Bigger SA Key: Batman 121 or Amazing Spider-Man 14? 1 1

[FineCollector]

Agree that it's two seperate questions.  Batman 121 wins as far as value goes.  I think the run up in price has been a little surprising, paricularly since Detective 230 is rarer, and hasn't seen the same increase.  However, people will always collect Bat-keys, and Mr Freeze is too interesting a villain to disappear from the list.  That one is here to stay.

I don't like the cover to ASM 14, and the broomstick glider design was a miss for me, so it's not my favorite.  However, Goblin is an important part of the Spider-Man mythos, and Spider-Man is Marvel's top dog.

[bronze johnny]

7 hours ago, Readcomix said:

I also wonder the point of this particular comparison.

Maybe I can help ease some confusion by first asking two questions before making some points:

What's the biggest SA Bats first appearance  villian key?

What's the biggest SA Spidey first appearance villian key?

Bats 121 hit the stands in '59 while Spidey 14 did so in '64 so the latter book's availability exceeds the former's. Some collectors will include scarcity in their formula when determining what place a key will be given in the SA hierarchy. Other collectors will give more weight to a character's popularity when deciding. Some books are historically more significant than others- some books that have lesser historical significance are valued higher in the market. 

Important to note where these villains fall in their respective rogue galleries. Goblin will usually land at the top of Spidey's gallery of rogues while Freeze has had to compete with the GA creations that dominate Batman's treasure chest of villains.

Bat's 121 has a cool "icey" Curt Swan cover while Ditko continues his classic run with not one green character on the cover, but two- a Ditko Hulk along with a notorious Goblin. Comes down to which artist a collector prefers when comparing these great SA villain keys: Swan or Ditko? 

...and comparing these two classic keys is as namisgr said "it's fun."

Edited October 29, 2017 by bronze johnny

[namisgr]

1 hour ago, FineCollector said:

Agree that it's two seperate questions.  Batman 121 wins as far as value goes. 

The highest graded copies of ASM 14 have been selling for two and a half times more than the highest graded copies of Batman 121.  

[lou_fine]

7 minutes ago, namisgr said:

The highest graded copies of ASM 14 have been selling for two and a half times more than the highest graded copies of Batman 121.  

No doubt this is affected in part due to the fact that the highest graded copies for Bat 121 are only a couple of 9.2's while the highest graded copies for Spidey 14 is way up there at 9.8's. 

In fact, it looks like there are only 4 copies pf Bat 121 in CGC 9.0 or above while there are a total of 173 copies alone of Spidey 14 in universal 9.0 or above.  That's a ton of copies in high grade for a big expensive key book. 

[namisgr]

5 minutes ago, lou_fine said:

No doubt this is affected in part due to the fact that the highest graded copies for Bat 121 are only a couple of 9.2's while the highest graded copies for Spidey 14 is way up there at 9.8's. 

In fact, it looks like there are only 4 copies pf Bat 121 in CGC 9.0 or above while there are a total of 173 copies alone of Spidey 14 in universal 9.0 or above.  That's a ton of copies in high grade for a big expensive key book. 

Yep, that's how highly valued collectors have made ASM 14.

[Foolkiller]

I love Batman 121 but even if a 9.2 appeared in today's market or even a 9.4, we're talking maybe a $60k maybe a 70k book on a great day.  

ASM 14 is and remains in every way the superior key.  Yes, there's a lot in 9.6 (a big find a number of years back) but the Green Goblin remains one of the most important villains of all time.  Mr. Freeze?  *yawn*

[1950's war comics]

Mr who ?

Gobby by a landslide

[1950's war comics]

 

[Readcomix]

7 hours ago, bronze johnny said:

Maybe I can help ease some confusion by first asking two questions before making some points:

What's the biggest SA Bats first appearance  villian key?

What's the biggest SA Spidey first appearance villian key?

Bats 121 hit the stands in '59 while Spidey 14 did so in '64 so the latter book's availability exceeds the former's. Some collectors will include scarcity in their formula when determining what place a key will be given in the SA hierarchy. Other collectors will give more weight to a character's popularity when deciding. Some books are historically more significant than others- some books that have lesser historical significance are valued higher in the market. 

