ASM #252 CGC 9.8 Record Sale - something fishy going on? - Holder Tampering Incident confirmed by CGC 50 50

[DoctorWyoming1]

On 12/28/2023 at 8:38 AM, comicginger1789 said:

Very pleased to see this CGC! Some people might complain that it took them too long but unlike Joe blow with a YouTube account who can jump out and post whatever with little repercussion, it makes sense that CGC took time to investigate on their own. They obviously came to a similar conclusion and hopefully as their statement says, they have made adjustments to prevent this from ever happening again. Also releasing the flawed books is a great idea. 

Agreed. Taking time for a good response is the exact response I want from a professional group. The only thing that might have made this better was for a brief comment to the effect of "We are aware of this situation and are preparing a response." earlier on in this situation.

[Mr. Zipper]

When there is money involved, criminals will always be seeking to hack the system. CGC will always need to build a better mousetrap, which according to their statement, they have. No system will EVER be foolproof. But you can place countermeasures to make the barriers to entry to fraud as high as possible.

I agree that the best solutions are often the simplest and likely "analog." Things like this would likely stop almost all potential swap-outs:

• Photos of slabbed books
• Matching serial number on inner well
• A dot of permanent adhesive in the corner posts

 

[THE_BEYONDER]

I’m curious how many potential  CGC consumers are even aware of this situation?  

[Buzzetta]

On 12/28/2023 at 12:01 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

I’m curious how many potential  CGC consumers are even aware of this situation?  

A fraction at best.

[MatterEaterLad]

On 12/28/2023 at 10:01 AM, THE_BEYONDER said:

I’m curious how many potential  CGC consumers are even aware of this situation?  

I've seen CGC's announcement posted on two FB collecting groups. One with 1,500 members, the other has 12,000. So word is getting out. 

Not sure about the big CGC fan group on FB, since Bill "I don't ban anyone" banned me. I'm assuming he's posted it now since he's a de facto CGC mouthpiece.

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 12/28/2023 at 12:04 PM, Buzzetta said:

A fraction at best.

Ignorance is bliss

[mephistopheles]

CGC's new tamper-proof slab design:

 

[comicwiz]

At a tournament, someone messaged me that CGC posted a response to this on iG. Haven't seen any posts in this thread or the forums, jumped straight on here, is this true? If so, can someone tag me on that post please.

[paqart]

On 12/28/2023 at 10:16 AM, MatterEaterLad said:

I heard this second hand (from a good source), but apparently Halperin said that this year is the first year Heritage made more money selling cards than comics. 

Take a look at the content. The cards market hasn't been infected yet. Comics the last few years aren't likely to inspire many new collectors.

[Buzzetta]

On 12/28/2023 at 12:07 PM, comicwiz said:

At a tournament, someone messaged me that CGC posted a response to this on iG. Haven't seen any posts in this thread or the forums, jumped straight on here, is this true? If so, can someone tag me on that post please.

 

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 12/28/2023 at 12:07 PM, comicwiz said:

At a tournament, someone messaged me that CGC posted a response to this on iG. Haven't seen any posts in this thread or the forums, jumped straight on here, is this true? If so, can someone tag me on that post please.

CCG and CGC Comics Statement on Holder Tampering Incident

The Certified Collectibles Group (CCG), which includes Certified Guaranty Company (CGC), is aware of an incident involving an individual tampering with CGC Comics holders. Based on our initial review, we believe that the incident affects a few hundred comic books.

CCG exists to protect the collecting community, and in the last 36 years we have certified more than 85 million collectibles, each one backed by a comprehensive guarantee. The trust that we have built with our community sometimes makes us a target of bad actors and, despite our vigilance, this individual tampered with some of our holders.

If you purchased one of the books that this individual tampered with, we will ensure that you are appropriately compensated for losses arising from any failures in our services. We expect to share a list of books that we believe are impacted as soon as possible.  

We have also retained a leading private investigative service and outside counsel to conduct a comprehensive review of this incident and our processes, and to help ensure that this individual is held accountable to the fullest extent of the law. We have already made significant improvements to our processes as a result of this incident, and we will continue to take appropriate steps to help ensure that this type of incident does not happen again.

