War Comics 17 17

[MrBedrock]

I think we should all observe a moment of silence for one of our own...fellow collector Keith Marlow.

 

The poor guy got his kicked last night on C-Link.

 

Man, my heart sunk when I read that first sentence, Richard.

sorry Andy. Maybe a little overboard.

 

But I think Keith is actually planning to get out of comics after this last setback. I get the feeling that the wheeling and dealing is cooler to him than the comics themselves. And if he's getting destroyed in the wheeling and dealing dept. then there ain't much left for him to pursue. I hope that isn't the case. But that's what he's saying.

[comick1]

A lot of those went for strong prices, but not necessarily what Keith paid. A few of those 9.4s were very strong prices. I was thinking that some of them went for cheap prices, but maybe the deal of the night was the OAAW 85 in 8.5. I couldn't believe that went for just over $1000.00. That was a sweet copy and tied for top census. Unlike the #84, it doesn't have two 9.0s. It's also more significant in terms of Rock's continuity. Don't get me wrong. . .I was stoked when I got a nice copy of #84 from Matt a few years back, but it's not a Rock cover, and the fact that #85 is the second Kubert AND has Ice Cream Soldier's first app--effectively the first in a small handful of comics that introduced all the quirky supporting cast of Easy Company--just makes it a cooler book than #84 any day of the week. I know that, given a choice between 84 and 85 in that kinda grade, I'd go with the #85 every day of the week. It's also notable that a CGC 8.0 of #85 sold at Heritage last Nov. for $956-. Getting that 8.5 for just a teeny bit more than a grand was THE deal of the auction.

 

Also, if Rock's third app. is more valuable than his second (which should be the case here), then--if you consider that $16,000+ hammer price for the CGC 8.0 of #83 (and the accompanying $22,000 currently being offered up front for it in the Heritage "archives" section) that was a major score. Hope it was one of you guys.

Edited September 1, 2012 by Comick1

[MrBedrock]

I agree Mick. I would have loved to have gotten the 85. But first a little back story...

 

At San Diego there were two beautiful Newsboy collection books at Motor City's booth. One, or both, were 9.4 white pagers, early and killer. Anyhow Mike wanted $2000 each for them. Just a ton of dough for those books. I was thinking that to me they were worth $1200 or so each, if I really went out on a limb maybe $3000 for the pair. But Mike was not negotiable on them. He was basically of the mind that there was no burden in owning them. Understood.

 

Well Saturday comes around and Keith shows up at the Con. I ask him if he had seen the Newsboys at Mike's booth. He says, "yeah, I bought them."

 

Well this hits me a couple of ways. First, I hated to miss out on those two, really irreplaceable comics. But more importantly it makes me realize that DC War books, while cool as hell, are simply not worth that much dough to me . I have collected lots of stuff over the years. I've always dug the DC War books, but I didn't start "collecting" them until fairly recently. And I realized that, in comparison to so many of the other things I collect the war comics are cheap. I enjoy not having to agonize over spending a chunk of money to add something cool to the run. With the war books I could add the coolest books for very little. Heck, I bought my OAAW 83 for $1500. That's the best book of the 400, right? So realizing that Keith was spending that much made me stop and think.

 

So I asked Keith, "If these are worth so much to you would you like to buy mine?"

 

About a month ago Keith creamed through my collection and cherry picked the very best books. Hey, my buddy is back in collecting!!! Cool. I was glad that he was excited about them. I was also glad about the money as it helped offset all of the Gaines File books I recently bought from Cheetah.

I also let Matt pick out some cool stuff that he had been wanting. (Shoot, I need to get a list for Mick!!!!)

Win-Win, right?

 

Except it wasn't. The next week I see all the books I sold Keith, all the books he bought in San Diego, the Newsboys, and a few others in the C-Link auction. Crazy.

 

So yeah, I wish I had gone ahead and bid on some of those books. In fact, I did on the two Newsboys. But my heart wasn't in pushing the envelope on them. Whoever got them got two beauties!

[thirdgreenham]

Well, I haven't really been following the last bunch of auctions, so I'll rely on you guys to know what's what.

 

There's nothing wrong with buying something and trying to sell it for more, it just doesn't always work that way. When you're paying very high prices to begin with, it makes it that much more difficult.

 

Most importantly, though, I was glad to read that he was okay.

 

[jimjum12]

.....never met Keith, but I see a little of all of us in him. It's real easy to get in a catch 22 type situation with our favorite genre.....especially when it gains tremendous acceptance after we've avidly followed it for years. It's also easy to lose sight of our own impact on the market when we decide to sell instead of buy......Doug's recent departure from the "DEEP" end is a good illustration of that. Based on garden variety Human Nature.......Keith will be back as a collector again....or he won't be fully happy. No one bats a thousand for long....GOD BLESS....

