Obadiah Oldbuck vs. Superman

[FlyingDonut]

Deja Vu all over again.

Sayeth the ASM 121 supporter.

 

I think I was convinced to go to Conan 1, no?

[mica]

Deja Vu all over again.

Sayeth the ASM 121 supporter.

 

I think I was convinced to go to Conan 1, no?

Didn't read that far.

It's all I can do to keep up with this thread that keeps getting bumped.

[BLBcomics-migration]

Nice pics, and as you can see, Obadiah has taken his place along with many others in their proper context as part of the very long and fascinating evolution of the comics medium. Our comic book library features everything from a 1500s German broadsheet to Obadiah and Jeremiah to the Yellow Kid and the Spider to BLBs and then those old familiar comics from Action #1 right up to Ultimate Spider-Man #1 and beyond.

 

Just got back from Baltimore, Wash DC, etc - the comicon was fun, albeit biz was a bit slow

 

Steve Geppi's museum is fantastic, every one should bring all their family members and friends to check it out, as it validates this crazy hobby we all love

 

Spent Monday at Library of Congress, found some more early comic strips from 1853 thru `862 before i ran out of the day allocated, then hit the road to get back into my comics business in the midwest - i'll post a couple scans here in a day or so once i get the van unloaded

 

I am totally used to reporters getting their stories wrong - they take notes, and then look at em later, trying to figure out what they saw - common same-o, same-o, a reporter got it wrong

 

Arnold, i looked around for you, did not see you Thurday nite - had a good chat with John Snyder, Steve Geppi, John Clark, Russ Cochran, Mark Huesman, and other Gemstone/Diamond people plus Mark Zaid, Steve Meyer - and their lovely wives

 

- plus Brian Walker, whose book THE COMICS BEFORE 1945 published last year takes a look-see at the 1842 Obadiah Oldbuck - his pop some may have heard of, Mort Walker, creator of Beetle Baily

 

OO sits in the main comic book room - in a section in chrono-order

 

Did ya'll miss me?

[ciorac]

 

Did ya'll miss me?

 

Sure did Bob.

[showcase4]

 

Did ya'll miss me?

 

Sure did Bob.

 

I did as well....The Boards have been very unforgiving and brutal the past few days....I referred to ASM 121 as the 1st Bronze Age book, instead of Conan 1 or Green Lantern 76 and virtually got drawn and quartered, tarred and feathered, had bamboo shoots placed under my fingernails, and then kicked off the Boards!

[goldust40]

 

Did ya'll miss me?

 

Sure did Bob.

 

I did as well....The Boards have been very unforgiving and brutal the past few days....I referred to ASM 121 as the 1st Bronze Age book, instead of Conan 1 or Green Lantern 76 and virtually got drawn and quartered, tarred and feathered, had bamboo shoots placed under my fingernails, and then kicked off the Boards!

 

Serves you right for such blasphemy. Besides, everyone knows it was really Strange Adventures 205.

[selegue]

 

I did as well....The Boards have been very unforgiving and brutal the past few days....I referred to ASM 121 as the 1st Bronze Age book....

 

Serves you right for such blasphemy. Besides, everyone knows it was really Strange Adventures 205.

 

I've read that argument before and it's reasonable. Deadman has a Bronze Age tone. Personally, I'd say that SA 205 (Oct 1967, too early for true Bronze Age and still 12¢) to 216 are harbingers of the Bronze Age, and the book becomes a classic Bronze Age reprint book from 217 (Mar-Apr 1969) to 244 (end of run). A look at the cover gallery makes that seem reasonable.

 

Strange Adventures

 

And to make SA even more of a bellwether, one could say that SA #9 (Jun 1951, 1st Captain Comet) is the first harbinger of the Silver Age!

