"These'll pay for my kid's college..." 5 5

[MAR1979]

On 12/22/2021 at 12:06 AM, onlyweaknesskryptonite said:

While I have seen these numbers or at least variations of them.  They seem skewed.  I do realize they did multiple prints of Superman #75 still with that there was so much more coverage.  Shops had customers lining streets to get it. I do not remember the same fan fair for xmen 1  .

Only thing I can think of was that a lot of places ran out of Sup 75 and there were a lot of instant resellers marking up $25+ for each copy. 

Still seems like it would be over that $3m estimate.  

Yes, Superman #75 had more media coverage.

Not sure how many retailers truly ran out or like my LCS at the time was "screwing" loyal customers to make a quick buck.

Found out from a buddy who worked at my LCS is reason there was no #75 for regulars on release day was;  my LCS owner had all his #75 copies placed in his back office. Selling them for $25 to $50 to the those jumpin' on the bandwagon.  Those folks of course never, ever, never, ever came back. All one-and-done.  From that point on I went from spending $40-$60 per week at that shop to purchasing less than 10 books over the next 20 years there.  The owner of the new shop I became a regular at said I was not alone in my actions in fact i started to notice a lot my old shop's regular's there. The Superman #75 was straw that broke camels back. He pulled similar nonsense with X-Force 1 copies with what at the time contained the desirable Cable card.

Approx 10 years later I happened to stop by the old shop and the owner asked if I had moved as he has not seen me in years. I explained the Superman #75 incident and he did not seem to understand. He said he was making fast profit per book why wouldn't he do that.  I proceed to explain how just on me alone how many 10's of thousands of dollars of profit he left on table to gain a quick few buck's to people who never patronized his shop again. He still did not get it.   While the guy did make a living for 2+ decades from his shop, he could have been making so much more money...  I've found in my life more times than not that "small business owner" = "small mind". 

 

Those thinking they are smart for holding on the 90's glut drek for 30 years. You got LUCKY with COVID. Pure luck does not equal business skill.  The bubble is bursting however and will likley have ramifications that last multiple years. Prices on Glut era books are already less than half their peak and dropping - just look at ASM 361.  Sell now,  be willing to take under going rate of the day just to finally get rid of the stuff as in the near future it again will be nearly dead product. 

 

Edited December 22, 2021 by MAR1979

[MAR1979]

On 12/21/2021 at 8:51 PM, UncleBEN said:

If you were a condition collector in the 90's , and borderline hoarder I think you are doing okay for return on investment.

i won't disclose how many of these I had or currently have but so far all 9.8's to 9.9's

ASM 300 (9.8's, and 1 9.9)

Wolverine Mini 1-4 (9.9's)

Dark Knight (9.8's)

And there are a lot more examples of a pretty significant return for investment , silly really.

I do wish I would have picked up an Action 1 a decade earlier in place of stockpiling .

Those are 80's books - did you mean 80's hoarder? If so that was not the topic at hand and much easier to make bank with books from that decade than with early 90's glut. 

9.9's yeah that's decent money, not sure how you managed multiple copies from raw purchases in that grade unless you had buddy planted at CGC grading the books   However, 9.9 or 10's are outliers to these type of conversations. They are a privileged class all their own.

Edited December 22, 2021 by MAR1979

[Hamlet]

On 12/22/2021 at 8:35 AM, MAR1979 said:

Those thinking they are smart for holding on the 90's glut drek for 30 years. You got LUCKY with COVID. Pure luck does not equal business skill.  The bubble is bursting however and will likley have ramifications that last multiple years. Prices on Glut era books are already less than half their peak and dropping - just look at ASM 361.  Sell now,  be willing to take under going rate of the day just to finally get rid of the stuff as in the near future it again will be nearly dead product. 

I don’t think anyone is thinking they are “smart” for holding onto these books, they were just pointing out that it actually turned out to be okay money-wise.  I think most of the people who held onto them did so for the same reason I hold onto a bunch of worthless books- it is more work to do anything else with them, and occasionally some of them “pop”.

As collectors, we tend to accumulate worthless books.  If we are people who buy collections and/or do a little dealing, we accumulate a lot of worthless books.  I bought a few collections in the late 80s and every one of them had a set of Secret Wars in it.  Those books were absolutely worthless when I bought them, but I carried them around with me anyway.  At some point people started to care about SW8 and also started to buy sets on Ebay.  I sold all the complete sets I had for what was small money, but pure gravy to me, since I considered the books mostly worthless, and I had multiples.  I was left with my personal set, a really nice extra SW8, and a couple extra SW1s.  I sold the SW8 for $100 at MCS ( way too early turns out ).  That was more than I paid for the whole collection it came in.

