share your personal philosophy, approaches for purchases, offers etc.. 2 2

[Caltex98]

I seldom get any inquires if I want to sell my art but that may have something to do with the fact that I almost never let the prefilled "NFS" on CAF stay that way. I try to replace it with something more innovative like "No way!", "Nope", "Not. For. Sale. Period." "Not on your life" or "Are you kidding?" Maybe that communicates in a more humorous way that when I have a piece of art in my collection I intend to keep it that way? Of course the fact that what I collect is not very attractive to others than myself also can have something to do with it.

The exception is my Preacher and Books of Magic pages where other collectors have been more persistent in the past, but I believe (keeping my fingers crossed) that they have given up by now. And knowing that someone else wants what I got is of course an ego boost in a way (I'm not saying I holding on to stuff out of sheer spite, but you know what I mean).

[Flambit]

19 minutes ago, Caltex98 said:

I seldom get any inquires if I want to sell my art but that may have something to do with the fact that I almost never let the prefilled "NFS" on CAF stay that way. I try to replace it with something more innovative like "No way!", "Nope", "Not. For. Sale. Period." "Not on your life" or "Are you kidding?" Maybe that communicates in a more humorous way that when I have a piece of art in my collection I intend to keep it that way? Of course the fact that what I collect is not very attractive to others than myself also can have something to do with it.

The exception is my Preacher and Books of Magic pages where other collectors have been more persistent in the past, but I believe (keeping my fingers crossed) that they have given up by now. And knowing that someone else wants what I got is of course an ego boost in a way (I'm not saying I holding on to stuff out of sheer spite, but you know what I mean).

A good point: anytime I see anything like "Nope," etc, I always assume the owner would never consider selling.  But when I see NFS, in the back of my mind, I figure they would at least be open to a discussion, even though the figure may be unapproachable.  

[The Voord]

9 hours ago, williamhlawson said:

ALWAYS explain why this belongs with you. 

Two possible outcomes of that approach:

1.  The would-be buyer REALLY does covet the artwork.

2.  Emotional blackmail is being used as leverage and if released there are plenty of example horror stories out there of how the buyer was given a god price . . . only to flip the art a short while later.

Best to take such (received) pitches with a cautious approach (i.e. look for compelling evidence that the other collector really is genuine in his desire to own the art).

In a similar vein, within the past few years I had a collector reach out to me, explaining how one of the covers I owned was an all-time-favourite for him that he would love to own.  I gave my usual, "Make me a strong offer" spiel and the would-be-buyer asked for some direction on how to go about coming up with a good number.  On this one I broke a golden rule (which I don't usually do) and gave the other guy my original purchase price as a starting point which, at that moment in time, was over ten years old.  The other collector responded by telling me that he could probably stretch to paying an amount slightly under my purchase price of ten years previously.  

Needless to say, these exploratory talks never resulted in the other guy getting his 'all-time-favourite' cover from me as my other golden rule of not re-selling artwork at a loss kicked-in.

Edited April 7, 2018 by The Voord

[vodou]

2 hours ago, The Voord said:

The other collector responded by telling me that he could probably stretch to paying an amount slightly under my purchase price of ten years previously.

quite the favor he was "probably" willing to do for you there, eh?

[Rick2you2]

2 hours ago, The Voord said:

Two possible outcomes of that approach:

1.  The would-be buyer REALLY does covet the artwork.

2.  Emotional blackmail is being used as leverage and if released there are plenty of example horror stories out there of how the buyer was given a god price . . . only to flip the art a short while later.

Best to take such (received) pitches with a cautious approach (i.e. look for compelling evidence that the other collector really is genuine in his desire to own the art).

In a similar vein, within the past few years I had a collector reach out to me, explaining how one of the covers I owned was an all-time-favourite for him that he would love to own.  I gave my usual, "Make me a strong offer" spiel and the would-be-buyer asked for some direction on how to go about coming up with a good number.  On this one I broke a golden rule (which I don't usually do) and gave the other guy my original purchase price as a starting point which, at that moment in time, was over ten years old.  The other collector responded by telling me that he could probably stretch to paying an amount slightly under my purchase price of ten years previously.  

