COMIC STORES 2023: 'IT'S NEARLY 2024 AND I'M MORE THAN CONCERNED' 4 4

[NP_Gresham]

Comics vs cards is like boxing vs Football

Cards and the NFL want the product viewed/sold everywhere at every price point.

Comics and Boxing want to squeeze every dime at every sale and are very exclusive with Direct sales and pay per view on every unit/ big fight.

The exclusivity and maxing out each individual sale over time simply kills the golden goose.

Fewer fans give a krap about boxing any more and Comics are circling the drain.

Meanwhile the NFL keeps drawing more interest by always having games available on free TV. And cards can be found in all the places comics abandoned years ago.

[KCOComics]

On 12/3/2023 at 12:38 PM, october said:

His story is pretty interesting, if you have some time to delve deeper. He was not a comic artist at all, total accident that he ended up on some St. Johns covers. 

More of the story.

 

Imagine finding one if this original paintings today? What's interesting is,  however has them,  likely has no association with comics and has no idea what collectors would pay for them.  

 

Thanks for posting this! Really interesting read! 

[Lazyboy]

On 12/3/2023 at 2:48 PM, NP_Gresham said:

Comics vs cards is like boxing vs Football

Cards and the NFL want the product viewed/sold everywhere at every price point.

Comics and Boxing want to squeeze every dime at every sale and are very exclusive with Direct sales and pay per view on every unit/ big fight.

The exclusivity and maxing out each individual sale over time simply kills the golden goose.

Fewer fans give a krap about boxing any more and Comics are circling the drain.

Meanwhile the NFL keeps drawing more interest by always having games available on free TV. And cards can be found in all the places comics abandoned years ago.

Comics never wanted newsstand distributors and retailers to drop them. That was not the publishers' choice. They just reacted and gave a chance to somebody who presented them with another option.

[Lazyboy]

On 12/3/2023 at 12:15 PM, VintageComics said:

Old school collectors used to hunt down everything their favorite creators did, no matter how small it was.

You're right, everyone used to collect exactly the same way. You're always right... if right means wrong.

[Lazyboy]

On 12/3/2023 at 9:43 AM, VintageComics said:

I asked which age range you were in and you never answered. I ask because you sound quite a bit younger than me.

I am about a decade younger than you, as if that has any relevance.

On 12/3/2023 at 9:43 AM, VintageComics said:

More impatient

You have no idea how wrong you are. Not that that's anything new.

On 12/3/2023 at 9:43 AM, VintageComics said:

your timeline focus is very narrow (I'm surprised you didn't throw in an "OK Boomer")

Or maybe I just actually care about context, because context always matters.

On 12/3/2023 at 9:43 AM, VintageComics said:

you have trouble following the string of discussion.

No, I don't have any trouble following things, unless those things are incoherent ramblings.

[Lazyboy]

On 12/3/2023 at 9:43 AM, VintageComics said:

Comics today have less text.

Which comics today? Less text than what?

On 12/3/2023 at 9:43 AM, VintageComics said:

Comics today are driven more by the art than the story. I mean, isn't this a common complaint about comic writers over the past few years?

That's not the common complaint I've heard.

On 12/3/2023 at 9:43 AM, VintageComics said:

Collectors today, who are the readers of yesterday (and yesterday can be as soon as 5-10 years ago) are less interested in content and more interested in splashy pages and covers.

Some are, for sure, though they aren't necessarily the readers of yesterday (or ever). But those people are not the majority.

[Lightning55]

On 12/3/2023 at 3:18 PM, VintageComics said:

Why would you go straight to a smear without showing ANY proof of your claim, except to try to discredit the source so you don't have to discuss the topic? That's a loser's attitude but understandable considering you've already told everyone to conform or die. 

I have already shown my work with immutable proof in many ways, and yet rather than try to dispute my longform work which is clearly there for anyone to do, you just threw out an insult with no other purpose than to smear the messenger. 

Either discredit the message using logic, or not. 

If people that believe what you espouse had their borders stormed by enemy forces, they'd be handing over their women and children using this philosophy. 

I'm not smearing you, or arguing with you, just stating my opinion. If your "message" is true, for me it falls under "that's the way it is - whatever". If not true, it's conspiracy theory. Either way, it's not something you, I, or anyone can do much about. So it's unimportant. Way down on the list of things that directly affect me, or that are significant concerns to me. Apparently different for you, and that's fine, too.

I'm saying life rolls along. Social situations, politics, big business will all evolve to fit ever-changing dynamics. Unless you are one of the power players, you just do your best to navigate the system, and maybe use your vote to elect leaders you believe will push things in a direction that benefits people in general.

Please note above that you, who complains about being personally attacked, were quick to call me a loser.

 

[VintageComics]

On 12/3/2023 at 5:07 PM, Lightning55 said:

I'm not smearing you, or arguing with you, just stating my opinion. If your "message" is true, for me it falls under "that's the way it is - whatever". If not true, it's conspiracy theory. Either way, it's not something you, I, or anyone can do much about. So it's unimportant. Way down on the list of things that directly affect me, or that are significant concerns to me. Apparently different for you, and that's fine, too.

