What will happen to all these trimmed books?

[The Black Hand ®]

Once all these trimmed books have been identified and refunds given what do you all think will happen to the books themselves? Will they be destroyed, like counterfeit money so that they will never manage to find their way back into circulation or will the they be cracked out of their slabs and sold raw? Or will Heritage get together with CGC in a few years and auction them off as "The Notorious Jason Ewert Collection" a wacky new pedigree designation. They did with Nicholas Cage, that famous comic book.... wait, what did he have to do with comic book creation? I forget, anyway what do you think? I'm trying to lighten up about this whole thing.

[BassGMan]

Heck, a lightly trimmed book in a PLOD does not really bother me too much, especially at the prices they fetch as compared to untouched books. Some people regard these books as garbage, or treat them like leppars, etc. As long as the trim is not really obvious it can still be a beautiful book worth owning (at the right price ). As a matter of fact, in terms of resto, I'd rather own a lightly trimmed book than a book with pieces added or noticable CT. I'd CERTAINLY rather own a trimmed book than a book with a Marvel Value Stamp or coupon cut out.

[The Black Hand ®]

Good points.

[shadroch]

I would speculate that the books that end up back in Tom B's hands will end up remaining in his collection. But some of the books that he won't refund (which I suspect will be many) will be broken out and sold raw to a different unsuspecting buyer. Heck,they may well end up being resubmitted as raw books and get the CGC seal of approval all over again.

Perhaps if they remain PLOD'd they may fetch higher prices as people think about the possible future breakout values.

No matter what happens,I certainly will not like to see them destroyed.

[The Black Hand ®]

Why do you think he may not refund "many " books?

[shadroch]

His carefully worded response that he would refund the books he co-owned and attempt to get JE to refund the books Jason solely owned. Short of producing the business records of a business that I suspect dealt with large sums of cash,all we have is his side. What happens when,if,JE says something different.

This whole situation developed because everyone trusted everyone else. For me,that faith has been shattered and its going to take much more than promises to restore it.

Josh and Vince have risen to the occasion and restored my faith in dealing with them. Others are conspicious by their silence.I certainly hope I am proven wrong,but until I am,I am cutting little or no slack to those who do not earn it.

Is JE the criminal mastermind or just a henchman who got caught holding the bag?

[The Black Hand ®]

I think maybe he's a henchman, tip of the iceberg so to speak. As far as stepping up to the plate, I've had my problem with Metropolis in some areas but they're in business for the long term and I never would have been concerned about any funny business with them, they have too good a return policy and probably make enough money not to have to cheat like some of those others.

[Johnny G]

Good thread...

 

I would imagine that a person who was passing off thousands of fake bills at a bank (on a regular basis), would have to have someone on the "inside".

 

Kinda makes me wonder...

[joe_collector]

I would imagine that a person who was passing off thousands of fake bills at a bank (on a regular basis), would have to have someone on the "inside".

 

Getting warmer.

[Mister_Comics]

Or will Heritage get together with CGC in a few years and auction them off as "The Notorious Jason Ewert Collection" a wacky new pedigree designation.

 

Not to get off topic but, the Cage books are not a pedigree. They were simply a COLLECTION. Just like the Stan Lee collection that is noted on CGC labels.

 

I've been saying CGC should have a different color label for pedigee books for a while now. I'm a one man lobbiest on this subject it seems. But one that will keep harping about it cause of the confusion people seem to have distinguising the two. Sorry to get off topic but I had to get that off my chest.

 

OK back to topic.

[The Black Hand ®]

You know, it's not like these people in positions of authority have been carefully screened and run before congress before they take office. These guys do it so they can make money. I'm talking about auction houses, grading companies and comic book dealers. They probably run their business with the standard ethics of today, which by what I see and have experienced is awful! The quick buck. Anybody have any remodeling done for them lately? How many times were you lied to during the process. These people who run (ruin) this hobby are not what I would call the pillars of an ethical society. I personally think this hobby has been hijacked by Heritage and CGC and a scattering of High Grade Investment type dealers.

[JoeJoeJoe-migration]

Or will Heritage get together with CGC in a few years and auction them off as "The Notorious Jason Ewert Collection" a wacky new pedigree designation.

 

Not to get off topic but, the Cage books are not a pedigree. They were simply a COLLECTION. Just like the Stan Lee collection that is noted on CGC labels.

 

I've been saying CGC should have a different color label for pedigee books for a while now. I'm a one man lobbiest on this subject it seems. But one that will keep harping about it cause of the confusion people seem to have distinguising the two. Sorry to get off topic but I had to get that off my chest.

