Cleaning. Comics vs coins. Why is it okay to clean a comic, but not a coin? 0

[Twisted_Road]

Just want a friendly debate.

Comic cleaning seems acceptable (by CGC and others, to a degree).

Coin cleaning seems unacceptable from what I read (in the last 6 mo after inheriting a collection).

Am I incorrect in assuming that the two markets disagree on the practice of cleaning? 

I'm thinking that there is a point where too much cleaning is too much; with comics too white, perhaps, with coins, too clean, perhaps. But, the line in the sand isn't complete clear to me as a newbie. I've seen comics cleaned and received a restored label, likely because they cleaned the cover and not the interior pages; yet they probably did and resubmitted.

I am biased, but it seems to me that if you make things look more presentable, they can be more worthy (Vs. if you take too much filth off of something, it isn't as valuable; and cleaning is restoration), as long as you don't do anything that hinders the value long term (e.g., a deficit to the paper or coin that will or may occur long-term; but I don't think we're there yet).

I'm guessing the answer is "the process" and the "process" is subjective.

Thoughts?

Edited November 27, 2022 by Twisted_Road

[KCOComics]

I think it's important to understand what level of cleaning is "acceptable" in comic collecting. 

Cleaning comics with chemicals or whitening pages, would be considered restoration.  And restoration is generally frowned on and hurts the value of a book. 

"Dry cleaning" is acceptable by many and not considered restoration by CGC.  Dry cleaning is essentially using an eraser type thing to wipe away debris and potentially remove things like pencil marks or light pen marks. It's not a catch all and often the difference with dry cleaning is minimal. 

[Twisted_Road]

Yes. they used something....not saying what...to whiten the covers, but the interior pages were yellow.

Edited November 27, 2022 by Twisted_Road

[Gaard]

<--- knows nothing about coins

 

What do you mean you can't clean coins? Obviously you can wipe them off with a tissue. You mean collector's can't use cleaning agents?

[Twisted_Road]

That is exactly where I am...

I know about books and care about books.

Coin collectors seem to want signs of use and age (unless, say a "modern" coin).

You can "clean" a coin with "chemicals", an ultrasonic cleaner, you name it...but the coin collecting community and grading companies seem to be against it (if the coin is "too clean" or has signs of swirl marks, due to rubbing; said as a newbie). 

It seems to me, based on my limited information, that coin cleaning is judged more stricter than cleaning comics (not talking about acceptable dry cleaning). I don't clean books and I don't mind a dirty book. Perhaps, it is just odd to me that coin cleaning seems easier, yet is unacceptable.  Sure, two different markets and both have different materials, but it seems to me that the coin market is harsher against any cleaning vs the comic market. 

[SilverAgeGuy]

I think it comes down to what they are made out of.  If comics, like coins, could withstand a fair bit of handling without losing a grade or 5, we would likely be a lot more particular about cleaning and pressing of comics as well.

[FoggyNelson]

Good question👍‼️

[Twisted_Road]

I'm not going to comment on the type of cleaning, def not dry cleaning...but, yes, it was a mixed method, with liquid and some something else. I suspect, as well as others, that the covers looked too "clean" and the interiors were yellow. It came back as a "professional restoration." I don't want to go any future here about the process used in that case in public and it wasn't my book and I don't trust it.

 

And, for the sake of argument, perhaps that is okay...for now and forever. I'm more on the side of coin cleaners (def different material).I have nothing against proper pressing and proper dry cleaning. 

Edited November 28, 2022 by Twisted_Road

[jimhopkins82]

Cleaning coins often leaves micro/hairline scratches all over the coin and also often leaves a coin looking unnatural like a coin having visible wear and being “shiny” at the same time.  I used to collect German/Holy Roman Empire Thalers and Spanish Netherlands coinage and while I’m not an expert by any means, cleaned coins are often pretty easy to identify with experience.  

Edited November 28, 2022 by jimhopkins82

[jimhopkins82]

Also, silver coins tone to various degrees over time so collectors who collect older coins expect and want the natural toning on their coins and cleaning totally removes that.  Here’s a few coins and medals I still have for example.

[COI]

It's okay to clean (and press) a comic because collectors and grading companies like money.

[Tec-Tac-Toe]

On 11/27/2022 at 11:12 PM, COI said:

It's okay to clean (and press) a comic because collectors and grading companies like money.

Including coins.

[Robot Man]

I think just cleaning a coin with water and maybe some dish soap using your fingers rather than harsh chemicals, a brush or rubbing with a cloth would be OK. I have cleaned coins dug with a metal detector that way. You don’t lose the patina but make them legible. I am not a coin collector though.

Interesting how different hobbies treat restoration.

Take classic cars and motorcycles. It is perfectly acceptable and even rewarded to fully restore them. There is a large group of people who treasure “survivors”. Vehicles that are fixed to good running condition and just cleaned up. They have that honest wear that shows their age.

During Covid, I fully restored a 1949 Indian Scout. I went the full restore route and am very happy with it. I am now looking at another bike that I think I’m going to go with the “survivor” route to it. Either one will enhance the value.