• When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.

Superboy 68 with Missing Page PayPal Claim Denied
0

Started by pjray55,

47 posts in this topic

RockMyAmadeus

RockMyAmadeus

Posted
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Junkdrawer said:

Your point is perfect when it’s a deal between 2 parties. Unfortunately how eBay and pp facilitate transactions by putting terms and parameters into existence clouds the once simple and straight forward deal. Knowing how eBay should work is different than knowing how eBay can work. Buying on eBay, you agree to their terms and policies or you don’t play. You can’t say what’s right or wrong or how you feel or quoute definitions. Yes a deal between 2 people is something more moral and work outish should the need arise. There are scumbags that can simply exploite the system and use the loopholes to enrich themselves. The implemented judge and jury that is eBay’s case resolving department slaps a time frame on a case so we can move on and close each deal in its entirety. Problems will arise and just need to be dealt with within the time frames. That is how eBay works and perhaps not how you’d like it to work. 

Disagree entirely, but you probably knew that. ;)

eBay, as they have been fond of saying for decades now, is merely a venue. And, while they have taken actions which facilitate resolutions to issues, the ultimate responsibility for each and every listing falls to the seller. In fact, at the top of every single listing on eBay are the following words:

"Seller assumes all responsibility for this listing."

The process by which eBay helps to resolve issues that come up is not even remotely binding. eBay has nothing to do with a seller representing an item as complete when it is not. The seller does not get to hide behind eBay "policies" and "procedures" (which can be, and have been, contradictory, depending on who you speak to) as a shield to avoid taking responsibility for their listings.

And frankly, I don't care how eBay works, insofar as it concerns transactions. eBay has demonstrated, over a very long period of time, that they don't follow their own policies, and can be persuaded, again, depending on who you speak to, to violate them, without anything even remotely resembling due process. 

So, no...eBay "time frames"? Not relevant. After all...you, yourself say this: "There are scumbags that can simply exploite the system and use the loopholes to enrich themselves. "

...isn't that what this seller is allegedly attempting to do? Exploiting the "eBay time frame" loophole to enrich themselves...?

hm

 

Edited by RockMyAmadeus
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Junkdrawer

Junkdrawer

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, RockMyAmadeus said:

Disagree entirely, but you probably knew that. ;)

eBay, as they have been fond of saying for decades now, is merely a venue. And, while they have taken actions which facilitate resolutions to issues, the ultimate responsibility for each and every listing falls to the seller. In fact, at the top of every single listing on eBay are the following words:

"Seller assumes all responsibility for this listing."

The process by which eBay helps to resolve issues that come up is not even remotely binding. eBay has nothing to do with a seller representing an item as complete when it is not. The seller does not get to hide behind eBay "policies" and "procedures" (which can be, and have been, contradictory, depending on who you speak to) as a shield to avoid taking responsibility for their listings.

And frankly, I don't care how eBay works, insofar as it concerns transactions. eBay has demonstrated, over a very long period of time, that they don't follow their own policies, and can be persuaded, again, depending on who you speak to, to violate them, without anything even remotely resembling due process. 

So, no...eBay "time frames"? Not relevant. After all...you, yourself say this: "There are scumbags that can simply exploite the system and use the loopholes to enrich themselves. "

...isn't that what this seller is allegedly attempting to do? Exploiting the "eBay time frame" loophole to enrich themselves...?

hm

 

No question that the fact is the book is missing a page. It is unfair that the seller was able to sell, misconceive (knowingly or not) and retain undeserved funding for it as well. Again, I’m trying to understand the eBay decision and not have you disagree with me. Can you not see their position? Can you not see the need for a time frame in their business model?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
RockMyAmadeus

RockMyAmadeus

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, boatfund said:

I had a similar situation happen here on the boards.  Bought two books off a seller here.  They accepted returns (I can't remember the exact terms 14 days, 30 days whatever).  When I received them I checked them out and looked through for interior tears and missing coupons and didn't see anything out of the ordinary.  I agreed with the raw grades the seller gave them.  Sent them off to CGC and about 2-3 months later one came back Qualified with a missing page. 

The seller had a stellar rep, but I never contacted him.  I felt I had more than enough time to check the book out when I got it and it was my responsibility to accept or return it when I got it.  I sold the qualified slab and took a loss.  I would buy from the seller again.

If the book had come back restored I would have contacted him, just fyi.  I am not a resto expert but I can count pages. 

I realize everyone will not agree with me, but that's ok. 

Your choice to absolve the seller of responsibility was nice, but it was your choice. The page was missing when the seller sold it to you. The seller still got more money than they were entitled to because of that. You converted a transaction into a partial donation, which, again, is fine, and entirely your right...but that's what it was.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
RockMyAmadeus

RockMyAmadeus

Posted
Posted
17 minutes ago, Junkdrawer said:

Again, I’m trying to understand the eBay decision and not have you disagree with me. Can you not see their position? Can you not see the need for a time frame in their business model?