 

The "what time did the Bronze Age begin?" question doesn't make sense to me. It's a gradual slide, and every book that survived into the Bronze Age switched over at a different point. In fact, the Jimmy Olsen theory that #1 (Sep-Oct 1954) is the second harbinger (predates Detective Comics #225, Nov 1955) of the Silver Age, #132 (Sep 1970) is the last Silver Age issue and #133 (Oct 1970, 1st Kirby return to DC, right?) is the first Bronze Age issue provides convenient demarcation points.

 

Enough rambling in the wrong thread, unless we want to debate whether they're all "real" comic books.

 

Jack

[infinite_comics-migration]

 

Did ya'll miss me?

 

Sure did Bob.

 

I did as well....The Boards have been very unforgiving and brutal the past few days....I referred to ASM 121 as the 1st Bronze Age book, instead of Conan 1 or Green Lantern 76 and virtually got drawn and quartered, tarred and feathered, had bamboo shoots placed under my fingernails, and then kicked off the Boards!

 

Wow, what a drama queen (or was that an attempt at humor?).

In case you missed it Bob, here's what the pompous azz posted as THE definitive list of what is irrefutably the history of comics, in response to this statement:

"But there is no definitive "first American comic book", just as there is no definitive "first Silver Age book" or "first Bronze Age book"."

 

there certainly is a 1st Silver Age comic book - Showcase-4

"" """ "" 1st Bronze Age comic book - Spidey 121

"" "" "" 1st American Comic book - Obadiah Oldbuck

 

all 3 of these are examples of definitive 1st books, UNLESS proven otherwise.

 

Of course, only an insufficiently_thoughtful_person would post something like this, as the original statement makes total sense, and his points have been proven "otherwise" many times over. It was just another self-serving thread bump to try to shoehorn OO into the "first" category by comparing it to these books. But, of course, he only succeeded in making himself look stupider, now even more so by making light of (humor?) his statements in an attempt to backpedal from them. So you didn't miss anything new.

 

Even Bob wouldn't be foolish enough to state "Yes, there is one and only one book that started the _____ Age, and it is definitely "________".

[Timulty]

I think the problem with saying what starts an age, is that most people don't define what makes the age. To me an age, in this instance is when Industry sweeping changes occur. Golden Age starts with Action #1 because it was an industry sweeping change from putting reprint humor material in comic books to Superhero(which did not exist in the form we see today). With the Silver age, the concept of retcon occurs(old characters get new origins, new looks etc). The Bronze age is the tough one. One could argue the shift in more realistic story telling with GL 76 but was that change actually industry sweeping?

[showcase4]

Wow, what a drama queen

pompous azz

an insufficiently_thoughtful_person

 

Why don't you come to Baltimore some time , and I'll treat to you to a nice lunch and give you the tour of the town...you seem like a wonderful human being to spend the day with

[infinite_comics-migration]

Avoiding the topic(s) doesn't make you look less foolish. Just say you now realize how stupid it was to post what you did, that you were just trying to shoehorn/equate OO with Showcase #4 as something "definitive", you were rightfully called on it, and we can move on.

 

By moving on I mean you can get back to repeating your OO mantra over and over and over again...

[BLBcomics-migration]

i have been stating in my Overstreet history lessons for some years now that OO is definitively the first American stand alone comic book,

 

not the first comic strip, as there are examples printed as broadsides and inside other book(lets) such as Almanacs which pre-date OO, we show some examples in Overstreet,

 

and I am a bit puzzled by Bill P's wording a few pages back in his BREAKING NEWS the day he got his OO in the mail that the format was confusing to him

 

I am confused by your confusion,Bill, cuz OO's original 1842 format is like you see it there, wrap around folded like a Action #1 - please clarify for me

 

Here are "Ages" or "eras" of the comic books as i see it:

 

Victorian 1800s

If picking one book, OO for 1842

 

Platinum late 1880s thru mid 1930s

Brownies in 1880s intro fantasy character merch in America

 

Modern Era: : mid 1930s up

 

