Showcase New England/Dan Greenhalgh answers questions

[RockMyAmadeus]

 

Additionally, while not publicized...often times most of the books described in such lots have a higher average grade than is describd by the numerical designation.

.

 

For as much as it's worth, I can vouch for this. The majority of the times that I have bought an "avg" lot, while there were a few 4.0s in an avg of 7.5/8.0, there were a couple of 9.4s and even 9.6s that brought the average to ABOVE 7.5/8.0 (when you did the math.)

 

ie, 10 books, 6 would be 8.0, 1 would be 4.0, 3 would be 9.4.

 

[(8.0x6)+4.0+(9.4x3)]/10=8.02

 

If that were the case, I was always happy, unless it was a run of Strange Adventures #171-180, and #180 was the 4.0.

[Mac Man]

Well, new to the hobby, I have to say I'm curious about checking SNE out now. Despite a few unhappy people, it sounds like some overwhelmingly happy customers- a great litmus test for finding dealers to buy from!

 

And since we are on the discussion of business practices, I had my own incident just Friday morning. I was calling up some of my local shops to see if they had a few particular issues- which if they did (within my price range), I was going to swing by and pick them up. I called one store which had some new management take over less than a year ago to see if they had some of these comics. The owner (I recognized the voice) was really short with me over having to check the availability, prices, and grades for these comics. I could even hearing literally yelling to himself "Why don't people just come in and look?!?".

 

Now, I can understand it would have been easier for him had I just drove the 25 miles (one way) on the chance that he might have what I was looking for at the price I could afford. But he also could have just asked me to come by because he was busy. I didn't see the need for the rudeness, or how he could think I wouldn't hear him. Needless to say, he's lost as a customer.

[RockMyAmadeus]

 

It is not so common today because we have CGC...but in the 90's collectors/dealers would often buy books that I disclosed as restored....and resell them at some point in time failing to disclose the restoration.

 

This has happened to me as well. I sold a Batman #169 that was badly trimmed on the right edge (like someone had drunkenly taken a pair of scissors to it) and it was obvious to anyone who looked at it for more than 10 seconds. In fact, I sold it to someone who has posted on this very thread.

 

I sold it for $15, or thereabouts, because it was otherwise a nice "VF-ish" copy.

 

Two weeks later, it was back up on eBay, with a long view pic that hid the curvy right edge, no mention of the "work", and offered at that same "VF" (I found it because I'm always buying Bat books.) It was the same exact book, sold to the same exact person, with the same exact flaws (when you've held a book in your hands, you know where to look for the flaws.)

 

It sold for $75.

 

I'll never forget that, even though it happened round about 2002.

 

I'll never forget who, either. Thankfully, since I'm not ShowcaseNE, or anyone of that stature, the eventual buyer didn't come back to me (if they had, I could have just shown them my original listing.)

 

I hope they noticed, though, and got their money back. I always feel bad that I, by selling that book to this "person", enabled what I consider to be fraud to be perpetrated.

 

Ah well.

[RockMyAmadeus]

RE: Jokers Revenge

 

In fairness to everyone......

 

CGC changed the grading standards.....I personally believe anyone who sold books in the mid to late 90's were dissappointed with many of the books they sent to CGC.

 

Obviously....this wouldn't happen today

 

CGC didn't CHANGE the grading standards....they took what had clearly been around, in detail, since the late 1980's (and in great detail with the 1992 OGG) and made their own (unpublished) standards which generally reflect Overstreet's.

 

The reason anyone who sold books in the mid to late 90's (and I was one of them) was disappointed (I was NOT one of them) was simply because they overgraded the books to begin with. NM with a 1/2" color breaking crease? NO PROBLEM! VF with a water droplets all over the cover? Easy cheesy! Fine with a coupon cut? Piece of cake! Good with 2 missing pages? You got it, boss!

 

The reality is this: for every instance of someone UNDERgrading, there are 1,000 instances of OVERgrading (yes, this is hyperbole to make a point, but how far off am I...?) Why? Because overgraded comics make money.

 

This is nothing new.

 

If I had $1 for every time I saw the words "CGC was WAY too harsh on this book" "This should have graded MUCH higher" "CGC says x, but I think it's really x+1.0" "CGC UNDERgraded this book!"....I'd be a millionaire.