We expect to share more information when we have it. In the meantime, if you have any questions or would like to share any information with CCG, please reach out to us at ReportFraud@CollectiblesGroup.com.

[MatterEaterLad]

On 12/28/2023 at 10:07 AM, comicwiz said:

At a tournament, someone messaged me that CGC posted a response to this on iG. Haven't seen any posts in this thread or the forums, jumped straight on here, is this true? If so, can someone tag me on that post please.

CGC did post to their IG account. https://www.instagram.com/p/C1ZkREgOu8V/?img_index=1

[wiparker824]

On 12/28/2023 at 10:01 AM, THE_BEYONDER said:

I’m curious how many potential  CGC consumers are even aware of this situation?  

To be honest it’s going to depend on the influencers and how much they post about it, which isn’t my cup of tea and not channels I follow. But I do know they have a lot of people who do. So, if all of them start talking about this the way they talk about the next MCU hot spec alert, well, word will get out very quickly. And I know based on some of the videos posted in this thread that’s already begun.

In 2023 that’s the way these things travel, nobody reads Facebook groups or CGC newsletters and besides those of us ITT nobody else is reading message boards. 

 

[Buzzetta]

On 12/28/2023 at 12:07 PM, paqart said:

Take a look at the content. The cards market hasn't been infected yet. Comics the last few years aren't likely to inspire many new collectors.

They have though.  Sports market continues to grow.

Sports card holder tampering is a bit tougher to do by the way since to get in there you actually have to destroy the card slab. Cards are obviously smaller so there is not a lot of surface space to work with, without risking damage to the card.   Only way I know to get a card out of a PSA slab is to physically break through it which immediately shatters the whole thing in chunks.   

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=how+to+break+open+a+psa+card

[jsilverjanet]

On 12/28/2023 at 8:27 AM, trademarkcomics said:

Hopefully you're not planning to pass this cost onto future submitters in the shape of higher service fees...

someone always has to pay, so i say yes, expect an increase due to new procedures in place, or due to a new tamper proof slab

 

[BrashL]

On 12/28/2023 at 11:04 AM, Buzzetta said:

A fraction at best.

It's all over YouTube and the socials, I think it's probably a majority at this point.

[Mephisto]

On 12/28/2023 at 12:12 PM, Buzzetta said:

They have though.  Sports market continues to grow.

Sports card holder tampering is a bit tougher to do by the way since to get in there you actually have to destroy the card slab. Cards are obviously smaller so there is not a lot of surface space to work with, without risking damage to the card.   Only way I know to get a card out of a PSA slab is to physically break through it which immediately shatters the whole thing in chunks.   

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=how+to+break+open+a+psa+card

@Bronty DESTROYS graded Magic Card cases freeing the cards.

[Stefan_W]

On 12/28/2023 at 12:01 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

I’m curious how many potential  CGC consumers are even aware of this situation?  

CGC posted it on their page, on their IG, and on their FB pages. I am sure You Tubers are shooting videos on it as we speak. 

Considering it is the holiday season it may take longer than usual for word to get around. For now, I suspect the ones who are unaware are those who like a social media-free holiday season (bless them), and those who opt not to see CGC announcements in general. 

[Buzzetta]

On 12/28/2023 at 12:14 PM, Mephisto said:

@Bronty DESTROYS graded Magic Card cases freeing the cards.

Yup.  They have a sonic weld all around them and it makes it tough to get something in there to pry them apart.  There are no posts to speak of either.  They are sealed in pretty tight.  Now, they have a specific device to take them apart but the average collector even those skilled with taking apart action figures and other plastics that have been factory bonded cannot remove a card without destroying that card slab.

The only reason that works though is because of the size.  I do not know if that is feasible at a comic book level. 

[The_Investor]

@CGC Mike I haven't read the whole thread but noticed many in the community have FANTASTIC ideas that CGC should take into consideration when reading this thread !

Another idea that may or may not have been mention:

Add BLOCKCHAIN TECHNOLOGY to each book when received? Maybe this could add an extra layer of security to what exists now at CGC for all owners, sellers and potential buyers who want to view the tracked history with a little more confidence going into 2024?