Should Con dealers beat/match online prices? 3 3

[1Cool]

11 minutes ago, Artboy99 said:

might depend on what I paid for the book?

 

The biggest issue in my business model is currency exchange risk and the value of a book can fluctuate a lot over just a few months.

Like Roy said - no need to sell for a discount if you do not need the money.  Problem I have is I never seem to know when the big collections will pop up and I will need a bunch of money all at once so I try to liquidate as soon as it makes since.  That and my wife harping on me to not allow us to get buried in long boxes of books.

[the blob]

On 3/1/2017 at 3:40 PM, Artboy99 said:

I can also say that with the number of conventions a typical dealer will do in a year there is no need to discount a fair market value price just to sell the book. The book is very likely to sell at the next show especially if it is an in demand key.

 

Perfect example of a scenario that happened with a book I own: I have a GSXM 1 CGC 8.5 white pages. I have a potential buyer that offered me $1100 Canadian at a show and my asking is $1400.

I decline

3 shows later the same buyer now offers me $1150, I decline.

Now here we are a full year later, he offered $1200, I check GPA and the fair market value of the book has gone up and I tell him the price is now $1500.

 

Maybe the title of this thread should have been "Should buyers at Cons be expected to pay Fair Market Value / aka Ebay prices for books at shows?"

Well, if you have credit card debt at some absurd rate you are paying off (I recently got one offering a 36% APR with a $200 a year annual fee and a $700 credit limit that will go up to $1400 if I am a good boy!) then you should have taken the $1100.

[the blob]

On 3/1/2017 at 3:46 PM, Artboy99 said:

I could, I don't mind owning the book, but I will sell it for my fair asking price ( or close to it ) if someone would negotiate at a convention.

GPA prices include sales where the sellers are paying 10%+ commissions...so you really need to lower the number from that if someone is paying in cash

[the blob]

8 hours ago, Artboy99 said:

might depend on what I paid for the book?

 

 

It's worth what it's worth, isn't it?  

I was describing how I might price a book I paid nothing for to my son where I saw it had a potential $70-$100 ebay value.  Pondering playing it safer with a $75.00 opening bid or maybe $50 or $25 in the hope of getting some bidding action going...  I said "it's not like I paid anything for it, so I don't feel compelled to start at top dollar" and he very preciently asks me "why does it matter what you paid?"  And heck, he's right, if I'm selling it I am going to try and maximize my sales price, it doesn't matter what I paid.  When he gets his brain out of minecraft and stupid youtube videos he isn't such a dummy. Sometimes we hold on to too long because we paid too much for it.

[thehumantorch]

11 minutes ago, the blob said:

GPA prices include sales where the sellers are paying 10%+ commissions...so you really need to lower the number from that if someone is paying in cash

Yes but GPA prices don't include shipping costs or 5% GST (Goods and Services Tax) which would add up to close to $100 on that book if purchased online.  People are complaining sellers are asking crazy prices for keys at shows and artboy is just sticking to around fair market value for a key book he doesn't mind keeping.  Hardly unreasonable.

[Mercury Man]

Short & sweet to the OP question:  No

[Artboy99]

34 minutes ago, the blob said:

It's worth what it's worth, isn't it?  

I was describing how I might price a book I paid nothing for to my son where I saw it had a potential $70-$100 ebay value.  Pondering playing it safer with a $75.00 opening bid or maybe $50 or $25 in the hope of getting some bidding action going...  I said "it's not like I paid anything for it, so I don't feel compelled to start at top dollar" and he very preciently asks me "why does it matter what you paid?"  And heck, he's right, if I'm selling it I am going to try and maximize my sales price, it doesn't matter what I paid.  When he gets his brain out of minecraft and stupid youtube videos he isn't such a dummy. Sometimes we hold on to too long because we paid too much for it.

It isn't that I paid to much for it, I am just not willing to sell it for less than I paid for it simply to make a sale especially since I do not mind owning the book.  I have no urgency to sell it, and I feel it will sell at any upcoming show in the future because I have a fair price on it.

Alternatively, my potential buyer could buy a CGC 8.5 copy of the same book himself from an online site like Ebay, Comiclink, etc, and he will pay more than if he would just buy my copy once conversion of currency, shipping, import costs are all considered. So I do not need to alter my asking price.

Edited March 3, 2017 by Artboy99

[Knightsofold]

I asked this question before attending my yearly local con a couple weeks ago.  As usual I appreciated all the opinions, and found it helpful in setting my expectations for the con.  I'll now share my observations from the con.

I attended the con as early as possible with a dealer badge.  Looking for the rarest stuff on my list first (low-mid grade golden age) I don't expect any deals on this stuff since it's iften the only copy of the book at the whole show, and everyone knows it.  As usual offering cash on multiple books at once got me the best value.  

