Pressing project results--post here

[Red Hook]

I too was surprised by the rather hostile tone that Brad's posts suddenly took on.

 

Substitute "hostile" with "frustrated" and you'll have that about right. I will take Matt's word on picking his spots for disassembly.

[Matt Nelson]

I too was surprised by the rather hostile tone that Brad's posts suddenly took on.

 

Substitute "hostile" with "frustrated" and you'll have that about right. I will take Matt's word on picking his spots for disassembly.

 

Just to be clear, I only disassemble a book if I intend to restore it.

[Matt Nelson]

I have bad news for everyone here, the Treasury Dept misses really high quality counterfeited money all the time too. And they're always trying to catch up to new techniques because the counterfeiters are always raising their game. All they can do is catch enough sufficiently frequently to deter most counterfeiters. I'm not sure how CGC can be held to a higher standard than an arm of the federal govt charged with protecting the lifeblood of commerce.

 

I agree. Of course, we don't see the Treasury Dept throwing its hands up and saying "well, if we can't detect it, you can spend it."

 

The Treasury Dept example was in reference to trimming, and not pressing. Trimming is detectible. CGC would never say that about trimming.

[Ze-man]

 

 

 

 

 

 

As far as the results compare to the project books, Wait until the Golden Age books come back for comicdey and the other remaining participants. These books respond better to pressing. You'll see they made much better improvements than the Silver and Bronze did, similar to the Superman above.

 

Well, to try and steer this back On topic..

 

The Superman book is obviously offest terribly. But when looking at the scan it appears to have minimal spine roll. Was this simply from being pressed in the scanner? Or was this a botched pressing job by another person? It just looks really, really flat. Was curious what your notes said upon recieving the book.

 

 

Secondly,

 

Do GA books make better pressing candidates at the same as hinder themselves due to their age and composition? I guess I am asking of all the books you press how many are sent back "unpressable" I know CGC wont slab a book that exhibits severe overhang etc... What determines if a book should not be pressed? Similar factors?.. Brittleness,too brown or aged to such a degree the paper wont respond?

 

Ze-

[marvelcollector]

I see the same thing in my intel law cases. The CIA keeps invoking what is called the state secrets privilege to shut down my cases. The Judges keep going along with it and refuse to perform the function the Supreme Court instructed them to do more than 50 years ago. Knowing that the Judges won't challenge the agencies, the Executive Branch keeps exploiting that weakness and increasingly invokes the privilege. I'm challenging the Executive Branch for improperly invoking the privilege and I am trying to get the Judicial Branch to do its job. Both objectives serve the same purpose and co-exist.

 

So in answer to your question, yes, absolutely, I'm working on addressing the CGC angle as well.

 

To someone casually reading this thread and unaware of your background this might seem incredulous.....

 

Just a funny thought that struck me...

[Aman619]

is it that the govt cant detect it? Or that they are constantly one step behind until they DO catch it. After all, how DO counterfeit bills come to their attention? Are THEY actually out there sampling random bills in a systematic way across the country? Or do they rely on merchants and banks to spot an irregularity and send it in for a ruling?

 

Its one thing for CGC to err in noticing resto on a book in their possession while actuallt scrutinizing a book for resto. And another for the treasury dept to have to stumble onto a bad bill. "out there" in circulation

[Davenport]

 

What is your solution or suggestion to CGC concerning your opinion of their overstating detection abilities? If you think it's a problem, suggest something. If someone presents a problem here on the boards, they need to accompany those problems with realistic, viable solutions. Otherwise, they are doing nothing but blowing a lot of hot air. I don't mean that you're doing this, Brad. Just a general statement I'm making to no one in particular.

Maybe add another little sticker? Well, you asked for suggestions.

 

[Matt Nelson]

 

What is your solution or suggestion to CGC concerning your opinion of their overstating detection abilities? If you think it's a problem, suggest something. If someone presents a problem here on the boards, they need to accompany those problems with realistic, viable solutions. Otherwise, they are doing nothing but blowing a lot of hot air. I don't mean that you're doing this, Brad. Just a general statement I'm making to no one in particular.

