Do artists make more money from the publishers...

[Guardian Comics]

or the consumers? Not talking Neals Adam or the like but more of the modern artists. If you see an artist selling a modern cover for $3,000 or $4,000 or a DPS for $1,000 is that more money than Marvel or D.C. paid them to draw the piece in the first place? Just trying to get an idea what a modern artist makes. Are they salaried, do they get paid per piece, is there a back end (like movies) if the book is a super hit? Just curious.

 

Jim

[lmiller]

well. i can tell a few thing.s that will help you out. all publishers have standard rates for pencils. inks and covers. writers now if your a super hot artist say marvel or dc may sign you to a exclusive contract which forbids you from working for another company.

in that case they are going to pay very well. also if you happen to land a hot book like the x-men certain titles pay royalties so you have that coming. and you get your artwork back so it a pretty win win thing for the artist. even if they are only making scale. wages they could still make more money selling the artwork than what they were paid to draw it in the 1st place.

 

hope this answer.help.s you out some,

 

larry. ;]

[jjeanius]

That's not always the case. Sure, popular artists make fairly decent secondary income selling their pages...provided they price them accurately and the pages do in fact sell (just because a page has a high price tag doesn't mean the artist is getting that money). For the most part, though, most artists work on books where the art isn't exactly in high demand. If you look at the shelves, you can pretty much pick put which artists and titles do well as far as OA is concerned. Keep in mind, though, that just as most comic books don't end up being terribly desirable...the same is true of original artwork. Most artists live primarily off of their page rates...and any additional income through commissions or page sales is gravy...and largely a secondary concern.

[lmiller]

jjeanius. while what you say do have some merit. if were taking about a no name artist or some one new on the scene. that would ring true.

 

but because most of us do go after top artist. what i said was true like a jim lee or david finch. what they are paid by the companies make them very well off. selling the art is just gravy. for some one like jim lee. and let me say it.s some mighty good gravy he,s getting for his art.

 

larry ;]

[comicartfan]

Jim Lee or an Alex Ross will make big bucks off their art in the secondary market, that is true. But they are part of an exclusive club and 98% of the working artists out there aren't making huge money.... And if they do reach a certian level, it is with years of hard work. Hunched over a drawing table for hours and hours with deadlines looming is a tough way to make a living. It's lonely and there are probably more sacrifices than us common folk can realize.

[lmiller]

comicartfan. thanks for your input. but i gotta say i think 98 % is a lil high on that number you have on working artist.s that do not make good money on there art. at 98 % that amount of art at that rate x-s x-amount of books tens of thousands of pages that cheap . its safe to say it would not be too much of a market for comic art. . so again on the whole most pro artist.s with a few years under there belt working steady will do just fine.

 

while i pretty sure there are some starving artist out there. it not like 98% of the biz are just living paycheck to paycheck.

 

larry.

[Kevin76]

A self publisher usually sells around 1000-3000 copies...pretty much covers the cost of making another issue as they eat canned tunafish for dinner.As far as Marvel and DC goes, I've heard a $100 a page and more for the covers,Marvel paid Mcfarlane about a million a year when he was on Spider-Man in the early 90's. It really depends on how the industry is doing,if the industry is doing well,then so are the artists.I know they also used to give out royalites,not sure if they do that anymore. Of course a superstar like Jim Lee,Michael Turner,Alex Ross,Adam Hughes can make more off thier art on the secondary market but after selling a key piece for 5K,that same piece 10 years later now sells for 20K and there is nothing they can do about it,except sign it for the new owner at a convention and get a pat on the back.

[jjeanius]

comicartfan. thanks for your input. but i gotta say i think 98 % is a lil high on that number you have on working artist.s that do not make good money on there art. at 98 % that amount of art at that rate x-s x-amount of books tens of thousands of pages that cheap . its safe to say it would not be too much of a market for comic art. . so again on the whole most pro artist.s with a few years under there belt working steady will do just fine.

 

while i pretty sure there are some starving artist out there. it not like 98% of the biz are just living paycheck to paycheck.

 

larry.

 

Actually, 98% sounds correct to me. How many "HOT" books are out there...vs the hundreds of books published each month? Look at comics...what percentage of comics are truly valuable and collectible...and what percentage are quarter-bin fodder? Even if an "average" artist makes an extra $80/$100 per page when selling their original art, that equates to...and extra $1000, maybe $2000 per month depending on how much art they sell? Not much in the greater scheme of things. And there are plenty of artists out there who don't even get that for their artwork. Even if you have an "average" title that sells a decent amount every month...that doesn't mean there are people out there looking for the OA. Since the art is so much more expensive that the comic books, it's a lot easier for an "average" book to keep readers at $3/month even when it's nothing special...then it is to get art collectors to want to spend $$ on the art...ESPECIALLY given the fact that it's "nothing special". The VAST majority of OA produced every month is worth $30 or less per page...just as the VAST majority of comic books produced today have no value on the secondary market. You can talk about Jim Lee, Michael Turner, Ed Benes, etc, all you like...but these are the EXCEPTIONS to the rule...a handful of very talented, very lucky individuals in an industry of 1000's....