1) Gold mid 1930s thru late 1940s

Action #1 does not begin "Gold" as heroes and original material pre dates it such as Deadwood Gulch #1 1931 Clancey the Cop 1 2 1931 Humor three books 1933 Tim McCoy Police Car 17 #1 Whitman 1934

 

2) Atomic Romance late 1940s thru Code

genres begin to explode

 

2) Silver Age: Code thru 1970 when basicly when Kirby left for DC

impossible to pin just one book as "Beginning" but several come to mind

suh as Str Adv 9 Uncle Scrooge 386 Mad #1 Jimmy Olsen 1 ala 1952-54

 

3) Bronze: late 1960s thru 1980 or so

impossible to pin one book down; if i was to pick a book, it would be ZAP COMICS #! printed Feb 1968 which is overlooked in the cosmic scheme of things cuz it ain't in the OPG

 

4) 1980s up is "current" to me

as this begins the serious Direct Market Era which had its start in 1968 with ZAP #1, expands in 1973 with Phil Seuling and then 1979 when Marvel became serious about supporting it big time

 

All these "ages" or "eras" overlap a lot as true history does in real life

[ciorac]

Wow, what a drama queen

pompous azz

an insufficiently_thoughtful_person

 

Why don't you come to Baltimore some time , and I'll treat to you to a nice lunch and give you the tour of the town...you seem like a wonderful human being to spend the day with

 

 

[ciorac]

i have been stating in my Overstreet history lessons for some years now that OO is definitively the first American stand alone comic book,

 

not the first comic strip, as there are examples printed as broadsides and inside other book(lets) such as Almanacs which pre-date OO, we show some examples in Overstreet,

 

and I am a bit puzzled by Bill P's wording a few pages back in his BREAKING NEWS the day he got his OO in the mail that the format was confusing to him

 

I am confused by your confusion,Bill, cuz OO's original 1842 format is like you see it there, wrap around folded like a Action #1 - please clarify for me

 

Here are "Ages" or "eras" of the comic books as i see it:

 

Victorian 1800s

If picking one book, OO for 1842

 

Platinum late 1880s thru mid 1930s

Brownies in 1880s intro fantasy character merch in America

 

Modern Era: : mid 1930s up

 

1) Gold mid 1930s thru late 1940s

Action #1 does not begin "Gold" as heroes and original material pre dates it such as Deadwood Gulch #1 1931 Clancey the Cop 1 2 1931 Humor three books 1933 Tim McCoy Police Car 17 #1 Whitman 1934

 

2) Atomic Romance late 1940s thru Code

genres begin to explode

 

2) Silver Age: Code thru 1970 when basicly when Kirby left for DC

impossible to pin just one book as "Beginning" but several come to mind

suh as Str Adv 9 Uncle Scrooge 386 Mad #1 Jimmy Olsen 1 ala 1952-54

 

3) Bronze: late 1960s thru 1980 or so

impossible to pin one book down; if i was to pick a book, it would be ZAP COMICS #! printed Feb 1968 which is overlooked in the cosmic scheme of things cuz it ain't in the OPG

 

4) 1980s up is "current" to me

as this begins the serious Direct Market Era which had its start in 1968 with ZAP #1, expands in 1973 with Phil Seuling and then 1979 when Marvel became serious about supporting it big time

 

All these "ages" or "eras" overlap a lot as true history does in real life

 

Well Bob, here is what I see. Now admittedly I don't have a copy of the original in my hands, so I just have a scan either you or Steve posted of it, and the reprint I bought from you. But to me they look to be in different formats.

 

This one looks "landscape" to me. It is a rectangle on its long side. Not like comic books or magazines that I am familiar with. This format looks more like old linen back books from the early 20th and late 19th century.

 

 

 

Now here is the reprint. It looks "portrait". A rectangle standing on the short side. Which is more like comic books and magazines that I am familiar with. That is why I said it looks like the First American Comic Magazine.

