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[Crackandpresstoan11]

Ebay is a clearing house to assemble quick cash and therefore extremely volatile, with prices swaying widely, especially with more esoteric items.

Even Heritage, as large as they are, do not handle bids but from a small percentage of our collecting community.

 

Mark, you might like to search the forums for some statistics I wrote showing this not to be true - eBay often shows up with record prices.

 

George.

 

Thanks for pointing this out. I'm tired of hearing the argument that Ebay is full of "bottom-feeders", or is some kind of junk clearing house and does not reflect the true market. I wish dealers would stop trying to justify the ridiculous prices they offer books for by pulling this argument out of their [embarrassing lack of self control]. If you want to charge [embarrassing lack of self control] rape prices for your books, then fine. But stop trying to pretend Ebay is not the market, because it is.

[PGCMint]

Mark, you might like to search the forums for some statistics I wrote showing this not to be true - eBay often shows up with record prices.

 

George.

 

Hi George,

I knew my post may have a controversial effect and but it was not intended to downplay the role of the GPA. What I meant was that ebay, while it does command some great prices for a small percentage of books, yields mild to mixed results for the larger percentage. I have tested it with several combinations, at various times, and always willing to see it through, allowing the hammer to fall where it may. The results are mild at best, with the books that do extremely well not offsetting the books that fall flat. This is why the majority of auctions will have a high starting price or will have a reserve attached.

It is a great place to buy at times, but rarely does the great material suface here because of the problem with inconsistancy and low prices.

This is just my opinion based on my perspective I realize, but I have listed many auctions at no reserve that included some very nice books. I have also purchaced quite a bit as well.

This may lead to the conclusion for some that "ebay prices are what the market will bare" and that we dealers had better adjust our prices to match. That is silly, as ebay price swings are unpredictable and very unstable. Don't believe this? Well test this theory by offering the same book on four different occassions. The results are quite funny. I am always willing to learn but my information tells me that ebay prices are based on what certain bidders are willing to pay on a given week and that these results will change from week to week based on a mutitude of reasons.

 

Anyway, ebay is part of our hobby and can be a wonderful tool for collectors to find items they never could get their hands on otherwise but in my limited opinion, it is not THE hobby.

 

Take care

Mark

[gpanalysis]

Mark, you might like to search the forums for some statistics I wrote showing this not to be true - eBay often shows up with record prices.

 

George.

 

Hi George,

I knew my post may have a controversial effect and but it was not intended to downplay the role of the GPA. What I meant was that ebay, while it does command some great prices for a small percentage of books, yields mild to mixed results for the larger percentage. I have tested it with several combinations, at various times, and always willing to see it through, allowing the hammer to fall where it may. The results are mild at best, with the books that do extremely well not offsetting the books that fall flat. This is why the majority of auctions will have a high starting price or will have a reserve attached.

It is a great place to buy at times, but rarely does the great material suface here because of the problem with inconsistancy and low prices.

This is just my opinion based on my perspective I realize, but I have listed many auctions at no reserve that included some very nice books. I have also purchaced quite a bit as well.

This may lead to the conclusion for some that "ebay prices are what the market will bare" and that we dealers had better adjust our prices to match. That is silly, as ebay price swings are unpredictable and very unstable. Don't believe this? Well test this theory by offering the same book on four different occassions. The results are quite funny. I am always willing to learn but my information tells me that ebay prices are based on what certain bidders are willing to pay on a given week and that these results will change from week to week based on a mutitude of reasons.

 

Anyway, ebay is part of our hobby and can be a wonderful tool for collectors to find items they never could get their hands on otherwise but in my limited opinion, it is not THE hobby.

 

Take care

Mark

 

Hey Mark, I didn't take your post as down-playing GPA at all as I know you're a supporter. I was just remarking on the fact that eBay is often seen as the "bargain basement" for auctions when in fact it regularly brings in record prices. Some statistics you might find interesting (as posted in another thread)....

