from that site says that Barex will not off gas any hazardous gases unless exposed to temperatures in excess of 500 degrees F.

[FFB]

Gaaahhhh!!!!!

 

You guys are driving me nuts! One of the current projects I'm working on is the Nat'l Archives Renovation.

 

If you guys would like to make a list, I can see if I can get one of the archivists there to address these issues.

 

Sure. Ask them about Barex 210. The chemical composition is (acrylonitrile/methyl acrylate)-g-(butadiene/acrylonitrile) copolymer. Chemical Abstracts Service (CAS) Number: 27012-62-0.

[jbud73]

My reading of Heft's article is that the test was to determine UV filters in the plastics. All were found to have them according to the test - of course the methodolgy was not published. So the Barex of a CGC holder tested as having UV inhibiting processes in the plastic and because the LOC does not recommend UV inhibiting plastics to conserve paper, they extrapolate that the CGC holder is made of material dangerous to paper. Thats a tad misleading. It looks like all of the materials they submitted had exactly the same test results, so what can they really say about the test - a better statement would be that all plastics they subbed demonstrated the ability to inhibit UV rays and any plastic that exhibits this is not deemed appropriate for paper storage by the LOC.

 

You can say that the LOC does not consider Barex to be an Archivaly safe plastic for the storage of paper, but not based on these test results. Further it is not clear whether they have tested Barex - as Scott is eluding too this would be vital information to determining LOC's stance on the plastic used in the CGC holder's inner well.