 

[ciorac]

i have been stating in my Overstreet history lessons for some years now that OO is definitively the first American stand alone comic book,

 

Here are "Ages" or "eras" of the comic books as i see it:

 

 

Modern Era: : mid 1930s up

 

1) Gold mid 1930s thru late 1940s

Action #1 does not begin "Gold" as heroes and original material pre dates it such as Deadwood Gulch #1 1931 Clancey the Cop 1 2 1931 Humor three books 1933 Tim McCoy Police Car 17 #1 Whitman 1934

 

 

2) Atomic Romance late 1940s thru Code

genres begin to explode

 

2) Silver Age: Code thru 1970 when basicly when Kirby left for DC

impossible to pin just one book as "Beginning" but several come to mind

suh as Str Adv 9 Uncle Scrooge 386 Mad #1 Jimmy Olsen 1 ala 1952-54

 

3) Bronze: late 1960s thru 1980 or so

impossible to pin one book down; if i was to pick a book, it would be ZAP COMICS #! printed Feb 1968 which is overlooked in the cosmic scheme of things cuz it ain't in the OPG

 

4) 1980s up is "current" to me

as this begins the serious Direct Market Era which had its start in 1968 with ZAP #1, expands in 1973 with Phil Seuling and then 1979 when Marvel became serious about supporting it big time

 

All these "ages" or "eras" overlap a lot as true history does in real life

 

this is the kind of drivel that drives me nuts!!

 

Action 1 does not begin Gold?

 

What in the heck did you smoke while you were in Baltimore?

 

You put Deadwood Freakin Gulch and Clancey the Cop as the genesis of the Golden Age of Comics!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

 

The Golden Age of Comics does not simply refer to a time period, it refers to when what comics have become, began, that Golden Shining Era. For Pete's sake Bob. Must you constantly insert what you collect and sell into every discussion???

 

 

Uncle Scrooge started the Silver Age??

 

Zap Comics started the Bronze Age???

 

You have completely gone off the deep end bro. Your latest assertions are flabbergasting. Just ridiculous. I guess having box after box of Undergrounds, Plats, Ducks, etc for sale, has no bearing whatsoever on the above lunacy?

 

I know you love that stuff. Cool. Lots of people do. But lordy lordy, what kind of world is it when a man with the knowledge and experience of Bob Beerbohm says that the immortal Clancey the Cop started the whole blamed Golden Age. I better get my butt over to eBay and see if I can find me one before there is a run on them and the price skyrockets!

 

[BLBcomics-migration]

 

Well Bob, here is what I see. Now admittedly I don't have a copy of the original in my hands, so I just have a scan either you or Steve posted of it, and the reprint I bought from you. But to me they look to be in different formats.

 

This one looks "landscape" to me. It is a rectangle on its long side. Not like comic books or magazines that I am familiar with. This format looks more like old linen back books from the early 20th and late 19th century.

 

 

 

Now here is the reprint. It looks "portrait". A rectangle standing on the short side. Which is more like comic books and magazines that I am familiar with. That is why I said it looks like the First American Comic Magazine.

 

 

OK, now i understand

 

I am sure Showcase has posted covers and pages from the first printing from 1842

 

I know i have posted some sample pages which is what you see in the reprint you got from me

 

The first printing is "normal" comic book size as we know it from Famous Funnies

 

the later printings of OO which began in 1849, some 7 years later, revert to the Euro size of just one tier of panels per page

 

If you note on the first page of the Victorian history lesson in the last few OPGs, the cover and a couple sample pages are posted there, which match up to the 2003 reprint from Italy

[showcase4]

 

Here is an image of the 1842 "1st printing"....the only issue in modern comic book format vs. the oblong and "akward looking" reprints ( akward by today's standards that is )

[ciorac]

 

Well Bob, here is what I see. Now admittedly I don't have a copy of the original in my hands, so I just have a scan either you or Steve posted of it, and the reprint I bought from you. But to me they look to be in different formats.

