Eggman Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Hi, everyone. I'm curious about some restoration items. What is typically viewed as Restoration (per CGC), and what are items that improve the overall appearance or change the book in some way, but are not technically viewed as restoration. How do you feel about the way these are viewed? Thanks for your insight. Eggman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighRadArt Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 I'm thinking you started this thread to "egg" on the pressing haters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADAMANTIUM Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 Scopin' with my scopes, he had no hair, launched that shot he was caught out there - beasties Restoration stinks and pressing doesn't bug me that much, but sigs and sketches me thinks is good stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bomber-Bob Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 3 hours ago, Eggman said: Hi, everyone. I'm curious about some restoration items. What is typically viewed as Restoration (per CGC), and what are items that improve the overall appearance or change the book in some way, but are not technically viewed as restoration. How do you feel about the way these are viewed? Thanks for your insight. Eggman Sorry, maybe you need to phrase your question differently but it sounds like you are masking a question about pressing. We do NOT need another discussion about pressing. Please do not 'stir the pot'. badback83 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakman29 Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 3 hours ago, HighRadArt said: I'm thinking you started this thread to "egg" on the pressing haters. I am the walrus, Koo Koo kachoo. Larryw7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
namisgr Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 (edited) Why not 'stir the pot' and continue to discuss pressing? There are probably plenty of folks newer to the Boards who've not participated in exchanging ideas and viewpoints about it here before. Edited October 3, 2017 by namisgr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drotto Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 The issue about pressing, like it or not, has been settled by CGC and the other company that grades. They say the can't spot it and do not consider it restoration. The third company could not spot restoration if it was done right in front of the graders, so they do not count. Myparentsbasement, F For Fake and Ryanfromottawa 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
namisgr Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 (edited) Perhaps they don't consider it restoration because they can't spot it. Or at least spot it reliably, since it's not all that hard to identify early SA Marvel comics that were pressed. Then there's the case of spine realignment with pressing. Perhaps it's not as clearcut to some that this isn't a form of restoration as the more typical pressing job, especially when it's being done to hide tiny stress lines on the front cover rather than correct a spine roll. Edited October 3, 2017 by namisgr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bomber-Bob Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 1 hour ago, namisgr said: Perhaps they don't consider it restoration because they can't spot it. Or at least spot it reliably, since it's not all that hard to identify early SA Marvel comics that were pressed. Then there's the case of spine realignment with pressing. Perhaps it's not as clearcut to some that this isn't a form of restoration as the more typical pressing job, especially when it's being done to hide tiny stress lines on the front cover rather than correct a spine roll. Spine realignment is the devil's work................... Larryw7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bomber-Bob Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 Pressing is now acceptable to most in our hobby. I think spine realignment, a very aggressive form of pressing, is generally not accepted. However, I think spine realignment is applied more often than realized, it's just not talked about, a very hush hush technique. Here is an example of a book purchased on the Boards. Soon afterward the book is again offered on the Boards, pressed by a well respected presser, obviously with spine realignment. .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
namisgr Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 (edited) 21 minutes ago, Bomber-Bob said: Spine realignment is the devil's work................... There are lots more subtle examples than that one out there. Edited October 3, 2017 by namisgr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bomber-Bob Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 2 minutes ago, namisgr said: There are lots more subtle examples than that one out there. Agreed, see my other example above, Treasure Chest. It is subtle and I only noticed it because I was interested in the book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighRadArt Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 (edited) 14 hours ago, HighRadArt said: I'm thinking you started this thread to "egg" on the pressing haters. I was kidding because the op has egg in his name. I personally have no problem with pressing. Although, I have thought about how much the staples are affected by the amount of humidity being applied to the book. My guess would be not much when done correctly. I don't see how one could even tell if staple rust was due to a bad press. Edited October 3, 2017 by HighRadArt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bomber-Bob Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 44 minutes ago, HighRadArt said: I was kidding because the op has egg in his name. I personally have no problem with pressing. Although, I have thought about how much the staples are affected by the amount of humidity being applied to the book. My guess would be not much when done correctly. I don't see how one could even tell if staple rust was due to a bad press. I know you were kidding but I think he was trying to stir the pot in earnest. I don't think rust would happen from a bad press, honestly never heard that theory before. However, other staple damage can happen, especially staple tears. It definitely happened to me, even using a reputable presser. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phicks Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 My understanding is that cleaning dirt from a cover with a soft eraser or Wonderbread cannot be detected by CGC, and hence is not considered restoration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H0RR0RSH0W Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drotto Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 38 minutes ago, Phicks1 said: My understanding is that cleaning dirt from a cover with a soft eraser or Wonderbread cannot be detected by CGC, and hence is not considered restoration. Many pressing services also do "dry" cleaning before they press a books. This again falls into the category of CGC can't detect it reliably so they ignor it or do not consider it restoration. I also think many pressures consider it good practice so you do not press dirt or other material into the cover and actually make it worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eggman Posted October 3, 2017 Author Share Posted October 3, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, Bomber-Bob said: ... but I think he was trying to stir the pot in earnest.... And you would be 100% incorrect. Better to ask me than assume first, especially with the negative comments. I have no agenda other than my simple question. Also, Phicks1, Can you please elaborate on dry cleaning. What is it exactly? How does it affect the book? Thanks for everyone's discussion. Edited October 3, 2017 by Eggman Adding Phicks1 to quote. ADAMANTIUM 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H0RR0RSH0W Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 (edited) I am no expert by far but I have vague notion of some the restoration techniques so perhaps my attention to the matter will attract the attention of others much more knowledgeable. "Dry cleaning" is just that. A dry-cleaning. It is anon-invasive technique that involves using something like an absorptive powder to remove blemishes from a book, usually the cover. I suppose an eraser to remove pencil would be the simplest version of this technique. As opposed to a wet-cleaning which might be like a bath for the book in a chemical solution. This would be a more invasive technique and I can see why some of the proponents of cleaning would be a against it. It can potentially change the paper quality on a whole nother level. Chemical cleaning is something you might see in preparation for a rebuilt book. In terms of pressing I think it is a risk( that some would prefer not take) that can actually make a book kind of ugly( see spine realign above). All pressing does most often involve using water to protect the book and actually hydrate the paper pulp so I could see how it might fall into resto-although CGC does not see it so. I really have no problem with it although technically you are "cooking the books". Edited October 3, 2017 by H0RR0RSH0W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drotto Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, H0RR0RSH0W said: I am no expert by far but I have vague notion of some the restoration techniques so perhaps my attention to the matter will attract the attention of others much more knowledgeable. "Dry cleaning" is just that. A dry-cleaning. It is anon-invasive technique that involves using something like an absorptive powder to remove blemishes from a book, usually the cover. I suppose an eraser to remove pencil would be the simplest version of this technique. As opposed to a wet-cleaning which might be like a bath for the book in a chemical solution. This would be a more invasive technique and I can see why some of the proponents of cleaning would be a against it. It can potentially change the paper quality on a whole nother level. Chemical cleaning is something you might see in preparation for a rebuilt book. In terms of pressing I think it is a risk( that some would prefer not take) that can actually make a book kind of ugly( see spine realign above). All pressing does most often involve using water to protect the book and actually hydrate the paper pulp so I could see how it might fall into resto-although CGC does not see it so. I really have no problem with it although technically you are "cooking the books". In addition, dry cleaning for the most part is only going to remove surface dirt, pencil lines, and other material that is lightly attatched to the surface of the book. Anything that actually penetrates the gloss layer and gets into the fibers of the paper can't be removed by this method. So dry cleaning will not remove staining, foxing, tanning, marker, water marks, etc. Also, dry cleaning is performed without doing anything to the integrity of the book. Wet cleaning is most often associated with advanced restoration and my require taking the book appart completely to perform the cleaning. Edited October 3, 2017 by drotto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
