Is it true - destroying comics to create rarity??? 0

[Bookery]

32 minutes ago, miraclemet said:

Yeah it's not clear...

My assumption is that comic mint secured sole ownership of one of the Detective Comics 1000 variants (a colored virgin variant of the Mike Mayhew cover) they did a print run of say 250 to ensure they could get 180 9.8s out of it. And then had CBCS grade and slab them, then all of the sub-9.8 ones and all of the excess get destroyed. Then Comic Mint offers them for sale. So the only way you can get a copy of this variant is to either buy from them initially or hope one of the buyers eventually sells.

 

Yes... I'm sure this is what is meant.  There is nothing nefarious about this at all.  It's no different than a hardback publisher putting out a limited signed edition of X number of copies.  It doesn't affect the mainstream run of the book.  The only difference is, that with the comic community demands for all 9.8s all the time, they are over-printing the run to ensure they have 180 viable 9.8 copies.  Then they are destroying the rest.  It may be just another silly self-made "rarity", but it is no more "evil" than any other limited edition ever done for a product.  I imagine all of the limited edition collector plate manufacturers did the same thing, expecting a certain number of plates to be broken during the manufacturing process so you over-print initially to ensure you have the ultimate number you need.

[jcjames]

39 minutes ago, Bookery said:

Yes... I'm sure this is what is meant.  There is nothing nefarious about this at all.  It's no different than a hardback publisher putting out a limited signed edition of X number of copies.  It doesn't affect the mainstream run of the book.  The only difference is, that with the comic community demands for all 9.8s all the time, they are over-printing the run to ensure they have 180 viable 9.8 copies.  Then they (who?) are destroying the rest.  It may be just another silly self-made "rarity", but it is no more "evil" than any other limited edition ever done for a product.  I imagine all of the limited edition collector plate manufacturers did the same thing, expecting a certain number of plates to be broken during the manufacturing process so you over-print initially to ensure you have the ultimate number you need.

So "third-party" CBCS is in the publishing business now?

Or are they in the "comics disposal to rig census numbers" business?

 

"... CBCS will take possession of every copy ordered and received by us, verify the numbers, and permanently dispose of any overage in excess of the 180 9.8 copies..."

 

Edited January 30, 2019 by jcjames

[I like pie]

They have been doing this a couple years. Very shady group, along with their partners.

[jcjames]

59 minutes ago, Bookery said:

Yes... I'm sure this is what is meant.  There is nothing nefarious about this at all.  It's no different than a hardback publisher putting out a limited signed edition of X number of copies.  It doesn't affect the mainstream run of the book.  The only difference is, that with the comic community demands for all 9.8s all the time, they are over-printing the run to ensure they have 180 viable 9.8 copies.  Then they are destroying the rest.  It may be just another silly self-made "rarity", but it is no more "evil" than any other limited edition ever done for a product.  I imagine all of the limited edition collector plate manufacturers did the same thing, expecting a certain number of plates to be broken during the manufacturing process so you over-print initially to ensure you have the ultimate number you need.

It's not "evil" for CBCS to do it, but more like co-mingling efforts with another business to fix the market supply. 

Sailing very far from being a "third-party" company now.

 

Edited January 30, 2019 by jcjames

[Ride the Tiger]

I see no mention of this on the boards over there. There is a thread on the DC #1000 but no one is talking about this.

[miraclemet]

28 minutes ago, jcjames said:

It's not "evil" for CBCS to do it, but more like co-mingling efforts with another business to fix the market supply. 

Sailing very far from being a "third-party" company now.

 

yeah i thought this was the troubling part. The closer the grading company is to the "manufactured collectible" company the sketchier it feels...

[1Cool]

14 minutes ago, miraclemet said:

yeah i thought this was the troubling part. The closer the grading company is to the "manufactured collectible" company the sketchier it feels...

But wouldn't you want a trusted entity like CBCS making the claim that all other issues were destroyed compared to the distributor promising all other copies were destroyed and it turns out a couple hundred copies are waiting to be blown out in a few years for the extra profits.  I'd rather a guy like Steve was in charge of destroying all copies after hitting a certain number compared to putting it into other people hands.  CBCS is just in charge of grading and destroying books after hitting a number.  You think CGC wouldn't destroy all copies of a submission that didn't hit 9.8 if you requested it from them?  I'm not entirely sure they would do that but they are in the business of doing what the customer wants with books they do not grade and not telling people their request are strange.

[telerites]

11 minutes ago, 1Cool said:

a trusted entity like CBCS

Isn't that an oxymoron?

[jcjames]

24 minutes ago, 1Cool said:

But wouldn't you want a trusted entity like CBCS making the claim that all other issues were destroyed compared to the distributor promising all other copies were destroyed and it turns out a couple hundred copies are waiting to be blown out in a few years for the extra profits.  I'd rather a guy like Steve was in charge of destroying all copies after hitting a certain number compared to putting it into other people hands.  CBCS is just in charge of grading and destroying books after hitting a number.  You think CGC wouldn't destroy all copies of a submission that didn't hit 9.8 if you requested it from them?  I'm not entirely sure they would do that but they are in the business of doing what the customer wants with books they do not grade and not telling people their request are strange.

So, then they ARE in the "comic-disposal to rig census numbers" business also? 