That doesn’t make me a brilliant investor.  It’s just found money to me.  I’m not hanging onto my Wolverine 50s and MCP 90s ( my original failed spec books ) because I think I’ll make a killing with them eventually.  I mentally wrote that money off in the 90s.  I’m hanging onto them because there isn’t any real downside to having them sit in a long box in the corner of my comic book room, and they aren’t worth the energy to sell for pennies.  If they become worth selling, it isn’t going to make me a brilliant investor, but I will think “hey, I actually did okay with those, who would have thunk?”  
 

 

[Ablation Steve]

Thanks to all of those who actually read the initial post and responded to the fun-natured spirit of what this thread was actually about!

For other responders, I will keep a bookmark to this thread when I want to explain to someone what a strawman argument is.

Peace, all. Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays.

Edited December 22, 2021 by Ablation Steve

[piper]

On 12/22/2021 at 9:08 AM, Hamlet said:

I don’t think anyone is thinking they are “smart” for holding onto these books, they were just pointing out that it actually turned out to be okay money-wise.  I think most of the people who held onto them did so for the same reason I hold onto a bunch of worthless books- it is more work to do anything else with them, and occasionally some of them “pop”.

As collectors, we tend to accumulate worthless books.  If we are people who buy collections and/or do a little dealing, we accumulate a lot of worthless books.  I bought a few collections in the late 80s and every one of them had a set of Secret Wars in it.  Those books were absolutely worthless when I bought them, but I carried them around with me anyway.  At some point people started to care about SW8 and also started to buy sets on Ebay.  I sold all the complete sets I had for what was small money, but pure gravy to me, since I considered the books mostly worthless, and I had multiples.  I was left with my personal set, a really nice extra SW8, and a couple extra SW1s.  I sold the SW8 for $100 at MCS ( way too early turns out ).  That was more than I paid for the whole collection it came in.

That doesn’t make me a brilliant investor.  It’s just found money to me.  I’m not hanging onto my Wolverine 50s and MCP 90s ( my original failed spec books ) because I think I’ll make a killing with them eventually.  I mentally wrote that money off in the 90s.  I’m hanging onto them because there isn’t any real downside to having them sit in a long box in the corner of my comic book room, and they aren’t worth the energy to sell for pennies.  If they become worth selling, it isn’t going to make me a brilliant investor, but I will think “hey, I actually did okay with those, who would have thunk?”  
 

 

The “found money” argument makes perfect sense to me. Sadly my SW books are long gone.

I did better than Ok on the Gold and Silver that I picked up, so I can’t complain.

 

[MAR1979]

On 12/22/2021 at 10:36 AM, Ablation Steve said:

Thanks to all of those who actually read the initial post and responded to the fun-natured spirit of what this thread was actually about!

For other responders, I will keep a bookmark to this thread when I want to explain to someone what a strawman argument is.

Peace, all. Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays.

I do admire your idealism if you thought it would be different on an internet forum

Edited December 22, 2021 by MAR1979

[piper]

On 12/21/2021 at 12:27 PM, Wolverinex said:

Unless it's a very high-grade copy,  I don't know if it could really pay off 4 years of a private school college education

I continue to be amazed at how much university costs on the other side of the border for your basic 4 year degree.

Costs have started to climb in Canada, but it looks like tuition is minimum 3 to 4 times what we pay here. Law School in Edmonton costs ~ 12k CAD per year. An undergrad in Engineering is significantly less and I can’t believe how little I paid back I. The 90’s.

[Robot Man]

On 12/22/2021 at 7:08 AM, Hamlet said:

I don’t think anyone is thinking they are “smart” for holding onto these books, they were just pointing out that it actually turned out to be okay money-wise.  I think most of the people who held onto them did so for the same reason I hold onto a bunch of worthless books- it is more work to do anything else with them, and occasionally some of them “pop”.

As collectors, we tend to accumulate worthless books.  If we are people who buy collections and/or do a little dealing, we accumulate a lot of worthless books.  I bought a few collections in the late 80s and every one of them had a set of Secret Wars in it.  Those books were absolutely worthless when I bought them, but I carried them around with me anyway.  At some point people started to care about SW8 and also started to buy sets on Ebay.  I sold all the complete sets I had for what was small money, but pure gravy to me, since I considered the books mostly worthless, and I had multiples.  I was left with my personal set, a really nice extra SW8, and a couple extra SW1s.  I sold the SW8 for $100 at MCS ( way too early turns out ).  That was more than I paid for the whole collection it came in.

