Did I do the right thing?

[Comicdave]

This situation doesn't involve comic books, but it could just as well have. I sell a lot of cartoon collectibles on Ebay and have very good feedback, ship right away, the whole nine yards. This is what happened.

 

A customer buys a Charlie Brown figure from me for $20. He pays through Paypal right away and includes $$ for insurance. I wrap it up and ship it to him the next day, but I forget to include insurance at the post office.

 

He receives his package a couple of days later. The figure is fine, no damage, but he notices it wasn't insured. So he emails me, and instead of saying "thanks for the great transaction", he says "you didn't insure my package. I want my $1.30 back".

 

I email him back and apologize for not insuring his package, but let him know, that even though it wasn't insured at the post office, it was still insured, because if it had been lost or damaged, I would have been responsible for it. He emails me back and says "I don't like paying for something I didn't receive. Refund my $1.30." I choose to ignore his email rather than reply. A couple days later, he emails me back, saying "You better refund my $1.30 or else I'm leaving you a negative".

 

Now, I know some of you are saying, it's only $1.30. Why not just refund him the money. Even my girlfriend was saying, it's not worth getting a negative over. But I told her, it's not the money, it's the principle of the matter. The guys being a jerk and claiming he didn't get what he paid for, when he did.

 

So anyway, here is my reply to his threat.

 

So Ken, let me ask you a question. If you pay for insurance to the post office and your package arrives in good shape, do you go back to the post office and ask for your insurance money back? Because that's exactly what you are doing here. Insurance is paid to protect you against loss or damage. If I had remembered to insure your package and it was lost or damaged, the post office would have been reponsible. But because I forgot to insure it, I became the person responsible. If it had arrived damaged, I would have had to replace it or refund your money. You say you don't like paying for something you didn't get, but I'm saying you got it. You paid for insurance and that's what you got. As I said before, just because I got the $1.30 instead of the post office, shouldn't make any difference to you. There are several dealers on ebay who self insure. Instead of paying for insurance to the post office, they just keep the insurance money and hope the package arrives okay.

 

If you want to leave me negative feedback, that's your perogative. But I think that would be very petty on your part, when you consider you bought an item of mine off ebay. You paid for it, I shipped it in a quick and timely matter. You received it in good shape. In my book that makes for a satisfactory transaction. But because I forgot to give the post office $1.30 you're unhappy.

 

Sincerely, David Descoteau (comicdave)

 

----- Original Message -----

From:

To:

Sent: Friday, March 28, 2003 12:18 PM

Subject: REFUND

 

 

> You can either REFUND my money or be left NEGATIVE FEEDBACK ! The choice

is yours. Ken (bigtedbear)

 

 

Needless to say, he didn't waste any time in leaving me a negative. Unfortunately I had already left him postive feedback. This is his email afterwards;

 

FINE... You keep the money...I will be glad to be the first person to

leave

you NEGATIVE FEEDBACK....You are nothing more than a commom...THIEF

 

So do you feel I did the right thing, or am I as he says "a commom...THIEF?"

 

By the way, just as an addition to this story, I had another customer pay for insurance, where I forgot to pay for it at the post office. Unfortunately this package never arrived. So I refunded his $40, because he paid for insurance.

 

 

[murph0]

The people who use negative feedback as basically a "hostage situation" are hilarious. Oh no..not a negative?!?! Just post a follow-up to his negative telling ppl to email you for details..

 

Brian

[PovertyRow]

A customer buys a Charlie Brown figure from me for $20. He pays through Paypal right away and includes $$ for insurance. I wrap it up and ship it to him the next day, but I forget to include insurance at the post office.

 

If you offered insurance as an option, they paid for insurance but you forgot insure the package - they should have their insurance charges refunded. This seems like a very basic idea - or am I missing something beyond that? It seems to me that your deciding to ignore his initial email was the start of the downhill flow the events took.

[UnrulyAppendage]

Send the $1.30 back. This request is not unreasonable.