After that I spent the next couple days comparing Silver age keys.  Unfortunately for me I was hoping to get an Amazing Spidey #1, and although this book was verly plentiful, there was nothing even resembling a good deal unless I wanted to buy in the mid grade range (4.0-5.5 ish).  Much higher prices than entry level, but not high enough grades for the big spenders means these can take way longer to sell and makes for some great bargains.  

I wanted lower grade so I was out of luck on the ASM#1.  The prices were much higher than ebay and with Stan Lee signing at the con everyone was asking for spideys.  No deals or price matches to be had at all.  

Anyway, my conclusions were:

-Low grade keys that were raw or had any aspect that made them tough or a gamble to auction online could be bought for great deals with cash. 

-Books that a dealer had multiples of could go for decent prices.

-Books that dealers have up on ebay themselves could be bought for less than the ebay BIN.

-Low grade/entry level keys under $400-500 went very, very fast.  After comparing other prices in the con, the lowest priced keys were often gone.

-Could get price breaks if multiple copies in same grade was offered by several different dealers.

-Dealers should write Netflix many letters of thanks.

-For books you're picky about, nothing beats seeing it in person before buying.  A small premium is way better than being disappointed. 

-If you have books a dealer really wants from you, great trades for non "hot" items can be had.

-Don't expect dealers at cons to match or beat online prices.  

-Money talks.

 

 

 

 

[STORMSHADOW_80]

13 minutes ago, Knightsofold said:

I asked this question before attending my yearly local con a couple weeks ago.  As usual I appreciated all the opinions, and found it helpful in setting my expectations for the con.  I'll now share my observations from the con.

I attended the con as early as possible with a dealer badge.  Looking for the rarest stuff on my list first (low-mid grade golden age) I don't expect any deals on this stuff since it's iften the only copy of the book at the whole show, and everyone knows it.  As usual offering cash on multiple books at once got me the best value.  

After that I spent the next couple days comparing Silver age keys.  Unfortunately for me I was hoping to get an Amazing Spidey #1, and although this book was verly plentiful, there was nothing even resembling a good deal unless I wanted to buy in the mid grade range (4.0-5.5 ish).  Much higher prices than entry level, but not high enough grades for the big spenders means these can take way longer to sell and makes for some great bargains.  

I wanted lower grade so I was out of luck on the ASM#1.  The prices were much higher than ebay and with Stan Lee signing at the con everyone was asking for spideys.  No deals or price matches to be had at all.  

Anyway, my conclusions were:

-Low grade keys that were raw or had any aspect that made them tough or a gamble to auction online could be bought for great deals with cash. 

-Books that a dealer had multiples of could go for decent prices.

-Books that dealers have up on ebay themselves could be bought for less than the ebay BIN.

-Low grade/entry level keys under $400-500 went very, very fast.  After comparing other prices in the con, the lowest priced keys were often gone.

-Could get price breaks if multiple copies in same grade was offered by several different dealers.

-Dealers should write Netflix many letters of thanks.

-For books you're picky about, nothing beats seeing it in person before buying.  A small premium is way better than being disappointed. 

-If you have books a dealer really wants from you, great trades for non "hot" items can be had.

-Don't expect dealers at cons to match or beat online prices.  

-Money talks.

 

 

 

 

Or you talking about graded books? Raw keys I can understand because it gives the buyer the ability to see the book in person. Graded books should be at fmv or below. Period. Buyers have a choice. Yes dealers have to pay to to have a booth and travel expenses, but buyers have con admission, travel expenses as well. If deals are better online for graded books what is the incentive to go to a con to buy them other then being able to get them right then and there without shipping? Seems like the majority of people responding to this thread are dealers.

[1Cool]

15 minutes ago, STORMSHADOW_80 said:

Or you talking about graded books? Raw keys I can understand because it gives the buyer the ability to see the book in person. Graded books should be at fmv or below. Period. Buyers have a choice. Yes dealers have to pay to to have a booth and travel expenses, but buyers have con admission, travel expenses as well. If deals are better online for graded books what is the incentive to go to a con to buy them other then being able to get them right then and there without shipping? Seems like the majority of people responding to this thread are dealers.

100% agree when it comes to slabs unless the book is mega hot and it brings in customers.  Why blow out a IH 181 for less then GPA (or equal for that matter) when there are a ton of people walking around the Con looking for that one book.  I see most dealers wanting 10-20% over 90 day for these ultra hot slabs since they are instant advertisement and don't want to blow them out early for cheap.  But most other slabs seem to be available at near GPA and most can be had for slightly less if you pay in cash and buy multiple slabs.

[STORMSHADOW_80]

26 minutes ago, 1Cool said:

100% agree when it comes to slabs unless the book is mega hot and it brings in customers.  Why blow out a IH 181 for less then GPA (or equal for that matter) when there are a ton of people walking around the Con looking for that one book.  I see most dealers wanting 10-20% over 90 day for these ultra hot slabs since they are instant advertisement and don't want to blow them out early for cheap.  But most other slabs seem to be available at near GPA and most can be had for slightly less if you pay in cash and buy multiple slabs.

