Are artists ruining comics? 0

[shadroch]

It occurs to me that many books seem to be drawn with the first thought being the arts worth on the after-market. A splash page can bring 2X-5X what a regular page would bring and since no one wants  a Dr. Vegas page without the hero on it, the hero has to be on every page. Even a half splash brings a premium, no matter if it doesn't advance the story properly.  When an artist is paid $3,000 for an entire story but knows his splash or half splashes will triple his income, there seems to be a real conflict of interest. A book full of splash pages may look nice, but in the end you are supposed to be telling a story, not just drawing pretty pictures.

 End of rant. 

 

[theCapraAegagrus]

"Good" artists? No.

"Bad" artists? Yes.

Edited July 29, 2021 by theCapraAegagrus

[Cat]

I think we're past that stage, personally. I mean, besides a few artists, can anyone name any of the artists Marvel rotates around for a few issues book to book? 

[kav]

Current artists with some exceptions are all cranked out of a machine and draw almost the same and are indistinguishable hacks.

[Jeffro.]

When Image started it was basically pretty ('pretty' being very subjective) pictures, with bold colors on slick paper. Most of the comics themselves sucked though and people ate it UP!

So the idea that art is driving the way comics are produced is not a stretch at all to me.

[Ken Aldred]

I really haven’t found much difference between the state of modern comics, art wise, and the output that I’m most familiar with in the 70s Bronze Age and 80s Copper Age, which predated the emergent transition to dialogue-light splash page art during Image’s notable first phase in the 90s.  A small amount of exceptional art, and a lot in the range extending from workmanlike or corporate mediocrity down to the abyss of the plainly incompetent, while repetitively idolising a select, very, very limited elite of creator gods throughout each period.

I’ve said it before, that if you analyse the comics of the olden days using a resource such as the online Newsstand, the above spectrum exists Age after Age after Age, right up to the present. 
 

 

Edited July 29, 2021 by Ken Aldred

[porcupine48]

On 7/29/2021 at 3:12 PM, Ken Aldred said:

I really haven’t found much difference between the state of modern comics, art wise, and the output that I’m most familiar with in the 70s Bronze Age and 80s Copper Age which predated the emergent transition to dialogue-light splash page art during Image’s notable first phase in the 90s.  A small amount of exceptional art, and a lot in the range extending from workmanlike or corporate mediocrity down to the abyss of the plainly incompetent, while repetitively idolising a select, very, very limited elite of creator gods through each period.

I’ve said it before, that if you analyse the comics of the olden days using a resource such as the online Newsstand, the above spectrum exists Age after Age after Age, right up to the present. 
 

 

Just here to say hi buddy!

And Hi hatemowfro @Jeffro. and you too shadbill

[Ken Aldred]

On 7/29/2021 at 8:14 PM, porcupine48 said:

Just here to say hi buddy!

And Hi hatemowfro @Jeffro. and you too shadbill

Always nice to see you here, pal.

[Cat]

On 7/30/2021 at 3:17 AM, Jeffro. said:

When Image started it was basically pretty ('pretty' being very subjective) pictures, with bold colors on slick paper. Most of the comics themselves sucked though and people ate it UP!

So the idea that art is driving the way comics are produced is not a stretch at all to me.

I honestly think writers have more power now, bar a few exceptions like say Jim Lee. 

[Park]

On 7/29/2021 at 12:12 PM, Ken Aldred said:

I really haven’t found much difference between the state of modern comics, art wise, and the output that I’m most familiar with in the 70s Bronze Age and 80s Copper Age, which predated the emergent transition to dialogue-light splash page art during Image’s notable first phase in the 90s.  A small amount of exceptional art, and a lot in the range extending from workmanlike or corporate mediocrity down to the abyss of the plainly incompetent, while repetitively idolising a select, very, very limited elite of creator gods throughout each period.

I’ve said it before, that if you analyse the comics of the olden days using a resource such as the online Newsstand, the above spectrum exists Age after Age after Age, right up to the present. 
 

 

This is pretty spot on for me as well. While everyone is aware of incredible artists during the GA and SA and BA, modern comics are routinely dismissed.

There are fantastic stories being written and fantastic artists putting out great content. The styles and presentations are different but there are a multitude of different artists out there with a multitude of different and engaging styles.

I still actively read, collect and enjoy modern comics.

Now to Shadroch’s point, there are definitely some artists that are drawing a pose and not drawing the story, per se. Yeah, it’s out there and sometimes distracting but I can’t say that it is widespread.

[Prince Namor]

There seems to be less of the traditional storytelling style of artists in mainstream comics, as many older readers are familiar with. 

