General discussion thread - keep the other threads clean 29 29

[RockMyAmadeus]

Is double boxing using usps boxes a problem too?

 

Interesting question. Like many, I use the double box method because those priority boxes are pretty damn thin.

 

I don't think it's a problem. I haven't seen a rule that prohibits it...just looked at the USPS guide again. All it says is "Select Priority Mail Express and Priority Mail boxes are available free at the Post Office for items sent using either of these services." I interpret this, as written, to mean that all priority mail shipping supplies are fair game and can be used in any quantity/configuration, as long as you actually mail the item using that service. It doesn't say otherwise. If they wanted to impose a rule that you can only use one box per shipped package, they could certainly do so. The fact that they haven't said so to me means that it's acceptable to use multiple boxes, as long as you are using that service.

 

In contrast, the PayPal terms of service are very clear:

 

4.1 Receiving Personal Payments. If you are selling goods or services, you may not ask the buyer to send you a Personal Payment for the purchase.

 

 

And, for those who want to try and wriggle out of that by saying "yes, it says the seller can't ASK...but it doesn't say the buyer can't PAY that way of their own volition!"....there's this:

 

16. Definitions:

 

"Personal Payment" means amounts sent between two individuals (not to or from a business) without a purchase. Examples of Personal Payments include sending a gift to a friend or paying a friend back for your share of a lunch bill."

 

Pertinent phrase: "WITHOUT A PURCHASE." For the slow among us, that means "you're not BUYING or SELLING something."

 

And, on top of that, it also says "between two individuals (not to or from a business)"...so that automatically excludes all business accounts even without a purchase.

 

Some have tried to "argue" that they are merely "waiving" the "insurance" that Paypal provides in the form of "buyer protection", which is beyond completely and utterly ridiculous.

 

1. Paypal isn't IN the INSURANCE business, they are in the SERVICE business. They provide a service, and charge a fee for that. They are not "selling insurance." That "buyer protection" is part OF the service is great, but that's not what they are charging for. They are charging for the convenience of passing your money to the merchant (that is, whoever is SELLING YOU SOMETHING) so you don't have to bother with more complex methods of money transfer.

 

2. Trying to unilaterally "opt out" of paying this so-called "insurance premium" without the consent of the other party...that is, Paypal, would get you laughed out of court, if not worse. You can't just decide you won't pay for someone's services by trying to redefine what it is selling, when A. they have specifically said they require purchases to incur the fee, and B. you aren't allowed to make that decision by yourself.

 

These people advocating using Paypal without paying for their services...what would they do if someone did that to them? If they were a lawyer, they'd probably sue them. Can you imagine, someone using their argument against them in court...?

 

"Well, your honor, I don't have to pay my divorce lawyer, because I have decided that he was trying to sell me marriage advice, and as I wasn't interested in that kind of service, I decided to "waive" his fee. Without consulting him first, of course. Oh, yes, my divorce went through just fine."

 

It quite obviously falls apart.

[crassus]

So PayPal personal via credit card isn't stealing.

 

It would indeed be stealing/cheating if it was the case that the fees for paypal personal via cc were less than the fees for receiving regular paypal via cc. I do not know. I do know that in no transaction will both receiver and sender pay fees, it will be one or the other (or none) that assumes those charges. I also assume paypal has thought of this already in allowing the use of cc, for which they themselves, I believe, also pay a fee, but I have no special knowledge of their internal affairs.

[RockMyAmadeus]

So PayPal personal via credit card isn't stealing.

 

If someone is paying the fees, then no. That's the point: that someone is paying the fees.

 

They're not trying to make it complex.

 

If I'm buying from someone selling me comics stuff, they pay the fee. Cost of doing business.

 

If I'm buying merchandise from a personal friend...I'll occasionally add enough to cover the fee for them.

 

If I'm sending someone an actual gift or donation, or someone is paying me back for cash I already laid out (say, for home repairs of a family member's house)....Personal, no fee. That's what it's for.

[MagnusX]

 

[Conan_Aficionado]

It's stealing, never the less...

 

 

Let he who is without sin cast the..... I'll see everyone in hell.

 

 

[James J]

So PayPal personal via credit card isn't stealing.

 

If someone is paying the fees, then no. That's the point: that someone is paying the fees.

 

They're not trying to make it complex.

 

If I'm buying from someone selling me comics stuff, they pay the fee. Cost of doing business.

 

If I'm buying merchandise from a personal friend...I'll occasionally add enough to cover the fee for them.