 

This one looks "landscape" to me. It is a rectangle on its long side. Not like comic books or magazines that I am familiar with. This format looks more like old linen back books from the early 20th and late 19th century.

 

 

 

Now here is the reprint. It looks "portrait". A rectangle standing on the short side. Which is more like comic books and magazines that I am familiar with. That is why I said it looks like the First American Comic Magazine.

 

 

OK, now i understand

 

I am sure Showcase has posted covers and pages from the first printing from 1842

 

I know i have posted some sample pages which is what you see in the reprint you got from me

 

The first printing is "normal" comic book size as we know it from Famous Funnies

 

the later printings of OO which began in 1849, some 7 years later, revert to the Euro size of just one tier of panels per page

 

If you note on the first page of the Victorian history lesson in the last few OPGs, the cover and a couple sample pages are posted there, which match up to the 2003 reprint from Italy

 

Ah! I see now. Lesson learned.

[ciorac]

 

Here is an image of the 1842 "1st printing"....the only issue in modern comic book format vs. the oblong and "akward looking" reprints ( akward by today's standards that is )

 

Thanks Steve. Great comic magazine you have their brother.

 

[BLBcomics-migration]

 

this is the kind of drivel that drives me nuts!!

 

Action 1 does not begin Gold?

 

What in the heck did you smoke while you were in Baltimore?

 

You put Deadwood Freakin Gulch and Clancey the Cop as the genesis of the Golden Age of Comics!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

 

The Golden Age of Comics does not simply refer to a time period, it refers to when what comics have become, began, that Golden Shining Era. For Pete's sake Bob. Must you constantly insert what you collect and sell into every discussion???

 

 

Uncle Scrooge started the Silver Age??

 

Zap Comics started the Bronze Age???

 

You have completely gone off the deep end bro. Your latest assertions are flabbergasting. Just ridiculous. I guess having box after box of Undergrounds, Plats, Ducks, etc for sale, has no bearing whatsoever on the above lunacy?

 

I know you love that stuff. Cool. Lots of people do. But lordy lordy, what kind of world is it when a man with the knowledge and experience of Bob Beerbohm says that the immortal Clancey the Cop started the whole blamed Golden Age. I better get my butt over to eBay and see if I can find me one before there is a run on them and the price skyrockets!

 

 

I can ascertain with much certainty that you have never bothered to READ my comics history lessons which have been running in Overstreet for a decade now. I discuss all of what i briefly listed therein and a whole lot more as comics history evolution is unfolded for one to learn.

 

I have noticed a New Trend i do not agree with the last few years, in fact will never agree with, to make Action #1 the beginning of the "golden age" of comics - this is new to me,

 

methinks you have been drinking too much again, "bro"

 

I have been making my living for some decades now selling & buying, even trading, comic books, comic strips, pulps, character toys, animation & movie stuff and related material - i have comic books from every conceivable age, era, genre that one might wish to shake a stick at - big F***in deal.

 

For you to imply, state, write, what ever one wishes to call the above lunacy drivil you have just written is insulting to say the least

 

My comics history is the pinnacle of integrity

 

My comics history lessons in Overstreet have nothing to do with what i sell or buy for re-sale

 

I listed Deadwood Gulch, Clancey the Cop as well as Detective Dan, Ace King, Bob Scully, as well as Tim McCoy Police Car 17 from 1934 as examples of original comics material pre-dating Action #1, as some one (you?) listed that as a starting point of original material in the posts which ran while i was gone comicon in Baltimore

 

You did not READ my post: i state in there that nothing is the BEGINNING of any era except maybe Obadiah Oldbuck as a comic book

 

All other eras over lap one another - NOTHING is BC/AD in the other comics "eras"

 

takre a breather, have some coffee, detox, and come back to this

 

Now, i jest with you - and i trust you jest with me, but if not, then we got problems

 

Has sho'nuff infiltrated Mississippi ??

 

bob beerbohm