That doesn’t make me a brilliant investor.  It’s just found money to me.  I’m not hanging onto my Wolverine 50s and MCP 90s ( my original failed spec books ) because I think I’ll make a killing with them eventually.  I mentally wrote that money off in the 90s.  I’m hanging onto them because there isn’t any real downside to having them sit in a long box in the corner of my comic book room, and they aren’t worth the energy to sell for pennies.  If they become worth selling, it isn’t going to make me a brilliant investor, but I will think “hey, I actually did okay with those, who would have thunk?”  
 

 

I quit buying new comics about 15 or so years ago. Got bored with them and they took up too much space. I still stacked up many of boxes of 1970’s-early 1990’s books. Bagged and boarded in boxes in the garage. Every once in a while, when I hear a book has gotton “hot”, I go out and check. I usually have it and although, I rarely speculated, I found numerous copies. I bought ASM 300 (10 copies) because I really liked it. A small stack of Eternals #1, 5 sets of the Star Wars Return of the Jedi story arc because I liked the Williamson art. And other single issues. 

Shocked at what they are going for. So I would send in these carefully selected copies for grading and selling them off here and there. I have made WAY more money selling off a few than I paid for all of them.

Rarely, did I ever think they would go for what they do now. 

[skypinkblu]

On 12/22/2021 at 11:06 AM, piper said:

I continue to be amazed at how much university costs on the other side of the border for your basic 4 year degree.

Costs have started to climb in Canada, but it looks like tuition is minimum 3 to 4 times what we pay here. Law School in Edmonton costs ~ 12k CAD per year. An undergrad in Engineering is significantly less and I can’t believe how little I paid back I. The 90’s.

Most States have a State University system here. I just looked and SUNY Albany (State of NY) is still about $10k for a year if you live in NY, $15 k a year if you live in another State..  What you are seeing are tuitions from Private schools.  You can usually get a scholarship from a private school if your grads are good enough or your income is low. Not always of course.

[Hamlet]

On 12/22/2021 at 10:06 AM, piper said:

I continue to be amazed at how much university costs on the other side of the border for your basic 4 year degree.

Costs have started to climb in Canada, but it looks like tuition is minimum 3 to 4 times what we pay here. Law School in Edmonton costs ~ 12k CAD per year. An undergrad in Engineering is significantly less and I can’t believe how little I paid back I. The 90’s.

It has gone up a lot, although the numbers people are talking about are here for private schools.  In-state tuition at state schools are quite a bit better ( although still painfully expensive).

For example, in-state tuition at the U of Minn is about 15k per year.  

[lostboys]

90s books may have been overprinted but :

 

world population 1995 = 5.7 billion

world population 2020 = 7.8 billion

 

^^^ This has to matter...no?

[Robot Man]

On 12/21/2021 at 8:55 PM, sckao said:

1. X-Men (1991) No. 1 (7.1 Million copies) (They say 8.1 million copies pre-ordered.)
2. X-Force (1992) No. 1 (5 Million copies) (This number is at odds with other sources)
3. Adventures of Superman (1987) No. 500 (4.2 Million copies)
4. Superman (1987) No. 75 (3 Million copies) (This number has been reported as high as 6 million.)
5. Spider-Man (1990) No. 1 (2.5 Million copies)
6. Action Comics (1938) No. 687 (1.8 Million copies)
7. Superman (1987) No. 78 (1.78 million copies)
8. Adventures of Superman (1987) No. 501 (1.72 million copies)
9. Superman: Man of Steel (1991) No. 22 (1.71 Million copies)
10. Spawn (1992) No. 1 (1.7 Million copies)

Top 10 Best Selling Comic Books Of The Modern Era - Zap-Kapow Comics (zapkapowcomics.com)

This still amazes me. With print runs like this and people hoarding away tons of these, who in their right mind would pay today’s prices for them? It just doesn’t make any logical sense…

[Hamlet]

On 12/22/2021 at 10:50 AM, Robot Man said:

This still amazes me. With print runs like this and people hoarding away tons of these, who in their right mind would pay today’s prices for them? It just doesn’t make any logical sense…

Well, to be fair, collecting in general doesn’t make much logical sense.  And none of this is huge money.  If someone decides to spend $100 to buy the Magneto cover of X-men 1 in 9.8 because it looks cool, that isn’t really that big of a deal for most people financially.  I suppose in some sense it is a fairly important issue historically.  I’ve certainly spent $100 in dumber ways than that, many, many times.