 

If I'm sending someone an actual gift or donation, or someone is paying me back for cash I already laid out (say, for home repairs of a family member's house)....Personal, no fee. That's what it's for.

 

So you paypal personal by CC.......But it is still against paypal policy right or is it only about the money that matters?

[RockMyAmadeus]

So PayPal personal via credit card isn't stealing.

 

If someone is paying the fees, then no. That's the point: that someone is paying the fees.

 

They're not trying to make it complex.

 

If I'm buying from someone selling me comics stuff, they pay the fee. Cost of doing business.

 

If I'm buying merchandise from a personal friend...I'll occasionally add enough to cover the fee for them.

 

If I'm sending someone an actual gift or donation, or someone is paying me back for cash I already laid out (say, for home repairs of a family member's house)....Personal, no fee. That's what it's for.

 

So you paypal personal by CC.......But it is still against paypal policy right or is it only about the money that matters?

 

As Crassus said, if you use your credit card to fund anything, the fee is charged. Generally, the sender determines who pays this fee.

 

I do not use my credit card for Personal payments; that would defeat the purpose of the Personal payment. Personal payments only have the fee waived if they are funded by your balance or your bank account.

 

Personal payments aren't for purchases, whether you use a credit card to fund it or not. You can use your credit card for a personal payment....but it doesn't make much sense, AND....since it operates like a cash advance, your CC company may charge you a cash advance fee, on top of everything else.

 

As for what you're asking, you're going to have to clarify.

 

 

[RockMyAmadeus]

 

There you go again.

[RockMyAmadeus]

It's stealing, never the less...

 

 

Let he who is without sin cast the..... I'll see everyone in hell.

 

 

What else did He say, afterwards....?

 

[the authority]

Is double boxing using usps boxes a problem too?

 

Interesting question. Like many, I use the double box method because those priority boxes are pretty damn thin.

 

 

I don't understand his question and I may be totally ignorant of some policy the USPS has, but why would they care how a person uses their boxes when they give them away for free?

 

They give them away knowing/assuming that each box, envelope, etc. will result in revenue for the USPS. Why else would they be "free" ? It isn't a government program to help the needy is it ? I could be wrong but I can't imagine walking in the post office, pulling out 3 or 4 PM bubble mailers, 2 boxes, and a bunch of PM shipping labels to use for my tape to ship a single book. I have a great relationship with the folks at my post office but no way I would attempt to send them this way. I will ask the next time I send books. (thumbs u

[MagnusX]

[font:Book Antiqua]

If fit like a glove...

[/font]

 

 

 

Edited August 17, 2015 by MagnusX

[Aces]

Is double boxing using usps boxes a problem too?

 

Interesting question. Like many, I use the double box method because those priority boxes are pretty damn thin.

 

 

I don't understand his question and I may be totally ignorant of some policy the USPS has, but why would they care how a person uses their boxes when they give them away for free?

 

That's why I said it was interesting.

 

It's perfectly fine use use priority materials to stuff your box(es) or to cardboard your comics as long as the outside box is priority and you pay the priority fee.

Just don't do that if the outside box is plain brown and you send it 1st class or media mail.

That's abuse of the free boxes.

 

[cbalroman]

So PayPal personal via credit card isn't stealing.

 

If someone is paying the fees, then no. That's the point: that someone is paying the fees.

 

They're not trying to make it complex.

 

If I'm buying from someone selling me comics stuff, they pay the fee. Cost of doing business.

 

If I'm buying merchandise from a personal friend...I'll occasionally add enough to cover the fee for them.

 

If I'm sending someone an actual gift or donation, or someone is paying me back for cash I already laid out (say, for home repairs of a family member's house)....Personal, no fee. That's what it's for.

 

So you paypal personal by CC.......But it is still against paypal policy right or is it only about the money that matters?

 

 

As Crassus said, if you use your credit card to fund anything, the fee is charged. Generally, the sender determines who pays this fee.

 

I do not use my credit card for Personal payments; that would defeat the purpose of the Personal payment. Personal payments only have the fee waived if they are funded by your balance or your bank account.

 

Personal payments aren't for purchases, whether you use a credit card to fund it or not. You can use your credit card for a personal payment....but it doesn't make much sense, AND....since it operates like a cash advance, your CC company may charge you a cash advance fee, on top of everything else.

 

As for what you're asking, you're going to have to clarify.

 

 

If you are paying with PayPal funds weren't those funds already taxed by PayPal (unless it was a personal payment that is). Seems silly to pay another fee to use money that already had a fee levied on it.

[RockMyAmadeus]

So PayPal personal via credit card isn't stealing.