Needless to say, these exploratory talks never resulted in the other guy getting his 'all-time-favourite' cover from me as my other golden rule of not re-selling artwork at a loss kicked-in.

Wow. Is there an emoticon for "that other guy sounds like a predatory ja ck as s"?

Edited April 7, 2018 by Rick2you2

[ESeffinga]

I don’t typically ask about buying art that is marked NFS. I’ve probably sent a couple PMs in the past asking the person owning particular pieces that I’d love to own one day to keep me in mind if they decided to sel the piece. That’s usually as far as I’ve taken it.

On the flip side, I get similar offers from time to time. And to those polite in their approach, I have a typical canned answer. Which is that I have sold off many pieces in my time as a collector, and that the pieces that remain are very important to me. If it’s not in my For Sale folder on CAF, it’s not going anywhere. BUT, I save every PM on CAF from someone inquiring about a specific piece, and if the day does come where I want to part with one, I will consult the folks that sent me the inquiries first, to see if they are still interested.

Ive actually sold a piece or two this way over the years.

The one and only time I sold a NFS piece to anyone, it was a piece I was quite fond of, but I was contacted by a “fan” who really loved it and was desperate to have it. He had no work by the artist, and went on about his major fandom and the possibility of getting work of theirs.

So I began toying with the idea of letting that pieces go to help pay for a piece from the same artist that was coming in that I wanted more. But even still the piece on my CAF was one I liked. Just not my only example.

After several emails back and forth about the artist with the would be buyer, he had me convinced of this long enduring drive to find a piece and always finding out too late to have bought any. I started to feel bad for the guy and to think it might actually mean more to him than it does to me. So after deep soul searching, and a desire to make someone’s year, I relented. Sold it for less than I could have gotten, and the guy posted it in his CAF triumphantly the day it arrived. Effusive in his excitement. Palpable really.

And within 3 months he’d sold or traded it away for a Mignola piece, which he had for 2 months before selling and buying a Sandman page, which he sold within another caoiple months for a Miller piece, which I think he maybe sold or traded in the years since.

This was the deal that maybe bummed me out more than any other. First because I’d ask d that if he decided he was vet didn’t want it again, that he at least give me the option to buy it back at fmv, if I wanted it. Nothing concrete mind you, just returning the favor if you will.

Secondly, because it’s when I first became aware of a newer form of OA “collector” that doesn’t seem to collect the art, as to be more about collecting a list of pieces they used to own, or the experience of having owned such and such a piece.

Anyhow, I’m not totally jaded. Just last year I sold a piece to a fellow that I think made a dream of sorts come true for him. And that to me is lovely. Especially when so many collectors have done similar things for me over the years.

 

[Rick2you2]

I was just the underbidder on an auction, and I couldn't be happier about it. Why? I broke my most basic rule.

My basic rule should be pretty obvious: if I don't really like a piece, don't buy it. But in this case it was a published page of Phantom Stranger art by an artist I don't have (Talaoc) whose art style I don't really like, on a page which wasn't particularly special. I still put in a proxy of what I figure was about 50% over market because I hadn't seen one for sale in about 5 years. Thankfully, someone else won it. Now I won't have to look at it while someone with different taste can enjoy it. I call that a win/win.

So that, in a nutshell, is my philosophy: buy what you love, don't buy what you don't. 

   

[williamhlawson]

8 hours ago, The Voord said:

Two possible outcomes of that approach:

1.  The would-be buyer REALLY does covet the artwork.

2.  Emotional blackmail is being used as leverage and if released there are plenty of example horror stories out there of how the buyer was given a god price . . . only to flip the art a short while later.

Best to take such (received) pitches with a cautious approach (i.e. look for compelling evidence that the other collector really is genuine in his desire to own the art).