 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus) (thumbs u

 

P.S. I just bought an AAMOW 69......nice Fine ++......to flip, and it's so cool I may have to keep it. I love purple covers and I could see myself paying stupid money for a high grade one under certain circumstances.......I had forgotten how Damn good Drucker is.....

[comick1]

P.S. I just bought an AAMOW 69......nice Fine ++......to flip, and it's so cool I may have to keep it. I love purple covers and I could see myself paying stupid money for a high grade one under certain circumstances.......I had forgotten how Damn good Drucker is.....

 

+ one of only 3 Kubert Tank Killer stories. Drucker's the shît in those pre-MAD days. Between Kubert, Heath, and Drucker, it's just like eye candy every step of the way. It's the tidy stories by those guys that made them light years cooler than most of the other genres coming out at that time.

Edited September 2, 2012 by Comick1

[jimjum12]

P.S. I just bought an AAMOW 69......nice Fine ++......to flip, and it's so cool I may have to keep it. I love purple covers and I could see myself paying stupid money for a high grade one under certain circumstances.......I had forgotten how Damn good Drucker is.....

 

+ one of only 3 Kubert Tank Killer stories. Drucker's the shît in those pre-MAD days. Between Kubert, Heath, and Drucker, it's just like eye candy every step of the way. It's the tidy stories by those guys that made them light years cooler than most of the other genres coming out at that time.

 

....I've always been a distant admirer.....but this 69 punched all the buttons for me......Neil Adams had to have been a Drucker fan in his youth....that same slavish attention to detail is there. I bought these from time to time off the stands in the early 70's......but there's something magical about these late 50's- early 60's ones. Another favorite is OAAW 128 and the 2 parter in 147-148.

[OV]

I think I've reached my goal for collecting DC war comics, and then I wondered, what's the goal of the rest of you folks? Are you collecting keys, washtones, certain runs, etc.? I'm very curious if anyone wants to share! Have any of you reached your end goal, or do you keep trading and selling?

[Jeffro.]

I think I've reached my goal for collecting DC war comics, and then I wondered, what's the goal of the rest of you folks? Are you collecting keys, washtones, certain runs, etc.? I'm very curious if anyone wants to share! Have any of you reached your end goal, or do you keep trading and selling?

 

Topical for me because I'm thinking of changing my focus. My previous war collecting goals were

OFF 1-51, 71

OAAW 83-301

GIC 45-288

SSWS 131(1) - 90

AAMOW 127(1) - 83

 

For some reason that focus is no longer scratching the itch for me. Now I'm strongly considering focusing only on OAAW 83-301 and GIC 45-288 and selling most of the other stuff.

[kagemusha7s]

I think I've reached my goal for collecting DC war comics, and then I wondered, what's the goal of the rest of you folks? Are you collecting keys, washtones, certain runs, etc.? I'm very curious if anyone wants to share! Have any of you reached your end goal, or do you keep trading and selling?

 

Topical for me because I'm thinking of changing my focus. My previous war collecting goals were

OFF 1-51, 71

OAAW 83-301

GIC 45-288

SSWS 131(1) - 90

AAMOW 127(1) - 83

 

For some reason that focus is no longer scratching the itch for me. Now I'm strongly considering focusing only on OAAW 83-301 and GIC 45-288 and selling most of the other stuff.

 

 

Please let me know

[kagemusha7s]

I think I've reached my goal for collecting DC war comics, and then I wondered, what's the goal of the rest of you folks? Are you collecting keys, washtones, certain runs, etc.? I'm very curious if anyone wants to share! Have any of you reached your end goal, or do you keep trading and selling?

 

 

I went from all Big 5 grey tone covers/cool covers that I liked, to focusing on just early Sgt Rocks, Sgt Rock Prototype books, & Big 5 10 cent frogman covers. I believe I have all of the 10 cent Big 5 frogman covers. Some are low grade and I would upgrade them if I could, but I am not really actively looking for them.

 

I need 3 more issues to finish my mini run of Our Army at War 78-113 (103-105 F or better if anyone has them for sale) I have a number of Sgt Rock prototypes, but I'm still missing a bunch.

 

When I get the last 3 OAAWs I need I am going to take a break from buying comics all together. When I start up again, I plan to expand the OAAW run in small pieces. Maybe will look to add 114-128, and then look to expand further once that is completed. When I have a range of books spread out over too many issues, I start selling them off to buy other books. I have to keep my collecting to small runs.

