Hastings - Bankruptcy which means discounted comics

[Aman619]

how many months of Diamond orders in comics etc did that 1.6 M represent? How long did Diamond extend credit? Are they at fault for loosening their terms for larger clients, after tightening all the way to PREPAY after the crash of the last decade?

 

Of course the tendency is to be lenient with the best clients... but it can come back to bite you if you let them overextend too long and too big.

 

[the blob]

Again, the bigger picture here is how many Diamond accounts report similar proportional debt?

If this is just a large store that made some bad financial decisions than it really isnt a big deal. But if its a sign of more to follow, then some sort of correction may be forming

This isn't a comic market story, or an indictment of the state of the market. The comic section in a Hastings is about 1/20th of floor space.

 

The great majority of Hastings' business is book and magazine sales, and movie sales and rentals. As seen with Blockbuster, B&N, and Best Buy, these are retail segments that are being hammered in the secular shift to internet retail and digital content.

 

A major book retailer owing Diamond 1.6 mil while filling for bankruptcy IS a comic market story any way you slice it

Not the way you're slicing it. You're slicing it as a implication that there may be other stores in similar trouble, extrapolating Hastings' financial troubles to other Diamond accounts.

 

The ONLY way it's a comic market story is if Diamond is damaged by the revenue shortfall. It won't be. Hastings will find a buyer, who will pay Diamond, or Hastings won't find a buyer, liquidate assets, and Diamond will be paid some, if not all, of the money.

 

who knows, maybe the comics part of hastings' business was profitable and everything else was in the crapper?

[500Club]

OK, forget Hastings.

Lets try this:

A REPUTABLE retailer owes Diamond, the ONLY comic book distributor nationwide, 1.6 million dollars. Forget that the store is out of business, thats not the issue here.

Its the capital loss, the state of the market, and the business model of which said store used which reflects on the result.

Thats not one slice, thats a whole damn apple

Wrong slice, wrong apple. Have you been in a Hastings?

 

As I said above, Hastings is not a comic store. It's a multi-entertainment retailer of which comics, by volume and price, is a fraction of the business.

 

Hastings, its business model, and its outcome can't be used to infer much of anything about the overall comic market.

[Aweandlorder]

OK, forget Hastings.

Lets try this:

A REPUTABLE retailer owes Diamond, the ONLY comic book distributor nationwide, 1.6 million dollars. Forget that the store is out of business, thats not the issue here.

Its the capital loss, the state of the market, and the business model of which said store used which reflects on the result.

Thats not one slice, thats a whole damn apple

Wrong slice, wrong apple. Have you been in a Hastings?

 

As I said above, Hastings is not a comic store. It's a multi-entertainment retailer of which comics, by volume and price, is a fraction of the business.

 

I guess you like going in circles

Read what I wrote again:

A REPUTABLE retailer owes Diamond, the ONLY comic book distributor nationwide, 1.6 million dollars. Forget that the store is out of business, thats not the issue here.

 

Hastings, its business model, and its outcome can't be used to infer much of anything about the overall comic market.

 

Do you follow current trends with modern comics?

 

 

 

 

[the blob]

"A REPUTABLE retailer owes Diamond, the ONLY comic book distributor nationwide, 1.6 million dollars. Forget that the store is out of business, thats not the issue here."

 

A $1.6 million write off is a hit on their books, no doubt, but Diamond had $580 million in sales last year and probably saw this coming. I suspect they'll figure out a way to survive.

[Aweandlorder]

"A REPUTABLE retailer owes Diamond, the ONLY comic book distributor nationwide, 1.6 million dollars. Forget that the store is out of business, thats not the issue here."

 

A $1.6 million write off is a hit on their books, no doubt, but Diamond had $580 million in sales last year and probably saw this coming. I suspect they'll figure out a way to survive.

 

OK now were moving to a more productive dialog here which is relevant to our industry.

What does a 1.6 mil hit does to this market?

Do we have a full disclosure of how much Diamond is making yearly? Where did you get that figure of 580 mil? (please dont tell me you got it off the internet) Do we know if thats gross/net.

Im sure that in the real estate industry 1.6 mil is nothing. But what is it in relations to printed media.

I think this could be a conversation that could stretch out for pages upon pages, just because none of us have the facts.

If you dont believe me, just go and see how carried away these conversations go on the modern threads about one tiny aspect of the production element of comics.

So lets leave it at that:

You subscribe to the idea that a 1.6 mil hit by one retailer is tiny

I dont

[dupont2005]

Again, the bigger picture here is how many Diamond accounts report similar proportional debt?