 

And...let's face it....after spending, oh, at LEAST $150,000 on comics in the last 17 years (hey, that's not a bad average, is it?), I cannot lie when I say I experience a tinge of joy at seeing former overgraders brought low by CGC.

 

And a great deal of anger and sadness over those same people willing to do whatever they can get away with to manipulate the market in their $$$ favor, since they can no longer just plainly overgrade.

[Sal]

 

It is not so common today because we have CGC...but in the 90's collectors/dealers would often buy books that I disclosed as restored....and resell them at some point in time failing to disclose the restoration.

 

This has happened to me as well. I sold a Batman #169 that was badly trimmed on the right edge (like someone had drunkenly taken a pair of scissors to it) and it was obvious to anyone who looked at it for more than 10 seconds. In fact, I sold it to someone who has posted on this very thread.

 

I sold it for $15, or thereabouts, because it was otherwise a nice "VF-ish" copy.

 

Two weeks later, it was back up on eBay, with a long view pic that hid the curvy right edge, no mention of the "work", and offered at that same "VF" (I found it because I'm always buying Bat books.) It was the same exact book, sold to the same exact person, with the same exact flaws (when you've held a book in your hands, you know where to look for the flaws.)

 

It sold for $75.

 

I'll never forget that, even though it happened round about 2002.

 

I'll never forget who, either. Thankfully, since I'm not ShowcaseNE, or anyone of that stature, the eventual buyer didn't come back to me (if they had, I could have just shown them my original listing.)

 

I hope they noticed, though, and got their money back. I always feel bad that I, by selling that book to this "person", enabled what I consider to be fraud to be perpetrated.

 

Ah well.

 

nice story. it's too bad you don't feel obligated to out the person who you feel committed fraud. it would be nice for the rest of us, but it's your call

[RockMyAmadeus]

 

I have had two low grade, unrestored copies.....the better one I bought at Sotheby's as an unrestored VG/VG-.

 

It turned out that the book had a missing page.

 

What was ironic about that was that I was on the grading committee at the time and I graded the book......along with 6 other members and the curator, all of whom missed the defect.

 

This is absolutely frightening. From a guy (me) who counts every single page of every single silver age book and older that he gets worth more than $5, I just don't see how such a thing could be possible.

 

The first time I bought a Golden Age Batman (#26) I counted the pages three times to make sure they were all there (24 interior leaves + front and back cover = 52 "pages".)

 

And this was a Good+ Batman #26!

 

How could one NOT count every page of ANY Action #1 three times or more? Much less, the Sotheby's grading committee of SEVEN professionals in the field (and the curator)?

 

Wow.

 

I feel sorry for your loss, but man....if you can miss pages on an Action 1...what else could be missed?

[RockMyAmadeus]

 

I know this is not going to sound well...but here it is.....I/we don't have time to count pages on the majority of the books we sell.

 

We sell 60 to 80 thousand books a year.....counting pages, and assuming a minute per book with no breaks to count the pages....that works out to 1000 to 1250 man hours per year....or pretty much a full time job for just one person. I don't think for the amount of books that get sold with this kind of flaw that the investment is worthwhile. Not only that...I don't know that anyone would ever do that as a full time job.

.

 

Without trying to be rude or hostile, the reality is, if you don't have the time to be doing something properly, there are several options you have so that it CAN be done properly:

 

1. Don't sell.

 

2. Don't sell more volume than you can handle properly (this includes counting pages.)

 

3. Hire someone to do it for you. There are a lot of people (myself, for instance, in my younger days) who would have GLADLY counted pages all day long, 8 hours a day, 40 hours a week, for the right WAGE. Counting pages and handling valuable collectibles is NOT a minimum wage job: but certainly someone competent and professional would have been willing to do it for, say, $10-$15/hour back in the 1990's (or $15-$20/hour now.)

 

"We don't have enough time" is an excuse that a buyer should never, under any circumstances, hear for such a basic part of comic book grading as page counting.

 

CGC certainly has page counters.

 

It's certainly worth it to not have customers be dissatisfied and be forced to return books that should have been page counted in the first place (for which the customer's time and effort is never...and wrongly so....compensated.)