 

If someone is paying the fees, then no. That's the point: that someone is paying the fees.

 

They're not trying to make it complex.

 

If I'm buying from someone selling me comics stuff, they pay the fee. Cost of doing business.

 

If I'm buying merchandise from a personal friend...I'll occasionally add enough to cover the fee for them.

 

If I'm sending someone an actual gift or donation, or someone is paying me back for cash I already laid out (say, for home repairs of a family member's house)....Personal, no fee. That's what it's for.

 

So you paypal personal by CC.......But it is still against paypal policy right or is it only about the money that matters?

 

 

As Crassus said, if you use your credit card to fund anything, the fee is charged. Generally, the sender determines who pays this fee.

 

I do not use my credit card for Personal payments; that would defeat the purpose of the Personal payment. Personal payments only have the fee waived if they are funded by your balance or your bank account.

 

Personal payments aren't for purchases, whether you use a credit card to fund it or not. You can use your credit card for a personal payment....but it doesn't make much sense, AND....since it operates like a cash advance, your CC company may charge you a cash advance fee, on top of everything else.

 

As for what you're asking, you're going to have to clarify.

 

 

If you are paying with PayPal funds weren't those funds already taxed by PayPal (unless it was a personal payment that is). Seems silly to pay another fee to use money that already had a fee levied on it.

 

That is incorrect. These aren't taxes we're discussing.

 

If you received money for merchandise, you paid Paypal their fee. You used their services, and you pay for that.

 

If you initiate another transaction, then, it's a separate transaction, and you're using the service again, and the recipient pays the fee.

 

That's how it works.

 

Just like the rides at the Boardwalk, you pay each time you get on the ride. There are no "freebies" here.

 

 

[Logan510]

Is double boxing using usps boxes a problem too?

 

Interesting question. Like many, I use the double box method because those priority boxes are pretty damn thin.

 

 

I don't understand his question and I may be totally ignorant of some policy the USPS has, but why would they care how a person uses their boxes when they give them away for free?

 

That's why I said it was interesting.

 

It's perfectly fine use use priority materials to stuff your box(es) or to cardboard your comics as long as the outside box is priority and you pay the priority fee.

Just don't do that if the outside box is plain brown and you send it 1st class or media mail.

That's abuse of the free boxes.

 

I've had sellers wrap priority boxes in brown paper and I always thought it was odd. Now I know why they did it...pretty sneaky.

[comix4fun]

Is double boxing using usps boxes a problem too?

 

Interesting question. Like many, I use the double box method because those priority boxes are pretty damn thin.

 

 

I don't understand his question and I may be totally ignorant of some policy the USPS has, but why would they care how a person uses their boxes when they give them away for free?

 

That's why I said it was interesting.

 

It's perfectly fine use use priority materials to stuff your box(es) or to cardboard your comics as long as the outside box is priority and you pay the priority fee.

Just don't do that if the outside box is plain brown and you send it 1st class or media mail.

That's abuse of the free boxes.

 

I've had sellers wrap priority boxes in brown paper and I always thought it was odd. Now I know why they did it...pretty sneaky.

 

 

I've had shippers cut priority boxes at the seams and turn them inside out and tape them back shut to accomplish the same end.

That's why priority mail boxes now have that imprinted logo on the inside of the boxes.

[NewWorldOrder]

 

It is utter hypocrisy to maintain a "probation list" for people who rip off, cheat, steal, and otherwise do harm to others, while simultaneously completely turning a blind eye to stealing from Paypal because of whatever reason.

 

 

Well naturally. Stealing from Paypal is okay. Especially if it's rationalized by "helping out a boardie"

 

And to everyone, RMA is right about Paypal personal. You may not like that, you may not care but it is stealing from Paypal. That's indisputable. No different than those insufficiently_thoughtful_persons who used to charge outrageous shipping charges on ebay to avoid the fees.

 

eBay rips me off every time when I charge correctly for shipping.

 

I have to pay them 10% so I lose money.

Edited August 17, 2015 by SPECTRE_nWo

[faster friends]

I know. How do they get away with charging us a 10% fee on shipping charges. Seems unethical.

[NewWorldOrder]

 

I use Priority Mail boxes as packaging cardboard for raw comics if I ship them 1st class mail.

 

Am I now unethical?

[NewWorldOrder]

I know. How do they get away with charging us a 10% fee on shipping charges. Seems unethical.

 

Ebay for sellers is now at an all time high for fraud buyers.

 

Their new forced return process with the now forced seller paying for buyers returns will open up a new wave of fun for fraud for sellers on eBay.