If this is just a large store that made some bad financial decisions than it really isnt a big deal. But if its a sign of more to follow, then some sort of correction may be forming

 

 

The trend is to go digital in comics, I have seen a lot of people reading them on there I pad...the trend is to close bookstores as kindle and other devices are taking over.

 

But that isn't happening with comics. Digital sales growth has slowed way, way down for comic books.

The digital market isn't growing 150% annually anymore, but it's still growing annually. A 10% growth is healthy in any industry.

[dupont2005]

"A REPUTABLE retailer owes Diamond, the ONLY comic book distributor nationwide, 1.6 million dollars. Forget that the store is out of business, thats not the issue here."

 

A $1.6 million write off is a hit on their books, no doubt, but Diamond had $580 million in sales last year and probably saw this coming. I suspect they'll figure out a way to survive.

 

OK now were moving to a more productive dialog here which is relevant to our industry.

What does a 1.6 mil hit does to this market?

Do we have a full disclosure of how much Diamond is making yearly? Where did you get that figure of 580 mil? (please dont tell me you got it off the internet) Do we know if thats gross/net.

Im sure that in the real estate industry 1.6 mil is nothing. But what is it in relations to printed media.

I think this could be a conversation that could stretch out for pages upon pages, just because none of us have the facts.

If you dont believe me, just go and see how carried away these conversations go on the modern threads about one tiny aspect of the production element of comics.

So lets leave it at that:

You subscribe to the idea that a 1.6 mil hit by one retailer is tiny

I dont

I don't think the bankruptcy is going to hurt Diamond in any way.

 

I think the lack of new orders from their single biggest account is going to make things tight for them.

 

But I also think they'll survive that as well.

[dupont2005]

OK, forget Hastings.

Lets try this:

A REPUTABLE retailer owes Diamond, the ONLY comic book distributor nationwide, 1.6 million dollars. Forget that the store is out of business, thats not the issue here.

Its the capital loss, the state of the market, and the business model of which said store used which reflects on the result.

Thats not one slice, thats a whole damn apple

Wrong slice, wrong apple. Have you been in a Hastings?

 

As I said above, Hastings is not a comic store. It's a multi-entertainment retailer of which comics, by volume and price, is a fraction of the business.

 

I guess you like going in circles

Read what I wrote again:

A REPUTABLE retailer owes Diamond, the ONLY comic book distributor nationwide, 1.6 million dollars. Forget that the store is out of business, thats not the issue here.

 

Hastings, its business model, and its outcome can't be used to infer much of anything about the overall comic market.

 

Do you follow current trends with modern comics?

 

 

 

That's if we all pretended the direct market was the only market, the largest market, the fastest growing market, or the market best suited going forward. That is not the case, except POSSIBLY them being the largest single market.

 

Comic shops are dinosaurs. Monthly floppies are dinosaurs. I don't think we're going to see a whole lot of either of those in fifteen years. But comics will still exist. The market will look very different than it does now. Digital distribution and online distribution of print merchandise is what we're looking at going forward. That and comics being stocked in big box stores like Walmart and Toys R Us and whatever bookstores are left in 15 years. There will still be comic shops, but they'll probably be more like antique stores and junk shops, not the place you go every Wednesday to pick up your blank cover variants.

[500Club]

Hastings, its business model, and its outcome can't be used to infer much of anything about the overall comic market.

 

Do you follow current trends with modern comics?

 

As probably Western Canada's leading show dealers, we follow the modern market very closely.

 

I visit several Hastings two or three times a year on western U.S. Road trips.

 

 

Am I going in circles? Maybe. Or maybe I'm just rephrasing to allow you to understand: Hastings' failure is not tied to comic books. Comics are a very small part of their model. You can ask other boardies who frequent Hastings.

[500Club]

"A REPUTABLE retailer owes Diamond, the ONLY comic book distributor nationwide, 1.6 million dollars. Forget that the store is out of business, thats not the issue here."

 

A $1.6 million write off is a hit on their books, no doubt, but Diamond had $580 million in sales last year and probably saw this coming. I suspect they'll figure out a way to survive.

 

OK now were moving to a more productive dialog here which is relevant to our industry.

What does a 1.6 mil hit does to this market?

Do we have a full disclosure of how much Diamond is making yearly? Where did you get that figure of 580 mil? (please dont tell me you got it off the internet) Do we know if thats gross/net.

Im sure that in the real estate industry 1.6 mil is nothing. But what is it in relations to printed media.

I think this could be a conversation that could stretch out for pages upon pages, just because none of us have the facts.

If you dont believe me, just go and see how carried away these conversations go on the modern threads about one tiny aspect of the production element of comics.

So lets leave it at that:

You subscribe to the idea that a 1.6 mil hit by one retailer is tiny

I dont

I don't think the bankruptcy is going to hurt Diamond in any way.