[comick1]

I think I've reached my goal for collecting DC war comics, and then I wondered, what's the goal of the rest of you folks? Are you collecting keys, washtones, certain runs, etc.? I'm very curious if anyone wants to share! Have any of you reached your end goal, or do you keep trading and selling?

 

 

I went from all Big 5 grey tone covers/cool covers that I liked, to focusing on just early Sgt Rocks, Sgt Rock Prototype books, & Big 5 10 cent frogman covers. I believe I have all of the 10 cent Big 5 frogman covers. Some are low grade and I would upgrade them if I could, but I am not really actively looking for them.

 

 

Mike, I believe that your description above would firmly place Showcase #3 in the outlier category since it's technically not a part of the Big-5. I'll be happy to mitigate that problem for you.

[kagemusha7s]

I think I've reached my goal for collecting DC war comics, and then I wondered, what's the goal of the rest of you folks? Are you collecting keys, washtones, certain runs, etc.? I'm very curious if anyone wants to share! Have any of you reached your end goal, or do you keep trading and selling?

 

 

I went from all Big 5 grey tone covers/cool covers that I liked, to focusing on just early Sgt Rocks, Sgt Rock Prototype books, & Big 5 10 cent frogman covers. I believe I have all of the 10 cent Big 5 frogman covers. Some are low grade and I would upgrade them if I could, but I am not really actively looking for them.

 

 

Mike, I believe that your description above would firmly place Showcase #3 in the outlier category since it's technically not a part of the Big-5. I'll be happy to mitigate that problem for you.

 

 

That was my first frogman cover. From that point on, I confined my collecting to just DC Big 5 10 centers.

 

Besides...remember what Meatloaf said. Two out of Three Ain't Bad.

[comick1]

I think I've reached my goal for collecting DC war comics, and then I wondered, what's the goal of the rest of you folks? Are you collecting keys, washtones, certain runs, etc.? I'm very curious if anyone wants to share! Have any of you reached your end goal, or do you keep trading and selling?

 

 

I went from all Big 5 grey tone covers/cool covers that I liked, to focusing on just early Sgt Rocks, Sgt Rock Prototype books, & Big 5 10 cent frogman covers. I believe I have all of the 10 cent Big 5 frogman covers. Some are low grade and I would upgrade them if I could, but I am not really actively looking for them.

 

 

Mike, I believe that your description above would firmly place Showcase #3 in the outlier category since it's technically not a part of the Big-5. I'll be happy to mitigate that problem for you.

 

 

That was my first frogman cover. From that point on, I confined my collecting to just DC Big 5 10 centers.

 

Besides...remember what Meatloaf said. Two out of Three Ain't Bad.

 

Curses! The power of suggestion fails again!

[bigfiver69]

Hey all,

 

Haven't chimed in in quite a while (aside from the unfortunate news about Joe Kubert, bless him). But just saw the last few pages of the thread which deal with some the 'existential metaphysical big deal' questions surrounding collecting war books... particularly in high grade.

 

Around this time last year, I made my last 'big' purchase of war books - not a ton of money, but enough that I had to be a little creative with my finances that month. That's when I realized a few painful truths:

 

- All the books were upgrades... in some cases, .5 of a grade up. And I said to myself 'This is just nuts.'

- The books sat unopened for two months before I opened them and looked at them.

- Most of them were early issues that I bought 'for the having' and not 'for the enjoying.' (though admittedly, there is often 'enjoying' in the 'just having')

- I took a moment to add up what I spent on books in the past five years. And that was a big 'gulp' moment. BIG.

 

I had gotten caught up in a completionist, money-is-no-object mentality. I realized that - for me - the whole thing had gotten a little hollow.

 

So, I decided to sell my silver books then and there. Which I did (and thanks again to all who picked some up!)

 

The result?

 

Sure I miss my silver books somtimes. But I'm not scrambling to pay off the 'latest' stack of books, which I seemed to be doing with increasing frequency. And the money I made on the sales last year? I think I put it to good use - I paid for a cruise with my family, and cut up some credit cards. And I've learned to appreciate the books I kept all that much more.

 

I'm not knocking anyone who wants to buy and flip war books for a quick buck. Neither am I knocking the pursuit of uber-high grade and/or complete runs. But for me, who was once totally up to my neck in comics, it was really, really healthy to step back and take a critical look at my collecting habits. I wish I had done it sooner.

 

Hope all are well and that everyone had a great summer!

