SCS: my troubles continue

[DeeDee-migration]

CGC did change their procedures to address SCS by the new modern/sealed well, adding more well-sizes, and increasing the use of wedges. This change in procedures seems to contradict your experience above, but that's probably b/c in 2000-2002 you were buying 1st generation slabs, not books that had been sold multiple times, experiencing the ravages of the PO at every cross country trip. Personally, I receive very few books back from CGC with SCS, but have had a few.

 

I'm going to sound like Mr. Grumpy here, but I'm passionate about this topic...and I'm frustrated we are still here talking about this. Enough already! (pertaining to CGC, not the unknowing customers receiving inferior service/product)

 

Good summary, Mike. IMHO, once is one time too many. CGC needs to prevent this problem. I'm contemplating not purchasing slabs until they choose to believe it's a problem their customers think is important and take additional preventive measures. They've made incremental process...but the issues are still there (at least for non Moderns). I'm paying (and usually premiums) for the grade...the book survives for decades only to become a victim of the product that claims to protect it...outrageous. Do I need an Infinite SCS Thread to help illustrate to CGC that 1.) it's a problem that needs to be addressed and 2.) they will eventually alienate customers if it is not addressed?

 

This topic frankly is a broken record. Perhaps by devaluing slabs by the collecting community it will make an impact on submissions to the point that someone will listen and take action. My collection is mostly slabs, so saying this is painful for me. But it's an important topic for me...and one that hasn't been addressed adequately--at least to my satisfaction.

 

I'm with Sterling 100% on this.

 

I already avoid buying the old style slab just out of fear of SCS. I would personally buy a whole lot more slabbed books if they all came in the newer sealed well. But thats just me.

[DeeDee-migration]

Like CGC said to me, if someone can come up with a better design (and there are some smart and wealthy people on here) then bring it on.

What stops them from just reverse engineering a PGX holder? There've been alot of comments about it being a "better" and "more solid" slab design.

 

The PGX slab isn't perfect either, I've noticed that in some there seems to be a weird kind of warping of the book, or warping of the inner well... anyone else noticed this?

[Clark Khaos-migration]

I know that exact same feeling

 

 

Did you submit that book yourself, sir? I ask only because that may be how the book was printed. You could have a very rare "bowtie variant" on your hands. I wouldn't be so quick to assign blame when it's entirely possible that you're simply sitting on a GOLD MINE.

[nik]

 

No sir I did not. It was bought that way, but the patient is doing just fine residing in a Mylar fitted with a fullback.

 

As for the valuable "bowtie variant" I'm going to be skipping the love on that and let someone else claim the glory

[october]

Maybe it's just me, but having to go through that whole ritual just to protect a book from it's own holder seems anything but obvious.

 

Well...that's just silly... ..until CGC comes up with an unbreakable anti-inertia holder, slabbed books should be wrapped with absolute care to prevent damage whether it's a $15 book or a $1,500 book...

 

It's silly to think that a lot of bubble wrap and a sturdy box is enough to protect a slab? Ummm, I don't think I am the one being silly here.

[drbanner]

I've got a few points to chime in with.

 

A) how were the CGC books packaged? Every single time I've gotten an SCS book it is because of poor packaging. I've talked to CGC about the way they package their books, and I email sellers with specific packaging requests for books I have bought. Over the years I have learned (sometimes from my own mistakes) and come up with a formula for an almost perfect packaging system. I'll go into it below...

 

B) If in fact the books were not packaged well (lots of bubblewrap and a big box does not constitute good packaging in my mind) then it is unfair to blame CGC. I have spoken to several guys at CGC about their slabs. They have literally spent $1000's and $1000's of engineering dollers in finding the best possible solution. I am sure if someone has a better idea, they would galdly pay for it. Anyone have a suggestion isntead of a complaint?

 

3) Sellers could be resonsible for at least some of the damage and it may not be shipping related. I've dropped books. We probably all have.

 

Not saying it doesn't happen. Just saying that the design of the slab is not always to blame.