[lmiller]

kevin76. iam glad some one see.s my point. iam not taking about the industry right at this moment i was taking about it on a whole for the last ten years.

 

thanks. larry.

[lmiller]

jjeanius. 1st do you have any ideal on marvel or dc page rates. it more than $ 80.00 thats for sure. for pencils at least . also the question was a general question about artist selling there artwork. not about how collectible comics are today, also if you think 98 % of working comic artist that work for marvel and dc only get $ 30.00 or less for there original pages on the open market. then please e-mail me off list a list of names of artist.s that work for marvel or dc that sell there work for 30 or less. i don,t want to start a riot here on the board. it will be out lil secret, thanks.

 

larry ;]

[Darrell F]

e-mail me off list a list of names of artist.s that work for marvel or dc that sell there work for 30 or less.

 

I have picked up quite a few pieces not listed on my CAF gallery for less than $30 and they are from some known people.

[comicartfan]

comicartfan. thanks for your input. but i gotta say i think 98 % is a lil high on that number you have on working artist.s that do not make good money on there art. at 98 % that amount of art at that rate x-s x-amount of books tens of thousands of pages that cheap . its safe to say it would not be too much of a market for comic art. . so again on the whole most pro artist.s with a few years under there belt working steady will do just fine.

 

while i pretty sure there are some starving artist out there. it not like 98% of the biz are just living paycheck to paycheck.

 

larry.

 

I think this is a misconception about artists....or should I say artists that "made it".....Adam Hughes is an example of an extremely popular artist and his sketches generate huge money on the secondary market. But I recall a statement that was made on an infamous thread on the comic-l group about salaries. His girlfriend/business partner made a comment about how people are lead to believe that these artists live the high life, when in all actualty they do "live paycheck to paycheck" like a majority of working class and that they themselves weren't even able to buy a home....

 

All through history are tales of artists that made meager livings, died either poor or just about, only to have their art sell for millions after they were gone...Not saying an Adam Hughes WW cover is going to be worth millions, but like Kevin said, as time tells, values go up and the artist sees nothing.....

[lmiller]

comicartfan. while i have to agree that i have too score a nice page or too from a very well know artist every blue moon on the cheap. belive me i look for cheap art .

 

but i guess i never really thought about the angle on the older artist not getting really paid for there work and them only to sell they work for penny,s because a few dealer took advantage of them, but that a whole other thing i don,t want to get into.

 

but as for current artist. now that there is a market for comic art let just say the newer guys are doing a lil better than the artist of the 50 and 60.s i belive it was neal adams in the late 70.s that started the change that allow todays artist to reap the benefits they enjoy today

 

but i do want to thank you for your info. it,s made me think a lil deeper on my comments. and i do recall a few pro artist leaving the industry to go on to other career.s in the art world to make better money. but has the comic book industry changed that much. i remember when liefeld. lee. mc farlane came back to marvel from image they were all paid million,s

 

i heard it straight from rob.s mouth his royalties check from x-force # 1 was $ 600.000. so i guess that would put him in the top 2 % at that time. but all in all if your an good artist that still putting out a good product. there still is a good living to be made doing comics today.

 

 

 

larry ;]

[Kevin76]

comicartfan. while i have to agree that i have too score a nice page or too from a very well know artist every blue moon on the cheap. belive me i look for cheap art .

 

but i guess i never really thought about the angle on the older artist not getting really paid for there work and them only to sell they work for penny,s because a few dealer took advantage of them, but that a whole other thing i don,t want to get into.

 

but as for current artist. now that there is a market for comic art let just say the newer guys are doing a lil better than the artist of the 50 and 60.s i belive it was neal adams in the late 70.s that started the change that allow todays artist to reap the benefits they enjoy today

 

but i do want to thank you for your info. it,s made me think a lil deeper on my comments. and i do recall a few pro artist leaving the industry to go on to other career.s in the art world to make better money. but has the comic book industry changed that much. i remember when liefeld. lee. mc farlane came back to marvel from image they were all paid million,s

 

i heard it straight from rob.s mouth his royalties check from x-force # 1 was $ 600.000. so i guess that would put him in the top 2 % at that time. but all in all if your an good artist that still putting out a good product. there still is a good living to be made doing comics today.