In a similar vein, within the past few years I had a collector reach out to me, explaining how one of the covers I owned was an all-time-favourite for him that he would love to own.  I gave my usual, "Make me a strong offer" spiel and the would-be-buyer asked for some direction on how to go about coming up with a good number.  On this one I broke a golden rule (which I don't usually do) and gave the other guy my original purchase price as a starting point which, at that moment in time, was over ten years old.  The other collector responded by telling me that he could probably stretch to paying an amount slightly under my purchase price of ten years previously.  

Needless to say, these exploratory talks never resulted in the other guy getting his 'all-time-favourite' cover from me as my other golden rule of not re-selling artwork at a loss kicked-in.

Explaining the reason for approaching a NFS item should be essential and personal imho.  I ALWAYS explain, simply because...I am # 1.  #2 never even entered my mind, but I see the point.  Hell, the words 'emotional blackmail' have never entered my mind, but now I kinda like the term and shall use it daily.  I have never flipped (this century).  I did in the past, but I was younger and grabbing every bargain I could, selling them to buy more bargains, etc.  Those weren't sought out, but bought via auction, clear that way, I believe.  Anything I bought for 'me' was with 'me' for a minimum of 10 years, so a profit was pretty much assured to some degree when selling.  My new rule is 15 years then move, allows someone else to enjoy it as I have (unless it is permanent).

 

[Mephisto]

9 hours ago, The Voord said:

Two possible outcomes of that approach:

1.  The would-be buyer REALLY does covet the artwork.

2.  Emotional blackmail is being used as leverage and if released there are plenty of example horror stories out there of how the buyer was given a god price . . . only to flip the art a short while later.

Best to take such (received) pitches with a cautious approach (i.e. look for compelling evidence that the other collector really is genuine in his desire to own the art).

In a similar vein, within the past few years I had a collector reach out to me, explaining how one of the covers I owned was an all-time-favourite for him that he would love to own.  I gave my usual, "Make me a strong offer" spiel and the would-be-buyer asked for some direction on how to go about coming up with a good number.  On this one I broke a golden rule (which I don't usually do) and gave the other guy my original purchase price as a starting point which, at that moment in time, was over ten years old.  The other collector responded by telling me that he could probably stretch to paying an amount slightly under my purchase price of ten years previously.  

Needless to say, these exploratory talks never resulted in the other guy getting his 'all-time-favourite' cover from me as my other golden rule of not re-selling artwork at a loss kicked-in.

I almost always find this emotional pitch a crock of mess. At this point I am in favor of the you make an offer if you want it from me...which as another poster mentioned ends the discussion completely. I have sold this way before because the offer was strong. Off the top of my head I remember paying about $2,800 and maybe a year or two later someone offered me $5K I declined but a few months later I saw something I wanted and I contacted the person and they were still willing to pay the price so I said good bye. 

I used the money to pay off what little I owed on the car I bought I college and bought a painting I still own today which has hung on my wall for almost 10 years.

I have one person who has been asking me to sell a painting for over 5 years. I am okay with people checking in every 6 months to a year or making stronger and stronger offers but this person has pretty much been a person_who_is_obnoxiously_self-impressed bag and I delete their messages and no longer respond.

At one point I swear they bought a painting in hopes that I would trade for it, as they offered it to me within a month of buying it and talked it up on CAF and when I declined they said they were sure I would love this trade. They were right I liked the piece and almost bought it form the prior owner but never pulled the trigger for a few reasons. When they eventually put it up for auction on ComicLink I once again took a pass on it. 

At another point they asked what crazy price it would take to sell the painting and I said 20K. The response I got back is your right that is crazy! Then a few months later they sent an email offering 5K for it. Now they’re direct email is set for Spam and I just delete their CAF messages. 

I just got a piece I am positive they would want even more but since they have already been so stupid with their interactions I wouldn’t consider doing any deals with them.

Also I have a feeling the original painting they want would be sold within a few years. I have it framed and on the walls which it has been for about 7 or 8 years.

Edited April 7, 2018 by Mephisto

[Mephisto]

Actions definitely speak louder than the stories people give you.