[OldGuy]

I would want my $1.30 back. My biggest frustration on E-bay is being over charged for shipping and that's basically what happened here (from his perspective).

 

You may be a really good guy. I've never had a transaction with you, but I'll assume you are. But he doesn’t know if you are lying to him or if you really forgot. For all he knows you do this with everyone.

 

If I were in his shoes I would have asked for the $1.30 back and left a neg if you didn't refund it.

[Joanna]

I understand where you're coming from, but were it me, I would've refunded his $1.30 with an apology, before negs were ever discussed. Why? Because he paid for postal insurance and didn't get it, to him, the money was just "taken". Your argument that you would've paid for damage or replacement doesn't impact him (from his POV) because it's just your word that you would. Someone who had no intention of paying could've said the same thing. (again, just looking at it from his POV). He knows the P.O. would've paid, and that's why he bought it -- for that assurance of protection.

 

Secondly, you didn't explain before it was mailed that if he pays insurance, it's going into your pocket, not the P.O.'s. So he feels he was misled. The fact that you'd forgotten to insure it wasn't his fault. To him, you made the mistake, so you should be responsible for it. It's tough for you, because your mistake would then mean you not only had to reimburse if it had been damaged, but you'd also have to return the $1.30 if it survived. But that's the way it goes when mistakes are made -- things have to be made right, either way.

 

All of that said, you made your choice and there's nothing wrong with that, either, since you were willing to pay the consequences (a neg). As I said, I understand your side of things, and don't consider it wrong. It was really two people who both felt they were 100% right, and arguments can be made for both sides.

 

Sorry you had to get negged over $1.30.

 

-- Joanna

[jonnydouble]

Ummm...personaly...I have to agree with the customer...you have to put yourself in his position...you did not pay for the insurance...you should refund him the $1.30....it doesn't matter that the package got there safely....you did not pay for the service so he should have to either....

 

 

 

Jonny D.

[Warlord]

Nope, the seller was right - the seller was on the hook if the package was lost/damaged etc. He was paid for insurance, right? So if there had been reason to make a claim, the seller would have had to make good.

 

Unless seller had claimed it was "USPS" insurance then it doesn't matter if it was insurance out of his pocket or by USPS coverage. The buyer was covered, and so he got what he paid for.

 

Buyer was just being petty.

 

Also, don't ever feel you are being overcharged for shipping by paying the stated shipping costs. You simply must factor the shipping cost into the amount you bid. If you believe that the shipping costs are inflated, you should bid less to account for that. The seller is obviously shifting part of the profit from the item to the shipping. There are a few reasons to do that (low opening bid price, avoid eBay percantages, etc). Just plan on it if the shipping cost is disclosed, then take that into account.

 

 

 

[Comicdave]

If you offered insurance as an option, they paid for insurance but you forgot insure the package - they should have their insurance charges refunded. This seems like a very basic idea - or am I missing something beyond that? It seems to me that your deciding to ignore his initial email was the start of the downhill flow the events took.

 

I didn't ignore his initial email. I politely explained to him that I accidently forgot to insure his package. I then stated that even though I didn't give his $1.30 to the post office, his package was still insured, because if it were lost or damaged, I would have been responsible to either replace or reimburse him. I didn't see where it mattered where the $1.30 went.

 

Some of you say i should have refunded the $1.30. The fact that the package arrived in good shape with no problems doesn't matter? Why does it matter who gets the $1.30 as long as you receive your item? It's one thing to charge $10 for postage and only have it cost $2.50 to ship. That's something to get upset over. But as long as you get your package, what difference does it make how it gets there?

[bubbles-migration]

 

 

 

NOPE... the seller was wrong. He had every right to ask for the money back, and you shouldn't have hesitated to return it. He paid you to have the item insured,and you didn't do that for him. Just can't be logically justified.