 

Having a liberal return policy helps tremendously, but most customers (including myself, who has had to return books to you on more than one occasion) would rather the books just be in the condition(s) stated in the first place.

 

If you think it's better to "play the averages" that the vast majority of your books will NOT be missing pages, and then deal with the ones that DO, well....you know as well as anyone about the rules of customer satisfaction: Happy customers tell 4 to 5 others of their positive experience. Dissatisfied customers tell 9 to 12 how bad it was. These are variables that can't really be quantified in sales results, so if your results are "where you want them to be", then it may not matter to you.

 

It's just not the very best way to do business.

[RockMyAmadeus]

RE: Action1kid

 

I'm inclined to agree with your comment that "leopards don't change their spots"

 

That being said....you have to know what the "spots" are to define the leopard.

 

One of the biggest changes that has evolved in my maturing as a dealer is that I no longer have to make representations about a books value. The Ebay busness model allows me to accomplish this. You may not think this is a big deal....but I think it is huge.

 

One of the biggest problems all collectors and dealers have in this hobby, or any other collectibles based hobby for that matter, is having sufficient competency to price a book based on demand, scarcity.....and a host of other factors.

 

After having dealt with many of the highest grade books, as well as many of the most valuable, and scarcest books, I can tell you with certainty that in many cases the prices paid for books...dealer to collector, collector to collector, dealer to dealer, are incorrect...some on the high side....some on the low side.

 

Bad deals happen every day, some worse than others, some just plain awful...and often times...some representation of value is involved (in most cases, with the best of intentions).

 

In the 1990's I had to price books. This was my job. While I may have thought that the prices I put on books were fair at the time I sold them, the passing of time demonstrated in many cases that I got some of them wrong (not many as a percentage of all of the books I sold, but enough)....both in my favor, and not in my favor.

 

For example....Around 1995 or so, I sold a restored copy of Detective 1 for 50K. We all know

today that this was an awful deal for the buyer. But at the time...there were no copies for sale anywhere in the country...and one hadn't been for sale for quite some time. So The assumption I made was that it was just a very difficult book. After the price of the book got out......several copies of the book showed up in the year or two after....and the price got driven down to 10K.

 

That buyer, who was really desperate to get this book, was unhappy.....despite my best intentions.

 

Another Example, restoration was more widely accepted in the mid 1990's than it is today. A nicely restored copy of AF 15 by Susan Cicconi could sell for $3000 to $5000. And at that time everyone made the representation that the book was worth that kind of money. It turns out we were all wrong....that book today is really worth no more than two to three thousand dollars. Despite every one's best intentions, we were all wrong.

 

In the other direction, I sold the FF #1, 9.6, for 27K....today, it would be hard to put a price on the book....but I wouldn't put $250,000 out of the question.

 

The point is this....as market conditions change, and as more information about any one book becomes available, prices change. Many collectors, particularly in instances where they have bought books having potentially life changing values, however, don't want to hear that, or anything else for that matter.....because their the one holding the book.....The only thing they tend to remember is where they got the book.

 

These phone calls, and conversations are hard. I don't get them anymore...but I got several of them in the late 1990's. And I hated them (the phone calls).

 

All dealers get these phone calls. In all cases I sympathized with the collector because, in the end, who wants to pay $5k for a Fantasy 15 that is worth 3k, 5 years later?? Or whatever the book it is.

 

How has this changed me?? (we are back on the subject of a leopard being defined by his spots again).

 

I no longer sell books that can be easily mispriced to collectors.... For example...a CGC 9.9 copy of Hulk 181 or a CGC Giant Size X-men 1 in 9.8 (the list goes on and on). Rather, I consign them to other parties.

 

Why? Simply so my name isn't attached to the final selling price of these types of books and so I won't have to deal with the phone calls down the road.

 

We put the vast majority of our books in our Ebay auctions....the higher value books....however.....go to a 3rd party.

 

Again...without trying to be rude, I can see why you have had some problems in the past.

 

The reasoning in this entire post is fundamentally flawed. Here's why:

 

When someone, anyone, sets a price for an item, any item, it's not the "wrong" price if a buyer will pay that. Provided (and this is the absolute key) that EVERYTHING is above board and up front, restoration is disclosed, the grading is accurate (or even just acceptable to the prospective buyer) and the seller is not hiding information that would affect the willingness of the buyer to pay, then NO price is out of line, or "wrong" on anything, if a buyer will pay for it.