"That's the way it is - whatever" is only the way it is if people choose to accept it. 

Hitler only rose to power because the general population in Germany accepted it and didn't oppose it. That's why the entire country accepts responsibility today for it. 

Very different than when a dictator takes over against he will of the people through force and only the dictator is held accountable. 

Your choices do matter, every day. 

On 12/3/2023 at 5:07 PM, Lightning55 said:

Please note above that you, who complains about being personally attacked, were quick to call me a loser.

I didn't call you a loser. I said just branding something as "conspiracy theory" without explaining why, and having a "roll over and die" attitude is a loser's attitude.

Animals roll over and throw their bellies into the air when they give up. That's a loser's attitude.

[Lightning55]

On 12/3/2023 at 5:19 PM, VintageComics said:

"That's the way it is - whatever" is only the way it is if people choose to accept it. 

Hitler only rose to power because the general population in Germany accepted it and didn't oppose it. That's why the entire country accepts responsibility today for it. 

Very different than when a dictator takes over against he will of the people through force and only the dictator is held accountable. 

Your choices do matter, every day. 

I didn't call you a loser. I said just branding something as "conspiracy theory" without explaining why, and having a "roll over and die" attitude is a loser's attitude.

Animals roll over and throw their bellies into the air when they give up. That's a loser's attitude.

You can put as much lipstick on that pig as you want, but if you say I have a loser's attitude, you are calling me a loser. No two ways about it.

[VintageComics]

On 12/3/2023 at 5:23 PM, Lightning55 said:

You can put as much lipstick on that pig as you want, but if you say I have a loser's attitude, you are calling me a loser. No two ways about it.

Not every choice can be correct. You basically called me a conspiracy theorist.

If someone has the belief that they have to accept everything thrown at them, then that's not a winner's attitude and if it's not a winner's attitude, what is it?

I'm not cut from that cloth. 

-------------------------------

You brought in Aristotle so I'll bring in some Ancient history. 

One of my favorite inspirational phrases is attributed to Hannibal the Carthaginian General, who uttered the phrase when he was told it was impossible to cross the Alps by elephant. 

The Latin phrase "Inveniam viam aut faciam" translates into "I shall find a way or make one"

From Wiki:

Hannibal's crossing of the Alps in 218 BC was one of the major events of the Second Punic War, and one of the most celebrated achievements of any military force in ancient warfare.

Edited December 3, 2023 by VintageComics

[Lightning55]

On 12/3/2023 at 5:47 PM, VintageComics said:

Not every choice can be correct. You basically called me a conspiracy theorist.

If someone has the belief that they have to accept everything thrown at them, then that's not a winner's attitude and if it's not a winner's attitude, what is it?

I don't accept everything that is thrown at me, just not what you are throwing in this thread. So not a winning attitude, not a losing attitude, it's just unimportant.  I wouldn't even mention anything about it, except you keep beating this same drum, tired of it.  Please stop.

 

On 12/3/2023 at 5:47 PM, VintageComics said:

You brought in Aristotle so I'll bring in some Ancient history. 

One of my favorite inspirational phrases is attributed to Hannibal the Carthaginian General, who uttered the phrase when he was told it was impossible to cross the Alps by elephant. 

The Latin phrase "Inveniam viam aut faciam" translates into "I shall find a way or make one"

From Wiki:

Hannibal's crossing of the Alps in 218 BC was one of the major events of the Second Punic War, and one of the most celebrated achievements of any military force in ancient warfare.

Yes, Hannibal was one of those power mover people, like I mentioned.  I suspect neither of us is Hannibal.

Edited December 3, 2023 by Lightning55

[VintageComics]

On 12/3/2023 at 6:12 PM, Lightning55 said:

tired of it.  Please stop.

Wait, let me understand this:

You just said you choose to accept what you can't change but then you ask people other than yourself to change what you can't accept?

Now THAT'S lipstick on a pig. 

If the free market of ideas isn't your friend, than the ignore feature is going to have to be. There's no middle ground here. 

Have a good one! 

[Buzzetta]

If anyone had "20th Century German Dictators" on their Bingo Cards or their at home Jeopardy CGC Boards Edition, you will have to wait for the next edition to come out.  

 

Getting back to the topic at hand...

Who would have access to Diamond's quantity of accounts?  Would you be able to post that information?

While comic book publishing companies can report publishing numbers per book, how many accounts are ordering these books.  I am curious to see if Diamond is handling more or less accounts compared to last year, five years or even ten years ago. 

It would be interesting to see how many stores are ordering books in relation to overall publishing numbers. 

Edited December 3, 2023 by Buzzetta

[Lightning55]

On 12/3/2023 at 6:15 PM, VintageComics said:

but then you ask people other than yourself to change what you can't accept?

I don't see where I asked anyone to change what I can't accept.  That's out of the blue, or some wacky interpretation.