Why would CBCS dispose of them? If the owner doesn't want them back, do they become CBCS property? 

And what do they charge for "disposing of excess 9.8 books to help limit your business's inventory"?

Is that on their services fee-chart? Or is that a little side-deal where the publisher maximizes profits and rigs the supply by paying a "third-party grader" to help do more than just grade books? 

CBCS is overseeing Comic Mint's inventory now? 

Edited January 30, 2019 by jcjames

[kav]

I dont understand this-they are going to destroy all the non 9.8s that no one wants anyway so that people will more want the 9.8s that they already want?  Do I have it right?

[jcjames]

6 minutes ago, kav said:

I dont understand this-they are going to destroy all the non 9.8s that no one wants anyway so that people will more want the 9.8s that they already want?  Do I have it right?

Just follow the money. 

[1Cool]

30 minutes ago, jcjames said:

So, then they ARE in the "comic-disposal to rig census numbers" business also? 

Why would CBCS dispose of them? If the owner doesn't want them back, do they become CBCS property? 

And what do they charge for "disposing of excess 9.8 books to help limit your business's inventory"?

Is that on their services fee-chart? Or is that a little side-deal where the publisher maximizes profits and rigs the supply by paying a "third-party grader" to help do more than just grade books? 

CBCS is overseeing Comic Mint's inventory now? 

They are doing what is requested by their client.  If I called CGC and said "don't bother sending me back X-Force 1s or Youngblood 1s that don't get 9.6 since they are not worth the $2 to ship back".  Would CGC refuse and require me to pay the shipping for books I didn't want back or would they destroy the book per my request.  As long as CBCS is not compromising their grading per request of a client I don't really care if they send copies back to a client or destroy them per a request.

[Lazyboy]

13 minutes ago, kav said:

I dont understand this-they are going to destroy all the non 9.8s that no one wants anyway so that people will more want the 9.8s that they already want?  Do I have it right?

No. 9.8s will also be destroyed. If The Comic Mint could simply have ordered exactly 180 9.8s of their exclusive variant from DC/Diamond, they would have. They are using the grading company as a third party to verify the number of copies that exist (not including comp copies for creators, over which they have no control), so there won't be the usual questions about how many were actually printed and are really available.

That said, this variant is just more garbage and the whole thing is stupid.

[kav]

3 minutes ago, Lazyboy said:

No. 9.8s will also be destroyed. If The Comic Mint could simply have ordered exactly 180 9.8s of their exclusive variant from DC/Diamond, they would have. They are using the grading company as a third party to verify the number of copies that exist (not including comp copies for creators, over which they have no control), so there won't be the usual questions about how many were actually printed and are really available.

That said, this variant is just more garbage and the whole thing is stupid.

Drek is drek a 9.8 dont change that

[Lazyboy]

3 hours ago, miraclemet said:

but there's also something called a "Trade Dress" version which looks identical online (colored virgin mike mayhew variant) being offered (and some retailers offering CGC 9.6 and 9.8 versions) and that version is part of a limited 2500 copy run...

If you cracked both out Im not sure how someone could tell the two apart if they cracked the CBCS limited edition one out of its slab...

Trade dress means the finished product will have logos and stuff on the cover. The virgin variant is just the art.

Even I know that, and I don't care about this stupid garbage variant

[Lazyboy]

On 1/29/2019 at 9:28 AM, lizards2 said:

Much more dear to my heart is the topic of dealers and flippers buying multiples upon multiples of "keys" and "semi-keys" to manufacture scarcity, and drive up prices, thus keeping many of these books out of collector's hands, because they can no longer afford these books. 

What about the hoarders?

[miraclemet]

so cbcs is incentivised to grade 180 copies as 9.8s

what it sounds like is the best 180 copies of the print run will be 9.8, regardless of actal condition. (granted they're fresh off the presses so they are likely to be 9.8s, but still...)

[miraclemet]

2 minutes ago, Lazyboy said:

Trade dress means the finished product will have logos and stuff on the cover. The virgin variant is just the art.

Even I know that, and I don't care about this stupid garbage variant

i have bought zero variants, and had no clue what virgin meant. In this hobby i had my share of theories though....

[Dick Pontoon]

Really, who cares? This is just one of dozens of a single RETAILER variant, not the original DC press run that will be for sale everywhere nor even one of the dozen publisher variants that will be for sale. Who cares if Joe Blow’s Comic Shop orders 2,500 with their logo on the cover and destroys the other 2,320 copies? Who cares if they destroy even 2,499 copies of it? Wow, there’s only 1 existing copy of Tec #1000 with Joe Blow's logo on it. BFD.

My apologies to those who collect variants. I’ve seen publisher variants with covers I liked better than the regular issue, but to be up in arms about a manufactured collectible retailer variant seems absurd.

[lizards2]

5 minutes ago, Lazyboy said:

On ‎1‎/‎29‎/‎2019 at 7:28 AM, lizards2 said:

Much more dear to my heart is the topic of dealers and flippers buying multiples upon multiples of "keys" and "semi-keys" to manufacture scarcity, and drive up prices, thus keeping many of these books out of collector's hands, because they can no longer afford these books. 

What about the hoarders?

I forgot those bastiches.