Important to note where these villains fall in their respective rogue galleries. Goblin will usually land at the top of Spidey's gallery of rogues while Freeze has had to compete with the GA creations that dominate Batman's treasure chest of villains.

Bat's 121 has a cool "icey" Curt Swan cover while Ditko continues his classic run with not one green character on the cover, but two- a Ditko Hulk along with a notorious Goblin. Comes down to which artist a collector prefers when comparing these great SA villain keys: Swan or Ditko? 

...and comparing these two classic keys is as namisgr said "it's fun."

That helps, thanks! 

But while 121 may be the biggest key book among SA Bats villain intro keys, if the question is who is the biggest Bats villain introduced in the SA, Poison Ivy jumps to mind for me.

[rjpb]

Sure, ASM #14 is a more important book in the history of comics, but which book is cooler?

[SpideyFein]

It must be Gobby, as when you think of Spidey and villain, you think Gobby. Just as many have said, we all know Batman's great foe is Joker- Mr. Freeze is not even a "cool" second or third. 121 is surely a more rare book, with classic art, but Gobby himself is such a more menacing, memorable character. I beat myself for not picking up a crisp 6.0 121 for $600 when I had the chance. 121 does have a old school feel that I love though! 

3 hours ago, Foolkiller said:

I love Batman 121 but even if a 9.2 appeared in today's market or even a 9.4, we're talking maybe a $60k maybe a 70k book on a great day.  

ASM 14 is and remains in every way the superior key.  Yes, there's a lot in 9.6 (a big find a number of years back) but the Green Goblin remains one of the most important villains of all time.  Mr. Freeze?  *yawn*

As far as the books and dough- This. 

[Lucky Baru]

On 10/29/2017 at 6:16 PM, 1950's war comics said:

 

Spider-Man #39.  Just a great cover.  The others are fine, but there is something about Spidy #39.

[Lucky Baru]

22 hours ago, SpideyFein said:

It must be Gobby, as when you think of Spidey and villain, you think Gobby. Just as many have said, we all know Batman's great foe is Joker- Mr. Freeze is not even a "cool" second or third. 121 is surely a more rare book, with classic art, but Gobby himself is such a more menacing, memorable character. I beat myself for not picking up a crisp 6.0 121 for $600 when I had the chance. 121 does have a old school feel that I love though! 

As far as the books and dough- This. 

+ 1

[NoMan]

On 10/29/2017 at 5:45 AM, namisgr said:

For fun?

Not allowed. 

[ThothAmon]

Memories fade but I think I might have cried when the Goblin killed Gwen.  Batman 121 is awesome but the Goblin's first appearance surely must take the day.

[cortown71]

What kind of data is there for both in low grade? Say 2.0 and 4.0

[lou_fine]

On 10/29/2017 at 5:32 PM, Readcomix said:

But while 121 may be the biggest key book among SA Bats villain intro keys, if the question is who is the biggest Bats villain introduced in the SA, Poison Ivy jumps to mind for me.

 

On 10/29/2017 at 6:46 PM, rjpb said:

Sure, ASM #14 is a more important book in the history of comics, but which book is cooler?

Sure, Batman 121 is probably a "cooler" book, but definitely not as thunderous as Batman 127 where we see Thor the Thundergod way before JIM 83 even crosses Stan Lee's mind. 

[WoWitHurts]

On ‎10‎/‎29‎/‎2017 at 9:57 AM, Philflound said:

It's not me, GP Analysis. Guess they aren't up to date. Have no idea.

Wow GPA missed something? Go figure.

[namisgr]

1 hour ago, WoWitHurts said:

Wow GPA missed something? Go figure.

If the comic was purchased by time payment, perhaps it doesn't get entered into the database until there's confirmation that the transaction has been completed.

You may now resume the conspiracy talk.

[WoWitHurts]

2 hours ago, namisgr said:

If the comic was purchased by time payment, perhaps it doesn't get entered into the database until there's confirmation that the transaction has been completed.

You may now resume the conspiracy talk.

Just being sarcastic.  I don't have a high opinion of GPA.