Maybe add another little sticker? Well, you asked for suggestions.

 

 

very realistic....

[Red Hook]

Yeah, but he can't go into how he did it.

[esquirecomics]

I have bad news for everyone here, the Treasury Dept misses really high quality counterfeited money all the time too. And they're always trying to catch up to new techniques because the counterfeiters are always raising their game. All they can do is catch enough sufficiently frequently to deter most counterfeiters. I'm not sure how CGC can be held to a higher standard than an arm of the federal govt charged with protecting the lifeblood of commerce.

 

I agree. Of course, we don't see the Treasury Dept throwing its hands up and saying "well, if we can't detect it, you can spend it."

 

The Treasury Dept example was in reference to trimming, and not pressing. Trimming is detectible. CGC would never say that about trimming.

 

Perhaps so Matt.

 

In any event, I am not sure if one can quantify whether micro-trimming is more or less detectable than pressing, particularly if one is not looking for it carefully, but in any event, pressing is not undetectable. While it is clearly extremely difficult to detect at times, knowlege brings power and when the past history of a book is known, it becomes far more easier to detect. I've confirmed that numerous books that I suspected had been pressed were in fact pressed because I found out who the past owners were and I asked, and they said yes.

[esquirecomics]

I see the same thing in my intel law cases. The CIA keeps invoking what is called the state secrets privilege to shut down my cases. The Judges keep going along with it and refuse to perform the function the Supreme Court instructed them to do more than 50 years ago. Knowing that the Judges won't challenge the agencies, the Executive Branch keeps exploiting that weakness and increasingly invokes the privilege. I'm challenging the Executive Branch for improperly invoking the privilege and I am trying to get the Judicial Branch to do its job. Both objectives serve the same purpose and co-exist.

 

So in answer to your question, yes, absolutely, I'm working on addressing the CGC angle as well.

 

To someone casually reading this thread and unaware of your background this might seem incredulous.....

 

Just a funny thought that struck me...

 

You don't know the half of it. Try dealing with the Intelligence Community on a daily basis. I often have to tell clients to stop trying to rationally understand how the IC works and why they are being treated a particular way b/c it will drive them crazy. I once had a CIA lawyer tell me outright that even impossibility is not a defense to them, i.e., if they claim you were in a specific location on one date but you can prove you were elsewhere, doesn't matter. Simply doesn't matter.

[Matt Nelson]

I have bad news for everyone here, the Treasury Dept misses really high quality counterfeited money all the time too. And they're always trying to catch up to new techniques because the counterfeiters are always raising their game. All they can do is catch enough sufficiently frequently to deter most counterfeiters. I'm not sure how CGC can be held to a higher standard than an arm of the federal govt charged with protecting the lifeblood of commerce.

 

I agree. Of course, we don't see the Treasury Dept throwing its hands up and saying "well, if we can't detect it, you can spend it."

 

The Treasury Dept example was in reference to trimming, and not pressing. Trimming is detectible. CGC would never say that about trimming.

 

Perhaps so Matt.

 

In any event, I am not sure if one can quantify whether micro-trimming is more or less detectable than pressing, particularly if one is not looking for it carefully, but in any event, pressing is not undetectable. While it is clearly extremely difficult to detect at times, knowlege brings power and when the past history of a book is known, it becomes far more easier to detect. I've confirmed that numerous books that I suspected had been pressed were in fact pressed because I found out who the past owners were and I asked, and they said yes.

 

What made you suspect those books were pressed, besides past sales records or some sort of verbal confirmation? Any clues on the books themselves?

[Matt Nelson]

Yeah, but he can't go into how he did it.

 

What hubris!!!

