DR.X Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 Structurally this book is around a 5.0 but the C.F. is detached. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe Elf Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 Detached centerfold is going to limit you to a 2.0; 2.5 at best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrRoboto Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 2.0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grendelbo Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 Books can grade as high as 6.0 with a completely detached centerfold. Unless I'm missing something.... @The Lions Den @zzutak I'm going to say 5.0/5.5. Thanks for sharing Mars76, Februus and Mojohand 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bayowolf Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 "Books can grade as high as 6.0 with a completely detached centerfold." Well then I'd say 5.5. Question: Is this one of those cases where slight use of tape to keep centerfold in place would be acceptable without lowering grade? grendelbo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grendelbo Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 On 4/12/2022 at 8:19 PM, Bayowolf said: Question: Is this one of those cases where slight use of tape to keep centerfold in place would be acceptable without lowering grade? Tape elsewhere though. Would it get a Restored label? But that's glue. "Currently, CGC’s stance on tape allows for its presence to fix a detached cover, a tear or to re-attach a piece of the comic." What about centerfolds? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DR.X Posted April 13, 2022 Author Share Posted April 13, 2022 A friend of mine, and boardie has a CGC 7.0 with a detached center fold. Mars76, Februus and grendelbo 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grendelbo Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 (edited) On 4/12/2022 at 9:07 PM, DR.X said: A friend of mine, and boardie has a CGC 7.0 with a detached center fold. I didn't think they would grade so high. That's better. Edited April 13, 2022 by grendelbo DR.X 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe Elf Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 Because CGC always gets the grade right, and never misses anything in grading (or if they do, it's immediately caught and corrected in Quality Control). grendelbo and DR.X 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DR.X Posted April 13, 2022 Author Share Posted April 13, 2022 this is a tough call. I don't think you can give a structurally graded book say in 5.0 the same grade. the question is how much should get knocked off? I would say a full point at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe Elf Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 I mean, I get that there are pics. But I defy anyone to show me any widely-accepted grading standard that allows for a detached centerfold in anything above 4.0 (VG) condition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grendelbo Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 On 4/12/2022 at 9:12 PM, DR.X said: this is a tough call. I don't think you can give a structurally graded book say in 5.0 the same grade. the question is how much should get knocked off? I would say a full point at least. Matter of opinion, but this example doesn't look better than a 5.5. On 4/12/2022 at 9:15 PM, Axe Elf said: But I defy anyone to show me any widely-accepted grading standard that allows for a detached centerfold in anything above 4.0 (VG) condition. I don't have the answers. I'm on the same journey as the rest of the forum - decoding and reverse-engineering CGC standards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DR.X Posted April 13, 2022 Author Share Posted April 13, 2022 On 4/12/2022 at 10:24 PM, grendelbo said: Matter of opinion, but this example doesn't look better than a 5.5. I don't have the answers. I'm on the same journey as the rest of the forum - decoding and reverse-engineering CGC standards. that was my point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DR.X Posted April 13, 2022 Author Share Posted April 13, 2022 On 4/12/2022 at 10:15 PM, Axe Elf said: I mean, I get that there are pics. But I defy anyone to show me any widely-accepted grading standard that allows for a detached centerfold in anything above 4.0 (VG) condition. No one can show you something that does not exist. If you look at the Overstreet Grading guides ( with a grain of salt ) they are at 2.5 with a detached C.F. in edition 2. So what's puzzling is if a book is a 9.0 structurally, or a 7.5, or 5.5. they all get put in the 2.5 category? I don't think so. grendelbo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe Elf Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 On 4/12/2022 at 10:24 PM, grendelbo said: I don't have the answers. I'm on the same journey as the rest of the forum - decoding and reverse-engineering CGC standards. Part of that process is understanding what is code and what is noise. I think it's fair to assume (from what I've read in these forums, not from personal experience) that while CGC is the only game in town, they are far from infallible. I just know I'd be kinda torqued if I bought a book graded 7.0 and the centerfold was detached. I guess maybe inside a slab it doesn't matter that much. grendelbo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe Elf Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 On 4/12/2022 at 10:27 PM, DR.X said: No one can show you something that does not exist. If you look at the Overstreet Grading guides ( with a grain of salt ) they are at 2.5 with a detached C.F. in edition 2. So what's puzzling is if a book is a 9.0 structurally, or a 7.5, or 5.5. they all get put in the 2.5 category? I don't think so. Well, I kinda think that they do. It's unfortunate, but that's what drags down ANY book, is the flaws it has--not what it would be if it didn't have those flaws. This is also what protects the value of ACTUAL mid- to high-grade comics--not letting comics with serious flaws be graded in the same categories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DR.X Posted April 13, 2022 Author Share Posted April 13, 2022 On 4/12/2022 at 10:30 PM, Axe Elf said: Well, I kinda think that they do. It's unfortunate, but that's what drags down ANY book, is the flaws it has--not what it would be if it didn't have those flaws. And this is where the debate/argument would come in. I don't think you can have different grade deductions for structurally different books. Bringing a 9.0 detached centerfold down to 2.5 is a 6.5 difference. Taking a 5.0 book with a detached centerfold down to 2.5 is 2.5 difference. Regardless, it's still the same defect. A detached center fold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grendelbo Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 Most grading standards (Overstreet, Heritage, MyComicShop) won't allow a detached centerfold until the GD range. CBCS is the only deviation other than CGC that I know of. FINE 7.0 TO 5.5 7.0 FINE / VERY FINE 6.5 FINE+ 6.0 FINE 5.5 FINE– This comic is definitely a read copy with handling wear, but can still be a very desirable copy. This could have one major defect like a larger piece out of the cover, a long tear or a detached centerfold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe Elf Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 On 4/12/2022 at 10:34 PM, DR.X said: And this is where the debate/argument would come in. I don't think you can have different grade deductions for structurally different books. Bringing a 9.0 detached centerfold down to 2.5 is a 6.5 difference. Taking a 5.0 book with a detached centerfold down to 2.5 is 2.5 difference. Regardless, it's still the same defect. A detached center fold. Yes, and to me, a detached centerfold indicates a book that is in no better than G/VG condition--no matter how pretty it is otherwise. Just like if you have an otherwise 9.0 book that has a full length color breaking crease. You can't say, "Well, I can't dock it five full points for a full length color-breaking crease; let's just call it a 7.0 instead of a 4.0." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe Elf Posted April 13, 2022 Share Posted April 13, 2022 On 4/12/2022 at 10:37 PM, grendelbo said: This could have one major defect like a larger piece out of the cover, a long tear or a detached centerfold. I'm probly gonna get my butt kicked in the grading contest, but I'd still be torqued if I paid 7.0 price for a comic of any value and got one with a detached centerfold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