[Bonds25]

When I pay for insurance, I assume it's postal insurance. I know if it's insured by the post office, I'll eventually get my money back. The buyer doesn't know you, and has no idea if you'll actually pay him if the book was lost. I think he was an a**hole in his replies to you, but I probably would have wanted a refund too.

[PovertyRow]

I didn't ignore his initial email. I

 

You are correct. It was the email of him asking for the refund you ignored. My error.

 

Some of you say i should have refunded the $1.30. The fact that the package arrived in good shape with no problems doesn't matter? Why does it matter who gets the $1.30 as long as you receive your item?

 

Nope. It doesn't matter at all the package arrived safely. It doesn't matter you say you are you're being willing to front the refund in case of loss.

 

What matters is simply you charged him for insurance, admitted you forgot to get insurance and he should be refund the money.

 

Why does it matter? Because to accept it says it is ok to sell rhetoric as opposed to selling a tangible service.

[joe_collector]

Just pay the guy the $1.30 and stop being a weiner.

[OldGuy]

Just pay the guy the $1.30 and stop being a weiner.

 

! Leave it to CI to say what everyone is thinking. It's to late though. The neg has been issued and maybe a lesson learned.

[Warlord]

Consider the alternative scenario - the seller forgot to insure the package. The buyer never receives the package. Buyer contacts the seller and says "My package is lost, claim the insurance and reimburse me". Now what happens?

 

Does the seller say "Sorry, I forgot to insure the package, you are out of luck"? Would any of you saying the buyer was right accept that explanation and take the loss yourself if YOU were the buyer in that scenario?

 

Or would you hold the seller accountable? I'd bet on the latter.

 

I really don't think too many buyers would really agree to eat the loss in such a case because the seller "claimed" to have forgotten the insurance. You are going to demand reimbursement because you paid for insurance, and the insurance will come from the USPS or the seller, you won't care which. C'mon, admit it.

 

 

[PovertyRow]

Like I say - it is selling rhetoric.

[COI]

Some of you say i should have refunded the $1.30. The fact that the package arrived in good shape with no problems doesn't matter? Why does it matter who gets the $1.30 as long as you receive your item?

 

The fact that the package arrived in good shape, while a good thing, is irrelevant. He paid for something, and did not recieve it. As far as he's concerned, it's easy for you to say in hindsight that you would have covered the cost had the package been lost, but he dosen't know that for a fact.

 

You say you didn't refund the money out of principle, but I think that's the reason HE asked for a redund. I doubt that he cared about the $1.30, but "out of principle" he was upset because he did not get what he paid for.

 

If it were me, I would have REFUNDED his money out of principle, not the other way around.

[Comicdave]

Ummm...personaly...I have to agree with the customer...you have to put yourself in his position...you did not pay for the insurance...you should refund him the $1.30....it doesn't matter that the package got there safely....you did not pay for the service so he should have to either....

 

As I've stated already, just because I didn't give the money to the post office doesn't mean his package wasn't insured. Someone said the buyer didn't have any way of knowing if I would have replaced the item. That should have been a problem if the package was lost or damaged, but until then it should not have been a problem.

 

 

 

 

[supapimp]

Just pay the guy the $1.30 and stop being a weiner.

 

classic CI, comicdave, refund the customer his $1.30, it was an oversight on your part after all. who knows? maybe the buyer is really unhappy with his home life and needs something to whine about.

[COI]

As I've stated already, just because I didn't give the money to the post office doesn't mean his package wasn't insured. Someone said the buyer didn't have any way of knowing if I would have replaced the item. That should have been a problem if the package was lost or damaged, but until then it should not have been a problem.

 

Once again, this is easy to say with 20/20 hindsight, but it is an impossible thing to prove because the transaction is done.

 

I am not doubting your integrity, as I'm sure you would have covered the loss, but I'm still not clear on what "principle" it was that prevented you from refunding the money. I would think principle would mean that you refund his money, if nothing else, as a courtesy for your mistake.