 

OK back to topic.

 

I've never understood why people care about pedegree books other than for the high quality implied. Before CGC the pedegree meant you knew what stratisphere the comics condition was in, but now that there is this record of other high quality books, who cares? And why care if Nicolas Cage owned a book?

 

A NM book is a NM book is a NM book.

 

I don't mean to slam collectors preferences, I have my own, but I just don't get this one. (I do understand someone who started collecting pedegrees years ago and continues for that reason, however).

[Mister_Comics]

Or will Heritage get together with CGC in a few years and auction them off as "The Notorious Jason Ewert Collection" a wacky new pedigree designation.

 

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

 

Not to get off topic but, the Cage books are not a pedigree. They were simply a COLLECTION. Just like the Stan Lee collection that is noted on CGC labels.

 

I've been saying CGC should have a different color label for pedigee books for a while now. I'm a one man lobbiest on this subject it seems. But one that will keep harping about it cause of the confusion people seem to have distinguising the two. Sorry to get off topic but I had to get that off my chest.

 

OK back to topic.

 

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

 

I've never understood why people care about pedegree books other than for the high quality implied. Before CGC the pedegree meant you knew what stratisphere the comics condition was in, but now that there is this record of other high quality books, who cares? And why care if Nicolas Cage owned a book?

 

A NM book is a NM book is a NM book.

 

I don't mean to slam collectors preferences, I have my own, but I just don't get this one. (I do understand someone who started collecting pedegrees years ago and continues for that reason, however).

 

I don't collect pedigrees, but I have a friend that does. I know he collects for the historical value. We are opposites. Though I also collect for the historical value. My own bought comics are my history. Whereas he is collecting the same books that someone else collected. Whether or not thats what other pedigree collectors get them for. I'm sure there are other reason why. The history behind the pedigree comics is probably the main reason for collecting them. Grades probably second reason.

[PedigreeMan]

The history behind the pedigree comics is probably the main reason for collecting them. Grades probably second reason.

 

Exactly. Well said, Ken.

[drbanner]

Once all these trimmed books have been identified and refunds given what do you all think will happen to the books themselves? Will they be destroyed, like counterfeit money so that they will never manage to find their way back into circulation or will the they be cracked out of their slabs and sold raw? Or will Heritage get together with CGC in a few years and auction them off as "The Notorious Jason Ewert Collection" a wacky new pedigree designation. They did with Nicholas Cage, that famous comic book.... wait, what did he have to do with comic book creation? I forget, anyway what do you think? I'm trying to lighten up about this whole thing.

 

They'll diffuse out into the market, probably as PLODs as well as raw (both declared restored and undeclared ).

 

It's pretty sad that between hammer and now Jason, many of the best specimens our hobby has have been ruined forever. If I was collecting high grade/expensive books, I would be wary of buying anything other than OO books and collections of long time collectors (like Bob O's books, Harry's books, the Don Rosa books, etc.,.).

[shadroch]

But how hard would it be to fake an original owner collection?A dedicated buyer or two,scooping up books with similar characteristics ,then -Bam-,some unknown 'owner'pops up with a terrific original owner collection.

If only there was an unbiased third party grading company that could certify books,making it easier to trade them sight unseen.

[Comicdey]

Maybe an unobtrusive "store stamp" on the front and back cover should indicated

 

"Name and Trimmed Date XX-XX-XX"

[Darthdiesel]

They'll diffuse out into the market, probably as PLODs as well as raw (both declared restored and undeclared ).

 

Exactly. Plenty of small time dealers or wanna be dealers out there who don't give a $#% about this issue and will do it for a cut of the $$$... the ethical justification for them will be that in a comic book's lifetime, it is already trimmed post production anyway, so what is the difference now if the second trimming is that good?

[Comicdey]

Their apparent grade would not be effected.

[garthgantu]

Josh and Vince have risen to the occasion and restored my faith in dealing with them.

 

I do applaud Josh and Vince for the stance they're taking, but how does this really restore your faith in dealing with them? Since they'll still be using a flawed system/service (CGC) to determine if a book they sold you has been restored, how can this command much confidence? Sure, if you get a slabbed book from Josh or Vince and send it back to CGC and CGC says "ooops, we missed a little trim job here - the book is in fact restored," the prospect of getting your money back is a positive one. But CGC has not proven that they can catch the resto now any better than they could 6 months ago... so it's something of a hollow promise, IMO.