Unless you mean me asking you stop beating us up with your diatribes.  I can even accept those, if they weren't so repetitive, trying to dominate this thread.  I suspect I am not the only one who would like to see you let up on the gas pedal.

[VintageComics]

On 12/3/2023 at 6:22 PM, Lightning55 said:

I don't see where I asked anyone to change what I can't accept.  That's out of the blue, or some wacky interpretation.

Unless you mean me asking you stop beating us up with your diatribes.  I can even accept those, if they weren't so repetitive, trying to dominate this thread.  I suspect I am not the only one who would like to see you let up on the gas pedal.

You told me to stop posting because you're tired of it. If that's not asking someone to change what you can't accept, what is?

I'm here for polite conversation about things I find interesting. 

If you don't find the conversation interesting, then stop responding and put people on ignore rather than demanding people conform to you. 

[Lightning55]

On 12/3/2023 at 6:31 PM, VintageComics said:

You told me to stop posting because you're tired of it. If that's not asking someone to change what you can't accept, what is?

I'm here for polite conversation about things I find interesting. 

If you don't find the conversation interesting, then stop responding and put people on ignore rather than demanding people conform to you. 

I don't want you to stop posting, I want you to stop repetitive posting of the same concept.  It stops becoming "polite conversation" when it is getting beaten into you.

You make some good points, and then undermine your progress with your combative style when anyone responds with ideas that vary even an inch from yours.  Then you complain that they are trying to derail you, attack you.

This thread was pretty much petering out a few pages ago, everyone willing to let it be with what they had said or contributed.  Then you came in to restate your "points" because you couldn't bear to let it dissolve slowly, stirring the pot.

 

[VintageComics]

On 12/3/2023 at 6:40 PM, Lightning55 said:

This thread was pretty much petering out a few pages ago, everyone willing to let it be with what they had said or contributed.  Then you came in to restate your "points" because you couldn't bear to let it dissolve slowly, stirring the pot.

Dude, I EXPOUNDED on the points I made earlier by bringing fresh material that built on the old material. 

Do you really think telling someone to stop is the right way to stop a conversation?

Maybe you've been brainwashed into thinking this is proper etiquette but it's not out in the real world. 

The right way is to ignore what you don't like. You don't get to tell people on the internet how to post. 

I'm going to stop responding to you. You can have the last word. 

[Lightning55]

On 12/2/2023 at 5:56 PM, VintageComics said:

To everyone else, I'm sorry about all of this.

I'm trying to have a genuine discussion here but I'm going to step away for a bit to turn down the heat because I'm sure this is tiring for everyone. 

Even you recognized that things were getting out of control, wearing on those not directly involved in your battling back and forth.

On 12/3/2023 at 6:44 PM, VintageComics said:

Dude, I EXPOUNDED on the points I made earlier by bringing fresh material that built on the old material. 

Do you really think telling someone to stop is the right way to stop a conversation?

Maybe you've been brainwashed into thinking this is proper etiquette but it's not out in the real world. 

The right way is to ignore what you don't like. You don't get to tell people on the internet how to post. 

I'm going to stop responding to you. You can have the last word. 

Maybe 5 people cared about the points you made, even less about the EXPOUNDED points. 

And yes, telling someone who is monopolizing a thread, bringing in fringe topics, rehashed topics, to ease up on the pedal is appropriate.  You are a forum bully, no doubt.  Yours is the only opinion that counts.  It's not surprising there is a Derail Team.

 

[VintageComics]

On 12/3/2023 at 7:20 PM, Lightning55 said:

Maybe 5 people cared about the points you made, even less about the EXPOUNDED points. 

I'm not going to counter anything you said about me because you're entitled to your opinion, but I do want to touch on this:

There are MANY more people reading threads than replying in them, so how many people reply in a thread is not an indicator of who is interested or reading the thread. It's nothing more than an indicator of who is replying, and when detractors reply in an antagonistic manner, that prevents interested people from replying even more. 

I know because I've gotten messages from people in my DMs here, and even had people walk up to me at conventions specifically to encourage me to keep posting because they enjoy reading my points. 

If this means I'm having the last word, I'm genuinely not trying to. I just think this is a fatal mistake many people make.

Anyway, I'm genuinely sorry you feel the way you do. And I'll take the hit for not allowing that last post of yours from being the last word but I genuinely thought this was worth addressing. 

Edited December 4, 2023 by VintageComics

[NoMan]

On 12/3/2023 at 2:19 PM, VintageComics said:

"That's the way it is - whatever" is only the way it is if people choose to accept it. 

Hitler only rose to power because the general population in Germany accepted it and didn't oppose it. That's why the entire country accepts responsibility today for it. 

Very different than when a dictator takes over against he will of the people through force and only the dictator is held accountable. 

Your choices do matter, every day. 

I didn't call you a loser. I said just branding something as "conspiracy theory" without explaining why, and having a "roll over and die" attitude is a loser's attitude.

Animals roll over and throw their bellies into the air when they give up. That's a loser's attitude.

HITLER HAS ENTERED THE CHAT!

Edited December 4, 2023 by NoMan