 

The top 1000 traded comic books have had their top price realized 100% of the time on eBay

 

The top 527 priced comics (traded at least twice) over the value of $3000 have seen top prizes realized through specific venues as follows:

 

heritage: 351 sales ($3,228,897.15, 73.62% of total top sales)

eBay: 160 sales ($952,972.42, 21.73 % of total top sales)

pedigree: 14 sales ($197,460.00, 4.50% of total top sales)

vault: 1 sale ($6,352.50, 0.14% of total top sales)

 

The top 1569 priced comics (traded at least twice) over the value of $1000 but below $3000 have seen top prizes realized through specific venues as follows:

 

heritage: 854 sales ($1,456,907.10, 55.91% of total top sales)

ebay: 677 sales ($1,087,161.10, 41.72% of total top sales)

pedigree: 24 sales ($38,801.00, 1.49% of total top sales)

vault: 8 sales ($11,625.43, 0.45% of total top sales)

mile high: 3 sales ($5,575.00, 0.21% of total top sales)

hakes: 2 sales ($4,300.00, 0.17% of total top sales)

mastronet: 1 sale ($1,428.30, 0.05% of total top sales)

 

So eBay does fairly well - I guess your experience might be different. I was certainly of the same opinion a few years ago when we used eBay a fair bit for auctioning off original art.

 

Anyway, as you know we track much more than eBay, with quite a bit of results now coming from dealers - I can't wait for your "button" to be ready so you can begin reporting to us also

 

Best

George

[Norrin_Radd]

You make some good points about prices realized on eBay and unpredictability of the market from week to week.

 

However, there are ways to mitigate that. You, the seller, set the price. Dealers who do well on eBay do so because they took the time to establish their presence there as a reputable seller. It's not easy and it takes time. But eBay can be a very good market for selling comics.

 

Part of the problem with getting good prices is that there are some comics that sell cheap because the seller is questionable. But that price is factored into the average. People remember that price and wonder why other (reputable) sellers set their prices so much higher. Because you will actually get what you are paying for! Everybody wants a good deal. But I think the fraud and poor grading turn alot of people off of eBay. There are good deals to be had but only if you can find sellers you can trust.

 

 

I agree that eBay is NOT the hobby. Collecting and reading comics is the hobby. EBay is just one of the many venues available to purchase comics.

[sfilosa]

Hey George:

 

I love your product, but you do realize that your analysis saying eBay has more recorded prices, is flawed.

 

Simply because you are only comparing it to other sites that provide information to you.

 

Other then Pedigree Comics, the rest of the sites are auction sites, and therefore are based on selling a book in a given time frame.

 

While I say your analysis is flaw, that doesn't mean that your conclusion doesn't have some validity.

[HouseofComics.Com]

I was definitely talking about HG CGC books (as that's what Mark sells). And mostly SA (though he does have some GA and BA on his site).

 

Part of the DC problem is that in HG, it's nearly impossible to put together full runs (even just the SA issues). That in itself eliminates a lot run collectors. And because there are very few true Key DC issues in the SA and BA compared to Marvel, that eliminates the Key buyers.

 

Thanks for the reply. That makes a lot of sense when you add in the scarcity and lack of SA keys.

 

Best,

Marc

[PGCMint]

Definately some awesome input here from several hobbists.

 

George, thanks for the remarkable statistics.

The one group of statistics that is large and unidentifed, is the private transactions. The dealer to collector, collector to collector, convention sales, and other private transactions. Most of the best collections are assembled this way, the greatest books being purchaced prior to arrival at auction. This is not always the case (as in the situation where cash has to be raised quickly, regardless of making a profit) but is the general rule in our hobby.

Auction Houses such as Heritage have the "up front" advance capital to entice customers in a way that ebay (and most dealers) cannot and therefore will score some pretty amazing stuff. That is one of the reasons that a Marvel Mystery #1 in 9.0 will suface at Heritage at no reserve and not on ebay. Heritage also aggressively persues the customers, where ebay is so huge (involved in an incredible number of markets) that it does not need to. The yield is greater activity in a single auction for Heritage and higher prices across the board, for the most part.

Yet still, private transactions foster even stronger interest and support.