[Matt Nelson]

 

 

 

 

 

 

As far as the results compare to the project books, Wait until the Golden Age books come back for comicdey and the other remaining participants. These books respond better to pressing. You'll see they made much better improvements than the Silver and Bronze did, similar to the Superman above.

 

Well, to try and steer this back On topic..

 

The Superman book is obviously offest terribly. But when looking at the scan it appears to have minimal spine roll. Was this simply from being pressed in the scanner? Or was this a botched pressing job by another person? It just looks really, really flat. Was curious what your notes said upon recieving the book.

 

 

Secondly,

 

Do GA books make better pressing candidates at the same as hinder themselves due to their age and composition? I guess I am asking of all the books you press how many are sent back "unpressable" I know CGC wont slab a book that exhibits severe overhang etc... What determines if a book should not be pressed? Similar factors?.. Brittleness,too brown or aged to such a degree the paper wont respond?

 

Ze-

 

Brittle paper is a big no-no. Most books can be pressed. What determines it's candidacy is more about upgrade potential and cost effectiveness.

[FlyingDonut]

Hulk head hurt

 

Where are the pressing project result pictures? Are those being posted in other threads now?

 

I do want to see the results of everybody's experiments. Can those be posted somewhere please?

[esquirecomics]

I have bad news for everyone here, the Treasury Dept misses really high quality counterfeited money all the time too. And they're always trying to catch up to new techniques because the counterfeiters are always raising their game. All they can do is catch enough sufficiently frequently to deter most counterfeiters. I'm not sure how CGC can be held to a higher standard than an arm of the federal govt charged with protecting the lifeblood of commerce.

 

I agree. Of course, we don't see the Treasury Dept throwing its hands up and saying "well, if we can't detect it, you can spend it."

 

The Treasury Dept example was in reference to trimming, and not pressing. Trimming is detectible. CGC would never say that about trimming.

 

Perhaps so Matt.

 

In any event, I am not sure if one can quantify whether micro-trimming is more or less detectable than pressing, particularly if one is not looking for it carefully, but in any event, pressing is not undetectable. While it is clearly extremely difficult to detect at times, knowlege brings power and when the past history of a book is known, it becomes far more easier to detect. I've confirmed that numerous books that I suspected had been pressed were in fact pressed because I found out who the past owners were and I asked, and they said yes.

 

What made you suspect those books were pressed, besides past sales records or some sort of verbal confirmation? Any clues on the books themselves?

 

They were already CGC'd, and usually pedigrees. Given their pedigree status people had databases indicating there had been different grades attributed to the book. Doesn't of course mean they were pressed, could have been a simple upgrade. So I checked. Pressed.

[Darthdiesel]

So I checked. Pressed.

 

Who were these dealers? What were the books? Who did the pressing? In the interest of full disclosure and all and as the leader of this "call for full disclosure" camp, please enlighten us, as it is your duty, nay, obligation to educate the masses...

 

And answer Matt's question instead of "tapdancing/sidestepping/deflecting - whatever term Ze-man wants to call it" around it: Are you just going by what these folks told you OR is there any sign of pressing on the books themselves, and if so, what was the telltale signs?

[Aman619]

and no hubris either.!

[Red Hook]

Yeah, but he can't go into how he did it.

 

What hubris!!!

 

Oh, krap....I'm never going to hear the end of that, eh?

[october]

Hulk head hurt

 

Where are the pressing project result pictures? Are those being posted in other threads now?

 

I do want to see the results of everybody's experiments. Can those be posted somewhere please?

 

It was good while it lasted, but I am not surprised to see this thread get clogged up with further debate that belongs somewhere else. Matt and others went to a lot of effort to make this experiment happen, the least some of you can do (Esquire, Hook, ect) is to post in the other dozen threads on this subject and LEAVE THIS ONE TO WHAT IT WAS INTENDED FOR. I actually had a passing interest in seeing how other people's books turned out until it degenerated into yet another long winded debate punctuated by hissy fits and flame wars. If you don't have a report, or a direct comment on a report, why don't you take it someplace else.