Of course I can see their position. They have those policies to avoid costs associated with having issues drag on. Nothing more, nothing less. And, for the most part, it works. 

But those time frames are arbitrary (in the sense that eBay alone determines them), expressly for eBay's benefit, and not even remotely binding.

That is proven by the fact that buyers can pursue sellers in court in time frames measured in years, not days.

There's no understanding the eBay position, when it comes down to it. It was some worker's decision who isn't qualified to be making such decisions. It could very easily have gone a different way, had it been some other worker confronted with the exact same issue. That's not due process. That's whim.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
pjray55

pjray55

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Sorry for the delay in responding and thank you all for the suggestions - I appreciate it.  I think I am going to try to get on the phone with PayPal and try to explain things verbally versus through email.

 

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
pjray55

pjray55

Posted
  • Author
Posted
16 hours ago, Ride the Tiger said:

Do you still have access to the listing? Maybe there's something in it that could help your case.

Unfortunately, I do not - I can see it under purchases but can no longer go into the description unless there is a work around that I am not aware of

Link to comment
Share on other sites
pjray55

pjray55

Posted
  • Author
Posted
On ‎9‎/‎13‎/‎2018 at 12:30 AM, RockMyAmadeus said:

That's ok, PGX doesn't count pages, either. ;)

I would skip Paypal entirely at this point and file a chargeback. Be very clear that what you were sold was incomplete.

What is critical here is that you were sold an item with missing parts; it was incomplete, and therefore not properly described.

If you're up for a fight, call someone at Paypal and demand to speak to a resolution/claims specialist (whatever they're calling themselves these days), and tell them that the GRADE of the book is irrelevant...it was INCOMPLETE, and therefore not what the seller offered. Any item is presumed to be complete unless otherwise explicitly stated. 

What's the listing in question?

If what you're saying is true, then the seller is absolutely responsible. 

The item number is 123163493615

Link to comment
Share on other sites
pjray55

pjray55

Posted
  • Author
Posted
14 hours ago, Junkdrawer said:

Im pretty much trying to understand the how’s and whys of the decision in favor of the seller. Not taking a side at this point.  Would be nice to see the original listing, photos and wordage. The time lapse to report a problem as the OP does understand is likely a factor. 

What I have seen on eBay is that there are people selling things that they know nothing about. They leave it up to the buyer to decide what to pay. They abide by the mandatory return policy set down by eBay and PayPal. It’s the buyers right to return tbe item with in the allotted time. 

The original listing will give us facts. When it was purchased. How long did the seller take to learn of the missing page. Was there photos depicting or indicating the evidence of a missing page. Remains to be seen. 

Fustrating, but no doubt a lesson learned. The time to argue and return the item is an ample window. To let it elapse and to make a case after the fact isn’t worthy. 2 Wrongs

I agree that time was not on my side in this case and if I had acted within the eBay window then I wouldn't be in this spot.  I also cant send in every book I purchase individually for grading or the my costs would be absurd but I can certainly count pages which I will absolutely do moving forward.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Bomber-Bob

Bomber-Bob

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, pjray55 said:

Sorry for the delay in responding and thank you all for the suggestions - I appreciate it.  I think I am going to try to get on the phone with PayPal and try to explain things verbally versus through email.

 

 

 

 

As others have said, don't even bother mentioning the grade as it's irrelevant for the claim.  The point is the missing pages, anything else will just confuse the matter.Good Luck !

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Professor K

Professor K

Posted
Posted

I just got a paypal decision against me as a seller for a FF 11. Reason given: They "just didnt like it'.  Book was won Aug 12th and I still haven't received it back and paypal keeps giving them extensions to return it. Now they have until Oct 30th because "They are on vacation", Obvious scammers.

My point: paypal does what they want with no apparent protocol and it always seems to go against the person who is in the right. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
RockMyAmadeus

RockMyAmadeus

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Ride the Tiger said:

Hate to say it but I think we all need to just ban buying/selling on eBay. The ship has been sinking a little bit at a time for a while now. Time to jump ship. There are other places to deal in comics. Lets use them.

Such as? I would be happy to jump ship for a place that has the exposure eBay has.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Ride the Tiger

Ride the Tiger

Posted
Posted

Comic Link. Comic Connect. Heritage. This Site. Probably more im not aware of. Hell I used to buy books from people on Face Book back when I was still a member.

 

No none of them have the exposure as ebay. You and I can all change that but it requires leaving ebay. Saying NO to buying AND selling.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
0
Go to topic listing