For people who grew up primarily on Silver/Bronze/Copper Marvel Comics, where they basically held your hand thru the story and verbalized on the page what was drawn, this can cause confusion and discomfort. If you've spent a fair amount of time reading early Heavy Metals, and underground comics, you'll have a better handle on it.

Ultimately, if I'm going to read anything in modern mainstream American comics today, it'll be something Brubaker/Phillips or Image Comics in general. I read a lot more Manga than I do American Comics - I'm just less familiar with their basic tropes, so it seems more original.

Recently I picked up the first two chapters of Spider-man's 'Sinister War' Saga, mainly because I saw Mark Bagley was drawing some of it. Even at home, in private, reading it, I just feel silly. Regurgitated garbage. It could drawn by Michelangelo, it wouldn't save it. 

 

[Forbush-Man]

On 7/29/2021 at 8:56 AM, theCapraAegagrus said:

"Good" artists? No.

"Bad" artists? Yes.

[evilskip]

I'm still trying to figure out why some comics need 25 variant covers.

[Park]

On 7/31/2021 at 9:24 AM, evilskip said:

I'm still trying to figure out why some comics need 25 variant covers.

People continue to buy them at a rate that makes sense to continue producing them.

[Park]

On 7/30/2021 at 1:14 PM, Prince Namor said:

There seems to be less of the traditional storytelling style of artists in mainstream comics, as many older readers are familiar with. 

For people who grew up primarily on Silver/Bronze/Copper Marvel Comics, where they basically held your hand thru the story and verbalized on the page what was drawn, this can cause confusion and discomfort. If you've spent a fair amount of time reading early Heavy Metals, and underground comics, you'll have a better handle on it.

Ultimately, if I'm going to read anything in modern mainstream American comics today, it'll be something Brubaker/Phillips or Image Comics in general. I read a lot more Manga than I do American Comics - I'm just less familiar with their basic tropes, so it seems more original.

Recently I picked up the first two chapters of Spider-man's 'Sinister War' Saga, mainly because I saw Mark Bagley was drawing some of it. Even at home, in private, reading it, I just feel silly. Regurgitated garbage. It could drawn by Michelangelo, it wouldn't save it. 

 

This is a good point as well.

There are a lot of great looking books out there that are nonsense to read and will probably kill a few brain cells.

Again, to Ken’s point, this is true through all ages.

I find more enjoyment reading books outside of Marvel/DC superheroes as well but sometimes the “regurgitated garbage” is familiar and comforting. 

[drotto]

Name me 5 new artists in the last 5 years that are truly great.  I have seen more bad art that has me scratching my head how it ever got published. It seems like Marvel especially is looking for cheap not good.  Not to say there is not good art, but most of it is being produced by guys that have been around for a fair amount of time.

[kav]

On 7/31/2021 at 5:07 PM, drotto said:

Name me 5 new artists in the last 5 years that are truly great.  I have seen more bad art that has me scratching my head how it ever got published. It seems like Marvel especially is looking for cheap not good.  Not to say there is not good art, but most of it is being produced by guys that have been around for a fair amount of time.

and likewise with their writers cheap not good.  Gabby Rivera for one example.  Just horribly bad and juvenile but Marvel dont gotta pay her much.

[Ken Aldred]

On 8/1/2021 at 1:07 AM, drotto said:

Name me 5 new artists in the last 5 years that are truly great.  I have seen more bad art that has me scratching my head how it ever got published. It seems like Marvel especially is looking for cheap not good.  Not to say there is not good art, but most of it is being produced by guys that have been around for a fair amount of time.

Couldn't that be said, for example, about the late 70s Bronze Age?

A very select few, younger, breakthrough artists such as John Byrne and Frank Miller becoming the hugely hyped-up megastars of the time, also Michael Golden and George Perez being very highly regarded, but then there were established stars such as Neal Adams, who'd been drawing prolifically since the 1960s?

Edited August 2, 2021 by Ken Aldred

[catman76]

Most of you need to get your head out of marvel and dc's a-s-s and look beyond the mainstream c-rap churned out by them. there are more great comics and comic artists right now and starting all the time then ever before really. It's like most people here and anywhere don't look beyond corporate marvel and dc crud and seem to have no idea anything exists outside of that. comics are thriving and greater than ever but you have to go looking for it, it;s not going to get fed to you like marvel crud is.

Edited August 2, 2021 by catman76
fixed the censored stuff

[Cat]

You're right, there's a lot of talent and great books being done from publishers who aren't Marvel and DC. However, at the same time, if some no name Indy can have phenomenal writing and art on a consistent basis, why can't Fantastic Four? Why can't Amazing Spider-Man? 

 

*Rhetorical question.