 

 

 

larry ;]

 

I saw an episode of Lifestyles of The Rich and Famous and Rob Liefeld was on it...His earnings a year? $7 million. (at the height of Image no less)

[Kevin76]

I recently watched the movie "Pollock" with Ed Harris. He played Jackson Pollock a struggling modern age abstract artist who didn't acquire any kind of national fame till he accidently started doing "drip paintings" ( splattering paint on the canvas ) He died an achololic in a car accident killing himself and his mistress,he also died broke,now his paintings have recently reached new records in sales...$140+ million.

[lmiller]

kevin76. liefeld on lifestyles of the rich and famous. ? WOW i would have loved to seen that show. heck i bet they could have done a show on all the image gang at that time and i bet it would have made some great tv to watch.

 

as for jackson pollock thanks on that info. i never knew the guy died the way he did. and that really sucked he was broke at the time of his death, and now his family / estate reaped millions off his work. talk about not being able to take it with you.

 

larry ;]

[the blob]

"also if you think 98 % of working comic artist that work for marvel and dc only get $ 30.00 or less for there original pages on the open market. then please e-mail me off list a list of names of artist.s that work for marvel or dc that sell there work for 30 or less."

 

I stopped buying art a couple of years ago (not because I don't like it, but because it got very addictive [i'd go on a binge and bid of $5000 in art and win $1500 of it, which is way too much ---- and those huge packages are hard to hide from my wife), but I bought many pages directly from the artists on various Marvel and DC books for $20-$30 each. Were they great pages? No. It's pretty simple, they put it up with a $24.99 starting bid, nobody is that excited by them, and they sell for $24.99.

 

Sell a book worth pf pages, maybe some splashy ones go for more, whatever, and maybe they're getting $750 or so for their pages for a month's worth of work (if they do one book). This is no way to get rich. $750, heck, $1000, doesn't get you very far, particularly if you live in a high COL urban area. $750 doesn't pay the insurance and taxes for one month on the house I just bought. Sure, if you're prolific like Kirby you have 5 X $750 a month and it adds up, but who is doing that nowadays??

 

Also, I think "98%" is all the art out there, including all those non-Marvel/DC books, though it's probably an exageration. Your X-Men and Spidey and Wolvie titles will get more, other than the most boring pages, but no necessarily vastly more. And I guess there are DC equivalents. I have to go dig it up, but I got a pretty decent page from one of the X-Men books from the last 10 years by someone we've heard of and it was less than $50.

[delekkerste]

if you think 98 % of working comic artist that work for marvel and dc only get $ 30.00 or less for there original pages on the open market. then please e-mail me off list a list of names of artist.s that work for marvel or dc that sell there work for 30 or less. i don,t want to start a riot here on the board. it will be out lil secret, thanks.

 

Most comic art that is produced today does sell for that kind of level (if they sell at all) on the open market. Actually, let's just face the facts - most comic art produced today is barely salable. Think about how many titles are out there, how many artists there are whose names you haven't heard of and how many decompressed storyline pages there are where nothing is going on which make the OA completely unappealing. Add up all the pages that are produced in a month - do you think the market clearing price for all those pages is really $30 a pop?

 

For example, Igor Kordey - a pretty good artist, in my opinion - has been listing a lot of his pages on eBay recently, including artwork from books like X-Treme X-Men and Cable (which have a big potential following from all the mutant fans out there). The auctions started at $24.99 or less (some as low as $10) and many of them sold for $10-$15 (while others attracted no bids at all). If you can't sell an X-Men-related page for $20, what about trying to sell the less popular material out there?

 

Gene

[jjeanius]

Exactly. You don't realize how many low-end pages are out there until you start thinking about all of the OA that you aren't looking for.

 

So Larry, how many pages do you want? I have hundreds on my site that fall into the $30 or less category...just tell me how many you're looking to buy, and I'll put a care package together for you. I can even go down to $25/pg if you're looking to buy 500 at once. A dash of Sonic the Hedgehog here, a sprinkle of Betty and Veronica there, top with a bit of Masks: Too Hot for TV or perhaps a bit of Body Doubles...season to taste, and voila!

[SignatureSelect]

I get cheap pieces from artist . But most of the time the pages are 80 and up. even for panels. Here are a few artist that off the top of my head get paid well. Jim Lee, David Finch, Adam Hughes, Art Adams, J Scott Campbell, Greg Horn, Todd Mcfarlane, Adam and Andy Kubert. There are others aswell such as Mark Brooks, Steve Mcniven, Bryan Hitch. Ethan Van Sciver does alright. Now I am sure there are plenty of guys out there at are great artist that don't get alot of gigs and don't make alot of money But Sometimes it is because they want to do there own thing and they don't want to be on a major project.