Good point

[FineCollector]

1 hour ago, STORMSHADOW_80 said:

Or you talking about graded books? Raw keys I can understand because it gives the buyer the ability to see the book in person. Graded books should be at fmv or below. Period. Buyers have a choice. Yes dealers have to pay to to have a booth and travel expenses, but buyers have con admission, travel expenses as well. If deals are better online for graded books what is the incentive to go to a con to buy them other then being able to get them right then and there without shipping? Seems like the majority of people responding to this thread are dealers.

"Buy the book, not the label."  Just because CGC says it's a given grade doesn't mean I want that copy with those defects.  Have you been looking at the grading competition?  There was a SA Flash in the last round that has significant edge wear, creases, it's sliding around loose on the staples, and has a big brown water stain; CGC gave it a 6.0.  If you sold me that book as a 6.0, slabbed or raw, you're getting a return, and some foul language for your troubles!

I don't think anyone has an agenda in this thread, so dealers or not, it just sounds like people's honest opinions.

[kav]

54 minutes ago, FineCollector said:

"Buy the book, not the label."  Just because CGC says it's a given grade doesn't mean I want that copy with those defects.  Have you been looking at the grading competition?  There was a SA Flash in the last round that has significant edge wear, creases, it's sliding around loose on the staples, and has a big brown water stain; CGC gave it a 6.0.  If you sold me that book as a 6.0, slabbed or raw, you're getting a return, and some foul language for your troubles!

I don't think anyone has an agenda in this thread, so dealers or not, it just sounds like people's honest opinions.

Didn't you get 2 points in the last round?  Maybe your grading is not quite as good as you think.

[01TheDude]

46 minutes ago, kav said:

Didn't you get 2 points in the last round?  Maybe your grading is not quite as good as you think.

ouch!

Though they do make a good point about that Flash book--- I had that as a 4.0 because that stain normally kills the CGC grade.

[kav]

2 minutes ago, 01TheDude said:

ouch!

Though they do make a good point about that Flash book--- I had that as a 4.0 because that stain normally kills the CGC grade.

It's easy to second guess CGC and think your grade is more accurate.  But if that was the case, everyone would get 4 bullseyes every time in grading contests.  CGC are the pros, and they are the grading experts, not random boardies.

[01TheDude]

4 minutes ago, kav said:

It's easy to second guess CGC and think your grade is more accurate.  But if that was the case, everyone would get 4 bullseyes every time in grading contests.  CGC are the pros, and they are the grading experts, not random boardies.

First-- CGC is not infallible.

Regardless, I am not second guessing anything just basing what I saw on the back of that book as something typically hammered by CGC in other grading examples but for whatever reason NOT on that particular book. CGC also had the benefit of having the book in hand and not using scans of only the front and back of a cover to make a grading evaluation. Not sure why you give a damn anyway.

 

[kav]

11 minutes ago, 01TheDude said:

First-- CGC is not infallible.

Regardless, I am not second guessing anything just basing what I saw on the back of that book as something typically hammered by CGC in other grading examples but for whatever reason NOT on that particular book. CGC also had the benefit of having the book in hand and not using scans of only the front and back of a cover to make a grading evaluation. Not sure why you give a damn anyway.

 

well Muhammad Ali was not infallible but I'd put my money on him vs some random guy.

Edited March 17, 2017 by kav

[01TheDude]

1 minute ago, kav said:

well Muhammad Ali was not infallible but I'd put my money on him vs some random guy.

RE: Ali-- That is your opinion. You are welcome to it. He would probably would have said you are wrong. anyway...

All grades are subjective. The contest is all about guessing what grade CGC will assign each book. My answers are not what grade I think it truly deserves but what grade CGC will assign it. Some people don't get that aspect and get lost in their opinion instead of CGC grading policy/trends.

As some have said --all 8.5's are not equal. Buy the book, not the label.

[Artboy99]

my experience as a seller is that the buyer doesn't want to pay FMV and always expects some discount.

Some books I am willing to discount, others I am not like the previously mentioned Hulk 181, I have 2 copies priced at FMV and while I have had below FMV offers I have no desire to sell it at that price.

[kav]

2 minutes ago, 01TheDude said:

RE: Ali-- That is your opinion. You are welcome to it. He would probably would have said you are wrong. anyway...

All grades are subjective. The contest is all about guessing what grade CGC will assign each book. My answers are not what grade I think it truly deserves but what grade CGC will assign it. Some people don't get that aspect and get lost in their opinion instead of CGC grading policy/trends.

As some have said --all 8.5's are not equal. Buy the book, not the label.

I doubt Muhammad Ali would have said I was wrong about some random guy not being able to defeat him.  

Edited March 17, 2017 by kav