 

The best packaging method I have come up with:

 

i) Cardboard sandwich on either side of the CGC slab.

ii)Small amount of bubblewrap around slab sandwich to keep it together.

iii)Fair sized box to allow Slab to sit in box with plenty of packaging peanuts around the edges.

iv) The styrophoam packaging peanuts are the key to the safety of the book . They allow subtle movement of the book which is a good thing. The peanuts are able to shift, bend and absorb impact much more efficiently than any other material. Consider them to be almost like a sponge. If you have JUST bubblewrap, or bubblewrap and then that scrunched brown paper that CGC uses, I find that impact is more directly transferred to whatever is inside at the core (in this case the book) because these materials are too stiff.

I am curious to hear about the actual packaging methods used when SCS happens.

R.

 

This is all well and good from keeping the slab itself from getting damaged, but the problem lies within the well itself, specifically the wiggle room between the edge of the book and the edge of the well. You could package an egg inside a slab as described above and it would probably survive a cross-country journey intact, but put two eggs in there and they'll end up scrambled...

[Harvey Dude]

Like CGC said to me, if someone can come up with a better design (and there are some smart and wealthy people on here) then bring it on.

What stops them from just reverse engineering a PGX holder? There've been alot of comments about it being a "better" and "more solid" slab design.

 

The PGX slab isn't perfect either, I've noticed that in some there seems to be a weird kind of warping of the book, or warping of the inner well... anyone else noticed this?

 

I have over three-hundred slabbed books. I have about 12 broken CGC cases and four or so CGC books with SCS. I have about 40 PGX cases and not one broken case or one case of SCS. I have not seen any warping effect. From my optic, PGX cases are superior. They have other major issues but the casing is not one of them.

[DeeDee-migration]

Like CGC said to me, if someone can come up with a better design (and there are some smart and wealthy people on here) then bring it on.

What stops them from just reverse engineering a PGX holder? There've been alot of comments about it being a "better" and "more solid" slab design.

 

The PGX slab isn't perfect either, I've noticed that in some there seems to be a weird kind of warping of the book, or warping of the inner well... anyone else noticed this?

 

I have over three-hundred slabbed books. I have about 12 broken CGC cases and four or so CGC books with SCS. I have about 40 PGX cases and not one broken case or one case of SCS. From my optic, PGX cases are superior.

 

My question was if anyone had noticed the warping inside some PGX slabs... its like the well is wavy on the inside..

[VintageComics]

I've got a few points to chime in with.

 

A) how were the CGC books packaged? Every single time I've gotten an SCS book it is because of poor packaging. I've talked to CGC about the way they package their books, and I email sellers with specific packaging requests for books I have bought. Over the years I have learned (sometimes from my own mistakes) and come up with a formula for an almost perfect packaging system. I'll go into it below...

 

B) If in fact the books were not packaged well (lots of bubblewrap and a big box does not constitute good packaging in my mind) then it is unfair to blame CGC. I have spoken to several guys at CGC about their slabs. They have literally spent $1000's and $1000's of engineering dollers in finding the best possible solution. I am sure if someone has a better idea, they would galdly pay for it. Anyone have a suggestion isntead of a complaint?

 

3) Sellers could be resonsible for at least some of the damage and it may not be shipping related. I've dropped books. We probably all have.

 

Not saying it doesn't happen. Just saying that the design of the slab is not always to blame.

 

The best packaging method I have come up with:

 

i) Cardboard sandwich on either side of the CGC slab.

ii)Small amount of bubblewrap around slab sandwich to keep it together.

iii)Fair sized box to allow Slab to sit in box with plenty of packaging peanuts around the edges.

iv) The styrophoam packaging peanuts are the key to the safety of the book . They allow subtle movement of the book which is a good thing. The peanuts are able to shift, bend and absorb impact much more efficiently than any other material. Consider them to be almost like a sponge. If you have JUST bubblewrap, or bubblewrap and then that scrunched brown paper that CGC uses, I find that impact is more directly transferred to whatever is inside at the core (in this case the book) because these materials are too stiff.

I am curious to hear about the actual packaging methods used when SCS happens.

R.

 

This is all well and good from keeping the slab itself from getting damaged, but the problem lies within the well itself, specifically the wiggle room between the edge of the book and the edge of the well. You could package an egg inside a slab as described above and it would probably survive a cross-country journey intact, but put two eggs in there and they'll end up scrambled...