Heck, I have a long box of books that I had passed on for $1/each that I bought a week later for 4/$1.  This was in the past month.  That $70 purchase does not make much logical sense.  The whole collecting world is trying to shed themselves of drek, and here I am hoovering it up. There aren’t any X-men 1s in that box, but there were a whole bunch of 90s Batmans and Detectives, along with the 87 series of Silver Surfer, Micronauts, The Nam, New Mutants, X-factor, 80s Conans, etc.  They all share the characteristic that no one was willing to pay a dollar for them.

As you can see, I really don’t like to go home empty-handed. 😀

Edited December 22, 2021 by Hamlet

[Robot Man]

On 12/22/2021 at 9:17 AM, Hamlet said:

Well, to be fair, collecting in general doesn’t make much logical sense.  And none of this is huge money.  If someone decides to spend $100 to buy the Magneto cover of X-men 1 in 9.8 because it looks cool, that isn’t really that big of a deal for most people financially.  I suppose in some sense it is a fairly important issue historically.  I’ve certainly spent $100 in dumber ways than that, many, many times.

Heck, I have a long box of books that I had passed on for $1/each that I bought a week later for 4/$1.  This was in the past month.  That $70 purchase does not make much logical sense.  The whole collecting world is trying to shed themselves of drek, and here I am hoovering it up. There aren’t any X-men 1s in that box, but there were a whole bunch of 90s Batmans and Detectives, along with the 87 series of Silver Surfer, Micronauts, The Nam, New Mutants, X-factor, 80s Conans, etc.  They all share the characteristic that no one was willing to pay a dollar for them.

As you can see, I really don’t like to go home empty-handed. 😀

At this point in my life, I am more than happy to go home empty handed. I have become VERY selective. I no longer “buy them all” but instead just cherry pick the stuff I want. I just don’t want to store or deal with tons of worthless books. Unless, they are GA or SA witch rarely happens any more. 

[onlyweaknesskryptonite]

On 12/22/2021 at 2:26 AM, Coverless 9.8 said:

Comics paid for my kids schooling!  They attended the School Of Hard Knocks!  

[onlyweaknesskryptonite]

On 12/22/2021 at 10:50 AM, Robot Man said:

This still amazes me. With print runs like this and people hoarding away tons of these, who in their right mind would pay today’s prices for them? It just doesn’t make any logical sense…

[WolverineX]

On 12/22/2021 at 11:06 AM, piper said:

I continue to be amazed at how much university costs on the other side of the border for your basic 4 year degree.

Costs have started to climb in Canada, but it looks like tuition is minimum 3 to 4 times what we pay here. Law School in Edmonton costs ~ 12k CAD per year. An undergrad in Engineering is significantly less and I can’t believe how little I paid back I. The 90’s.

Healthcare and education costs are insane in the land of the free.  

[sckao]

The average cost of tuition for a resident University of California undergraduate year is $36,700 with $19.5k of that allotted for room/board/transportation. All of these things you would have to pay anyway if you went to work and lived outside your parent's house anyway. So the tuition/books and supplies/insurance part of it is really only $17.1k a year.

If you go to an in-state Community College for the first two years and then transfer to the UC System as a junior, your average cost would then be around $3-4k a year.

Out of state students have to pay 2.5X roughly I'd say for tuition.

[shadroch]

On 12/22/2021 at 1:54 AM, lou_fine said:

What's the odds of you being able to pick out a 9.8 condition quality book from the $1 BIN fodder that's been sitting in those boxes for years (if not decades), as opposed to getting it in your typical money losing condition quality?  

You must have a LOT of free time on your hands if you have the time to ship overprinted drek books to CGC for grading 1,000 times hoping against hope for a CGC 9.8 grade so that you can list them 1,000 times hoping to make say $10 or $20 on average for each book by the time you factor in your money losing books.    

Why does it have to be in 9.8?  Why does it have to be slabbed at all?  

[MAR1979]

On 12/22/2021 at 11:49 AM, lostboys said:

90s books may have been overprinted but :

 

world population 1995 = 5.7 billion

world population 2020 = 7.8 billion

 

^^^ This has to matter...no?

It does very much to Thanos.

 

BTW new comic sales have steadily decreased and will continue to do so.  There are less Comic Collectors now than 12,15,20,25,30 years ago. Although it's slightly more cool to do so than at any point in history - so there's that.

 

Edited December 22, 2021 by MAR1979