I recently had an artist send me a few pieces and told me to pay the balance when I can. The explanation was that he would rather I end up with them and enjoy them because he knows I do appreciate the art. He’s mentioned several times seeing the pictures of my framed art on my Facebook and in particular one of his pieces.

He said he hates people getting stuff only to see it immediately show upon eBay. Also, I have bought several pieces before so the artist knows he will definitely be getting paid.

[Mephisto]

Oh and I have bought a handful of NFS pieces on CAF over the years. Usually I’ll ask if they’ll consider selling at all.

Sometimes people have a price in mind they will sell for so if they do we’ll take it from there.

Otherwise I make an offer. If they say no I usually will say to let me know in the future if they decide to sell and leave them with an offer, which often times has changed their mind and let to a deal. 

If you are going to try and buy something marked NFS it better be a Strong offer!

[Rick2you2]

1 hour ago, Mephisto said:

I have one person who has been asking me to sell a painting for over 5 years. I am okay with people checking in every 6 months to a year or making stronger and stronger offers but this person has pretty much been a person_who_is_obnoxiously_self-impressed bag and I delete their messages and no longer respond.

I confess my curiosity. May I ask what it is? An email copy would be good, too. 

[Mephisto]

 

I also forgot that a few months after I declined the trade for the other painting and gave several reasons why I wa a passing I got another email about the EXACT same trade as if the first conversation never took place.

[The Voord]

One positive story I do have (it's not all bad) about a collector approaching me about NFS stuff in CAF galleries . . .

Several years ago I received an enquiry about one of my EC covers.  The cover in question was a firm favourite with me but, at the time, I was aware that similar quality covers being auctioned through Heritage were (then) fetching serious money.  From the courteous tone and content of the approach I received (together with a perusal of the other collector's on-line gallery which contained many high-end examples) my gut-feeling was that I was dealing with a serious enquiry.

Instead of pursuing my more usual, "Make me a strong offer and I'll listen" approach, I referenced the recent Heritage sales results for comparative examples.  Using these sales figures as a yardstick, which I advised,  a FMV price was consequently agreed upon and I released the EC cover to the other collector . . . along the way making another good friend in the hobby.

[Bronty]

Yeah its not all bad.    Far from it.   There are a lot of spurious inquiries, but you have to just roll with it and every once in a while something works out.

[The Voord]

6 minutes ago, Bronty said:

Yeah its not all bad.    Far from it.   There are a lot of spurious inquiries, but you have to just roll with it and every once in a while something works out.

I have had some positive interactions, for sure, but the 80 or 90% time-wasting enquiries tend to sour things and stick more in the mind.

[Bronty]

If you're a serious seller expecting everyone on the other end to be a serious buyer, yeah, it'll get that way quick.    I think it just boils down to expectations?

[adamstrange]

On 4/6/2018 at 1:57 AM, Panelfan1 said:

I explained that those items were really not for sale and that if he was really interested he needed to make a great offer.

So why doesn't CAF have an option for "I'm looking to sell for really big money" since NFS only sometimes actually means, "not for sale?"

[The Voord]

52 minutes ago, Bronty said:

If you're a serious seller expecting everyone on the other end to be a serious buyer, yeah, it'll get that way quick.    I think it just boils down to expectations?

Oh, believe me, serious expectations have long been a thing of the past.  

[theflashunc]

My philosophy echoes what a lot of others here have said. Buy what you love, don't try to boil the ocean and own everything, curate as best you can and if something no longer sparks joy or interest, time to part ways and move on. 

For the nitty gritty, most of my purchases come directly from the artist or their rep in one form or another. I personally think at that stage the artist is pricing it to what he wants to part with it, and tend not to haggle all that much since I'm putting money back in the pocket directly of the person creating that work. If there's anyone in the hobby that should be compensated, its the artist right? And I've found that kind of approach has made it far easier to go back to artists for subsequent purchases when they know things will be fairly straightforward if we're interested and the pricing works for all parties. Even gotten folks to unlock some previously pretty NFS's on some pieces when they know its going into a collection that isn't posting it to eBay in six months. 

And last but not least, try to have fun with it. That's the point of all this, right?