Shep

 

 

[comick1]

Alright, alright. . .if Shep's gonna do some chiming, then here goes. Been working on getting high grade war books for about 22+ years now. About 90% complete on the 12¢ers. There are a few titles that I've been less enthusiastic about completing for the 12¢ers. I don't own a single issue of OFF Capt. Hunter or Fighting Hellcats. . .and probably never will. I will pick up dinosaur SSWS in the 12¢ range IF they're cheap which they usually are not. I kinda think of the final 17 or so issues of AAMOW the same way. Never collected Capt. Storm and Weird War (technically not Big-5) but I appreciate their hereditary commonalities (ha!) with the Big-5. I actually like alot of bronze age stuff MORE than silver age (shouldn't come as a shock to Shep & some others) because of the myriad stories drawn by Glanzman (HT), Estrada (GOW), Severin (Losers), and Heath (Rock). I would be remiss to neglect the little gems by Toth, Simonson, Maurer, & Kirby. Not a HUGE fan of Unknown Soldier, but possibly more because I haven't really taken the time to sit down and read it like I have the other series. I trust Shep's judgement and I know he's a big fan of the series so I've been piecing them together slowly for the past decade or so and will, one day, sit down to read them. I'm not going to neglect to mention the glue that holds it all together in the form of Joe Kubert's hundreds (!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) of indelible covers. Can you think of ANY other artist who drew that many covers? Huh? Can you? Kubert is a colossus among artists for that accomplishment alone.

 

Glanzman gets his own shout-out because the more I read USS Stevens, the more I feel like his tenure on that series is the most underappreciated body of work EVER to be published in comics. I am not ashamed to say that his writing, layouts, and composition, and linework sometimes move me to tears. I'm not an overly emotional person--fairly even-keeled when it comes right down to it--but if EVER you could say that somebody put their heart and soul into a body of work, it would have been Sam Glanzman's USS Stevens. It is treasure beyond treasure contained in 4 pages. You can score ANY of those issues even in high grade for less than 30 bucks raw / 50 bucks slabbed. You can get readers of those for a couple bucks a pop. But do you know what you CAN'T get? A freakin' USS Stevens Archive Edition or Showcase compendium is what you CAN'T get. That work is just screaming out to be reprinted. DC finally made it a priority to reprint Sugar and Spike. If they can do that, then maybe they'll finally wake up and reprint EVERY story of USS Stevens.

OK, I went off on a Glanzman tangent (A Glanz-mangent).

 

Alright, back to what I collect. So about 90% complete on high grade 12¢. A few sporadic issues of the big two (GI Combat and OAAW) that I still need in that range.

 

As for 10¢. . .

 

Ugghhh, this gets messy. Long ago, I committed to getting anything I could possibly afford in the VF- and above range. I've spent more than half my life on this. In general, I stray away from the first couple years of the title. General rule of thumb (with a few exceptions) is that the range of issues I collect correlates to Kubert's, Drucker's, and Heath's tenure. This works out roughly to be #20 & up for AAMOW, OAAW, and SSWS. For OFF, it's #1 and up (although none of those guys are in #1). For GI Combat, it's the whole DC run starting with #44.

 

What's a boy to do when he realizes--10 years in to collecting--that he's developed a taste for Grandenetti, Novick, and Andru/Esposito? See, at first, I would ONLY buy issues that had stories and/or covers by Kubert, Drucker, Heath, and sometimes Severin. Then I realized that I was missing some MONUMENTAL covers by Grandenetti by adhering too strictly to that K/D/H only policy. So I eased that policy a bit to include Grandenetti covers even if there wasn't any K/D/H inside. Of course along the way, I started to notice that some (not all) of Grandenetti's interiors were almost as good as his covers. It also occurred to me that that guy who did those cool Silent Knight stories in B&B (Novick) was responsible for compelling stuff in DC war and likewise the Wonder Woman and Annie Oakley (Atlas) artists were better than I'd initially thought. So with that said, I basically just shrugged my shoulders and resigned myself to looking for complete runs. So there are essentially three reasons that have carved the contours of my collection range:

1. Art in AAMOW, OAAW, and SSWS 20 and up got really interesting if only because Heath, Kubert, and Drucker became mainstays of DC war, but also because the Grandenetti, Novick and A&E art seemed to improve over earlier efforts in the first 19 issues (and maybe that's only in my head. . .or maybe not).

 

2. That made it a little less ambitious for me on my salary to be able to hunt down the runs of AAMOW 20 & up, etc. The issues from #20 & up don't seem to be too much more prevalent in grade than 1-19 for any of the titles. The main difference was how EXPENSIVE those first 19 issues are. Man, I just can't afford to get those.