 

It won't. They'll be paid in some form. Any unrecoverable debt will be written off.

 

As you say, it's more a loss of a large, recurring order that's an issue, but that'll be passed on by Diamond in the form of smaller orders from Marvel/DC et al.

[Aweandlorder]

Hastings, its business model, and its outcome can't be used to infer much of anything about the overall comic market.

 

Do you follow current trends with modern comics?

 

As probably Western Canada's leading show dealers, we follow the modern market very closely.

 

I visit several Hastings two or three times a year on western U.S. Road trips.

 

 

Am I going in circles? Maybe. Or maybe I'm just rephrasing to allow you to understand: Hastings' failure is not tied to comic books. Comics are a very small part of their model. You can ask other boardies who frequent Hastings.

 

The only thing I take from this is that Hastings owe 1.6 to Diamond.

And also that, as pointed earlier in the conversation, Hastings made a bunch of variants.

Like...

ALOT of them

If you add it all up, it would make sense that they owe Diamond money for product that they marketed, following current trends, which didnt make sense monetarily BECAUSE of the state of the market. In other words, the market is flooded with variants and is using old rehashed strategies to sell comics to the masses.

It failed in the past, and it failed again w Hastings this time.

 

Oh, and Hastings out of business? OK

[dupont2005]

By that logic wouldnt all the retailers who specialize in modern variants be in trouble? There are comic dealers that rely on variant covers far more than Hastings did. I somehow got on the Hastings newsletter a while back even though I've never been in the store. Never see variant comics mentioned in their newsletter. Or comics at all. I was surprised to hear they're the largest Diamond account.

[Aweandlorder]

By that logic wouldnt all the retailers who specialize in modern variants be in trouble?

 

YES

[Aweandlorder]

https://www.gohastings.com/browse/BOOK/Cat/Comics-Graphic-Novels/SubCat/Exclusive/Ns/p_rank/Ne/4294967294/N/2456+3631+4294933324/departmentName/BOOK.uts?from=comicsPODfilm2&utm_nooverride=1

 

Anyone care to speculate how much money is lost on Hot Topic, Loot Crate, etc variants

 

[500Club]

The only thing I take from this is that Hastings owe 1.6 to Diamond.

And also that, as pointed earlier in the conversation, Hastings made a bunch of variants.

Like...

ALOT of them

If you add it all up, it would make sense that they owe Diamond money for product that they marketed, following current trends, which didnt make sense monetarily BECAUSE of the state of the market. In other words, the market is flooded with variants and is using old rehashed strategies to sell comics to the masses.

It failed in the past, and it failed again w Hastings this time.

Agree with your take on the variants. Some were good. Most were weak.

 

The problem with this is, we can't tie the 1.6M to comics, unless we know Hastings' accounting model. Do they book revenue and expenses for comics separate from the other departments? Or do they pool revenues, and pay creditors in equal proportion?

 

Tough to say. I see what you're driving at, though.

 

Oh, and Hastings out of business? OK

?

[dupont2005]

https://www.gohastings.com/browse/BOOK/Cat/Comics-Graphic-Novels/SubCat/Exclusive/Ns/p_rank/Ne/4294967294/N/2456+3631+4294933324/departmentName/BOOK.uts?from=comicsPODfilm2&utm_nooverride=1

 

Anyone care to speculate how much money is lost on Hot Topic, Loot Crate, etc variants

i don't think Loot Crate is losing money, comics are a statistically insignificant part of Hot Topics product.

 

How about any of the actual comics retailers that specialize in variants? How is Midtown doing? Variants are not an insignificant portion of their bottom line.

[Aweandlorder]

Again, the correct answer is - I dont know.

We dont have a clue whats going on with Diamond as it pertains to retailer variants.

The only thing I do know is that all of the variants show on Diamonds monthly distribution report. Meaning, the vendors account to Diamond if they count them towards their monthly tally. And I do hope to god that Loot Crate doesnt owe moneys to Diamond for their variants, since sometimes they add up to hundreds of thousands.

But just like we woke up one day and heard that 1 vendor owes a mill+ to Diamond, we may wake up tomorrow and hear something about those others.

Maybe not.

 

 

I hope not..

 

I REALLY REALLY hope not

[jerome34]

Well, I went to the "Hastings" webpage (listed above, thanks) and ordered

the 9 (9!) DC items listed so if anyone saw my earlier message, I think it can

now be ignored.

 

I hope to get what I ordered. I paid via PayPal.

[thatdudebooks]

That's sad to hear. My best friends and I would travel to near Mount Pleasant, TX once or twice a year to go camping, and we loved hitting up Hastings in town. Always wished there was one in the DFW area.

 

There's still one in Waxahachie, FYI.