If this were not so, than larger dealers such as Metropolis, Geppi, Comic Link, Bob Storms,etc., would just end their business and auction on ebay or the other auction sites. All of these dealers have tried it (for various reasons) but each of them do far better cultivating customers and selling in house. Each of the mentioned dealers know the hobby for greater than auction statistics can yield. They know what they are doing and they know their customer.

And finally, "private" is the key word here. Many people do not like their transaction recorded for several reasons and will therefore buy only through dealers or at conventions. This number is larger than many realize.

 

As for ebayers being "bottom feeders" Tom, I guess you would have to include me as well For I enjoy buying on ebay too and have for many years. Yes, there is a tremendous amount of average material but that material is really cool and inexpensive for the new collector or reader. And there are also some fantastic deals with high grade or rare items as well if you are patient and like to hunt (as most of us do). I say "most of us" because there are those who do not have the time, nor do they like the auction format. Interestingly, many of the great collections are not assembled by auction. But that is a subject for another time. In summery Tom, do what you like and enjoy it, regardless of what others say.

 

Mark

[PGCMint]

Anyway, as you know we track much more than eBay, with quite a bit of results now coming from dealers - I can't wait for your "button" to be ready so you can begin reporting to us also

Best

George

 

Hi again George

My button is up and running. It is on the left side of the Home page, right above that little hand on the safe dial.

All of the prices are the actual sales price, as opposed to the ask price.

Postage is not included in the reflected price either.

Take care

Mark

[gozer]

Psiknight wrote:

> if you think his prices are so astronomical, move on!

 

I have. I thought I made that clear. I spend zero time brooding about the high prices of a dealer's books. This is the first time I have ever commented about any facet of PGCMint's business. And I really only posted to bring up the example of the Magnus book.

 

 

Psiknight wrote:

> No reason to bash the man

 

I don't get it. Commenting on a dealer's prices is not "bashing" them personally. I don't know a thing about Mark, and I did not intend to attack him. Why would I? I admire him. I admire anyone with the gumption to start and run a business. I think Mile High's prices are way too high also ... is that "bashing" CR?

 

Have you considered that a dealer might actually find feedback valuable?

 

Mark is free to charge anything he pleases, and I'm free to state my opinion.

 

But "bash the man" ?? -- I think you're misinterpreting.

 

 

PGCMint wrote:

> my goal was to focus on that tiny piece of the market, the very high end.

 

And that's a perfectly rational business model -- I wish you well. I'm probably not a potential customer, but so what? I'm not a potential customer for the Rolls Royce company either.

 

But as someone else pointed out, the example of the FF #78 is interesting.

 

I think some people are too quick to see an insult where none was intended.

 

gozer

--------------------

If you do not remedy this malparkage within 72 hours, your car will be

thrown into the East River at your expense.

[Psiknight]

Psiknight wrote:

> if you think his prices are so astronomical, move on!

 

I have. I thought I made that clear. I spend zero time brooding about the high prices of a dealer's books. This is the first time I have ever commented about any facet of PGCMint's business. And I really only posted to bring up the example of the Magnus book.

 

 

Psiknight wrote:

> No reason to bash the man

 

I don't get it. Commenting on a dealer's prices is not "bashing" them personally. I don't know a thing about Mark, and I did not intend to attack him. Why would I? I admire him. I admire anyone with the gumption to start and run a business. I think Mile High's prices are way too high also ... is that "bashing" CR?

 

Have you considered that a dealer might actually find feedback valuable?

 

Mark is free to charge anything he pleases, and I'm free to state my opinion.

 

But "bash the man" ?? -- I think you're misinterpreting.

 

 

I wasn't directing my comments at you specifically, and I'm sorry you took them that way!

 

Many posters take high prices as some sort of character flaw (as in unethical) but I just don't see it that way. People tend to drone on and on about how X dealer's prices are too high and how Y dealer needs to offer better prices or service. There are so many dealers out there that I don't see the need to spend so much energy complaining (unless, as I suspect, many people are trying to get the dealer to lower his prices to make books they want attainable even if they are realistically not).

 

So, in summary, I didn't mean to offend!

[gpanalysis]

Hey George:

 

I love your product, but you do realize that your analysis saying eBay has more recorded prices, is flawed.