 

Banner, my reasoning is that the impact transfers to the core of the slab more directly when there is a solid substance between the box and the slab (and consequently the slab and the book inside). The peanuts are "fluid" and therefore disperse impact better so less of it reaches the book at the center. Not 100% of course, but the best method I have come up with.

[VintageComics]

Like CGC said to me, if someone can come up with a better design (and there are some smart and wealthy people on here) then bring it on.

What stops them from just reverse engineering a PGX holder? There've been alot of comments about it being a "better" and "more solid" slab design.

 

The PGX slab isn't perfect either, I've noticed that in some there seems to be a weird kind of warping of the book, or warping of the inner well... anyone else noticed this?

 

I have over three-hundred slabbed books. I have about 12 broken CGC cases and four or so CGC books with SCS. I have about 40 PGX cases and not one broken case or one case of SCS. From my optic, PGX cases are superior.

 

My question was if anyone had noticed the warping inside some PGX slabs... its like the well is wavy on the inside..

 

I've seen this on CGC books as well. My DD #7 CGC 9.0 had it.

[MutantKeys]

Like CGC said to me, if someone can come up with a better design (and there are some smart and wealthy people on here) then bring it on.

What stops them from just reverse engineering a PGX holder? There've been alot of comments about it being a "better" and "more solid" slab design.

 

The PGX slab isn't perfect either, I've noticed that in some there seems to be a weird kind of warping of the book, or warping of the inner well... anyone else noticed this?

 

I have over three-hundred slabbed books. I have about 12 broken CGC cases and four or so CGC books with SCS. I have about 40 PGX cases and not one broken case or one case of SCS. From my optic, PGX cases are superior.

 

My question was if anyone had noticed the warping inside some PGX slabs... its like the well is wavy on the inside..

Ive had a couple of cgc inner wells like that

[Harvey Dude]

 

My question was if anyone had noticed the warping inside some PGX slabs... its like the well is wavy on the inside..

I have not noticed PGX slab warping but I have on some of my CGC books. Anyone know what causes that? Moisture containment?

[DeeDee-migration]

Like CGC said to me, if someone can come up with a better design (and there are some smart and wealthy people on here) then bring it on.

What stops them from just reverse engineering a PGX holder? There've been alot of comments about it being a "better" and "more solid" slab design.

 

The PGX slab isn't perfect either, I've noticed that in some there seems to be a weird kind of warping of the book, or warping of the inner well... anyone else noticed this?

 

I have over three-hundred slabbed books. I have about 12 broken CGC cases and four or so CGC books with SCS. I have about 40 PGX cases and not one broken case or one case of SCS. From my optic, PGX cases are superior.

 

My question was if anyone had noticed the warping inside some PGX slabs... its like the well is wavy on the inside..

Ive had a couple of cgc inner wells like that

 

Interesting

 

Does anyone know why or how that happens? Just curious.

[Harvey Dude]

It may be pressed books reverting.

[DeeDee-migration]

It may be pressed books reverting.

 

[Clark Khaos-migration]

 

No sir I did not. It was bought that way, but the patient is doing just fine residing in a Mylar fitted with a fullback.

 

As for the valuable "bowtie variant" I'm going to be skipping the love on that and let someone else claim the glory

 

Well, keep it elevated and well-hydrated. It is a shame, however, that you are reluctant to embrace the "bowtie variant" (BV) classification. In fact, I would wager that your book was once part of a beautiful pedigree collection which was owned by an eccentric corn farmer/Robotech aficionado from Decorah, Iowa named Samuel "Sam" Skultety.

 

He was a significant figure in comic collecting circles until he took an ill-advised trip to the San Diego Con to meet a mysterious figure who is known only as "G. Looey". He was never seen again, and the beneficiaries of his estate (who did not much care for Sam) quickly divided his estate and liquidated his assets.

 

I'm just sayin'.

[MutantKeys]

It may be pressed books reverting.

[DeeDee-migration]

It may be pressed books reverting.

It was funny, dork

[drice6900]

After reading this thread, I now have a sneaking suspicion why CGC doesn't consider pressing to be restoration...

[grider67]

Dumb question of the day here...

 

What's SCS?