 

3. Takes a bit of the headache away from being a completionist. I guess there's a part of me deep down that thinks it'd be cool to be able to afford and pursue those first 19 issues, but there's a bigger part of me that's relieved that I never went after those. There're still plenty more holes (more than half the runs) for me to focus on in the 20 & up range and the pursuit of those will certainly take me my whole life if I ever even get close to completing that range of the run.

 

It's frustrating at times because there were many dealers along the way who would say, "I thought you'd completed those a long time ago." Maybe they REALLY were thinking that they've got other customers who are willing to settle for lower grade issues and are less pain in the åss-picky than me and are just too nice to say it so they break out the "thought you'd completed those" line. At any rate, I haven't completed ANY of the 10¢ runs in that #20 and up range. Wish I could say I was close, but I ain't.

 

So there you have it. Nothing confusing about that at all.

Edited September 8, 2012 by Comick1

[thirdgreenham]

Good to hear back from you Shep!

 

After you've gotten rid of your books and have seen what you've done with the funds, how do you feel? From your post, it looks like you feel pretty darned good, and that means that you did the right thing. So, congratulations and good for you.

 

I went through the same sort of faze. Why am I collecting? How often am I looking and reading my books? Could I put that capital to better use? I decided I could and ended up selling most of my more valuable books. How did I feel after I did it? Well, I certainly had mixed emotions, but ultimately I know I did the right thing, so I was happy.

 

I can tell you that after I packed up all of those books and sent them to Heritage, I felt free. Kind of a weird way to explain it, but the books that meant so much to me, and cumulatively, had a pretty high value, were no longer there for me to worry about. There was a great weight lifted off of my shoulders.

 

Actually, this is where my story now ties into Mick's. I didn't have any change of heart until I visited Mick and his family, and actually got to see the beauty of them after they had left my possession. Oh, I was floored. Perhaps I didn't show it too much, but not only did I see an absolutely astonishing collection of books, but the passion that I used to feel, rushed back and smacked me in the face, yelling "What the $%#^ did you do??".

 

I felt torn inside. Until I actually left Mick's place did I come back down to my happy land of unicorns, rainbows and lollipops.

 

...and I do love your place, too, Mick.

[r100comics]

 

Any thoughts on the OAAW #83 CGC 7.0 that just sold for $8,500 on Comiclink ?

 

I don't really follow this market, but that's double what I'd expect.

 

I wonder where this puts the price of the 6.5's ?

 

 

[comick1]

Andy and Shep,

I absolutely wonder what I'd do with the money if I sold the books. Buy some property, take a bunch of vacations, retire earlier than I'm on track to do. Dunno. The thing is that I've always tried to strike a balance (sometimes unsuccessfully) between comics and family needs. . .something that almost every collector goes through, unless they aren't in a relationship and happen to hold down an incredibly lucrative job (and I know a couple folks who are like that, too). The balance, though, is important. As long as we're not putting due stress on the family income, it's all good and the good part of the balance is that it's one of the things that keeps me centered and happy.

 

I've had to sell stuff at various times. . .but most of the time, not for family needs. Most of the time, it's been to fund something else. I have found that, as I get older, I've begun to rely more heavily on just my income to purchase things instead of flipping 2nd or 3rd string books. But that's only because I've already cut to the bone in terms of the 2nd and 3rd string books OR those 2nd & 3rd string books just will NOT command the $$ they deserve if I DO elect to sell them.

 

A number of years back, I sold a box full of high grade Atlas western, war, sci-fi, and romance. It was to fund another item. At the time, those Atlases didn't command even close to what they deserved and I regret it (wasn't selling them fire-sale style either. . .I was methodical about the way I sold them), but they were really the only means for me to fund the purchase. It worked out in the end alright, but as the last couple of years have unfolded, I've watched the same and similar issues go for some truly respectable prices that I could've gotten if I'd waited. Ah well.

 

I sold my Adams run of Green Lantern about 3 years ago and felt like they went for strong market prices, but that might be related more to the hype prior to the movie.

 

The point is that I've wanted to buy more stuff as it emerges in to the market, and I can take a sizable purchase every now and then, but can't do it when there are a bunch released at the same time. . .and keeping up with that lately has been QUITE a challenge.

Edited September 8, 2012 by Comick1

[Jeffro.]

I was going through some 10 cent books last night and the thought of letting some go (as I stated previously in this thread) was troubling, to say the least. Maybe I'm just not ready.

It's funny, when I first stated collecting I was, like a lot of people I think, into superheroes in a big way. Now, 20-30 years later, the vast majority of those books in my collection mean almost nothing to me. I could sell them without batting an eye. My war comics, on the other hand, would be a bit more difficult.