 

Simply because you are only comparing it to other sites that provide information to you.

 

Other then Pedigree Comics, the rest of the sites are auction sites, and therefore are based on selling a book in a given time frame.

 

While I say your analysis is flaw, that doesn't mean that your conclusion doesn't have some validity.

 

Hi Steve,

 

Yes, we are comparing ebay to only what else we track. However, I have asked this question before, as to if the prices you see on Heritage/eBay and a dozen other sites we track are still LOWER than what "major" dealers sell at, then why would anyone pay those top prices?

 

I am not talking about rare books, or top census where the price could go anywhere. And even in those scenarios, when the book is offered for sale more than once then there is the potential it will end up on an auction site. If it goes for less than what the dealer originally sold it, then how is that a bargain price as opposed to fair market value? The internet is now utilized by tens of thousands of collectors and dealers as a buying and selling venue.

 

If the book was to realize less every time through auction, then why ever offer books through ebay or any other auction venue at all? Why not go back to the dealer and try to sell for close to what the book was originally purchased at?

 

Take a book that has been sold say 4 times over the past year. It sells around the $2000 mark every time, and is a book at top census. If a dealer/site offered that book for $4000 and was sold at that price, then we would consider the other 4 prices low-ball? Correct? I just don't see how that can work. The reality is if the buyer tried to sell the book through open venues then he might realize a lot less.

 

Somehow we are meant to believe that only one-type of collector is looking at eBay and a different type is buying through private dealers, etc. Do you think this is true?

[gpanalysis]

Anyway, as you know we track much more than eBay, with quite a bit of results now coming from dealers - I can't wait for your "button" to be ready so you can begin reporting to us also

Best

George

 

Hi again George

My button is up and running. It is on the left side of the Home page, right above that little hand on the safe dial.

All of the prices are the actual sales price, as opposed to the ask price.

Postage is not included in the reflected price either.

Take care

Mark

 

Cool Mark. I'll speak with you about automating the results to us. Best, GP.

[silversurfer-migration]

hi

 

i was still wondering why you got kicked off ebay mark? you showed as not registered last i checked.

[nearmint]

Many posters take high prices as some sort of character flaw (as in unethical) but I just don't see it that way.

 

I agree. Mark certainly has books from my want list that are priced quite a bit higher than I'd be willing to pay(Fighting Yank #7 CGC 9.6!), but I certainly don't fault him for trying to get top dollar, and I still check his site frequently.

[sfilosa]

Somehow we are meant to believe that only one-type of collector is looking at eBay and a different type is buying through private dealers, etc. Do you think this is true?

 

 

Not usually. But there are still big time collectors that don't buy thru auction sites (Doug Schmell is one of them).

[PGCMint]

Cool Mark. I'll speak with you about automating the results to us. Best, GP.

Hi George

Automating the results???

Hey, I am just learning how to navgate the Boards

I'll need some help here George but will be glad to do it.

Take care

Mark

[PGCMint]

I agree. Mark certainly has books from my want list that are priced quite a bit higher than I'd be willing to pay(Fighting Yank #7 CGC 9.6!), but I certainly don't fault him for trying to get top dollar, and I still check his site frequently.

 

Just a quick note - The Fighting Yank is sold and gone.

[PGCMint]

hi

 

i was still wondering why you got kicked off ebay mark? you showed as not registered last i checked.

 

I wrote a thread about this but don't mind addressing it again. It was an administrative problem, one that I cannot see the rational. But ebay has millions of sellers and cannot look at every problem, and so I have to wait for 30 days before I can start up again. I have appealed four times, to no avail. I will be back in ebay biz by November 13th. So look for my auctions at that time.

[PGCMint]

Where I think most dealers seem to "offend" potential clients, is with the higher graded books, that are actually rather common in high grade.

 

Example Fantastic Four #78 in CGC 9.4.

That book is very common. You have a price of $250 (guide is $65 in NM-).

 

This price has been adjusted to $195.00. I see your point with this book and adjusted to triple guide. Thanks for the info

Mark

[Crackandpresstoan11]

What happened to the Atom #8? Did you sell it??