 

The MARKET may not support the prices asked....but if there's a buyer willing to pay that price for that item at that time....and again, provided everything is disclosed....there is no such thing as the "wrong" price for anything, and that sale has now become part OF the market and must be recognized....for good or bad....by the market.

 

The only time anyone would be actually, ethically wrong is if they told the prospective buyer that "this item is GUARANTEED to go up in value, and will never go down!"

 

I see this CONSTANTLY in this field, and others, and it's ethically questionable enough that the FTC has made it ILLEGAL in the stock markets. No broker, at any time, may tell a prospective buyer that any product they sell is guaranteed to go up in value (obviously excluding actually guaranteed products like CDs and whatnot), or they can very easily be stripped of their license and sued for very big $$ in court by these buyers.

 

That is why the statement "past performance does not guarantee future results" is so prevalent now in any stock market/mutual fund/IRA.

 

It is a fact of life that many things can go down in value as often as they go up. I do not understand, and have NEVER understood, why this particular hobby/industry has such an incredibly difficult time with this concept. Ego? Pride? I don't know. But the facts are this: that Detective #1 which you sold was a fair price at that time, because of the complete lack of available copies on the marketplace.

 

It doesn't matter if that price drove out several, or even dozens, more copies, because those copies weren't available at the time of the sale, and neither of you could reasonably have guessed that the FUTURE would bring other copies to light.

 

I paid $100 for a raw and $75 for a CGC 9.6 Magneto #0 Gold. I believed this book was genuinely scarce as far as modern variants go. In 7 years, I had only seen ONE copy, and that was the one which New Dimension kept listing (over the course of at least two years) for $200, and it finally sold in 2004/5 for that amount.

 

Then, two seperate dealers, one in Canada and one in the states, have since 2006 offered multiple copies of this book on eBay. I was one of the first buyers to buy one from the Canadian dealer for $100 (or very nearly that) for the raw copy. However, they kept producing more and more copies, and eventually, the price was driven down to between $20-$50.

 

Oops.

 

Not bad, but certainly a substantial amount less than the $100 I paid for mine, and the $75 I paid for a 9.6. I recently bought a 9.8 for $85 shipped, but that was the reserve price I met, not the open market price.

 

I have since bought 12 more copies for roughly $5 each (I got lucky.) So, I got to mitigate my "loss" to a great extent. But that doesn't mean that I "overpaid" because of my perception of reality (a perception that turned out to be relatively false.) I perceived, incorrectly, that these books were far more rare than they actually turned out to be...but, it wasn't through ignorance...I had no way of knowing that TWO and ONLY two dealers, in TWO different countries, each had a stash of these books that they had hidden away for years, if not well over a decade since they were printed.

 

Likewise, you AND the buyer, in 1995, perceived, incorrectly, that Detective #1 was far scarcer than it actually was....but does that mean you charged the wrong price? Of course not. You were working with what you knew at the time. You both had no way of knowing what the sale would drive out of the woodwork, and even moreso, had no reason to even EXPECT such a thing to happen for such a scarce book!

 

Same with the AF #15...back in 1996, a nicely Cicconi restored AF #15 was worth $5K. That's not the case now. But that doesn't mean the price was "wrong" back in 1996. How was anyone supposed to know what the market would do? (And I'll go on the record as saying that in the future, I doubt this will be the case with restored books.)

 

This happens every day, all day long. Collectors buy the "latest hot thing" for whatever price they're willing to pay, and almost every single time, that latest hot thing goes down in price. Cap #25 is just the latest example. How many foolish people bought this book the day it came out for $50, $75, $100? Lots. But those foolish people have the RIGHT to pay foolish prices for those books. How much is that effect magnified in the realm of actually scarce itens?

 

I try to tell as many people as *I* can not to fall for pricing madness, to become fully informed, but at the end of the day, I know that everyone has the right to pay silly prices (or what may turn out to be "silly" prices) for something they want....even $50K for a Detective #1. It's not your fault, in any way, that the buyer was unhappy with the results....but that's the way the market works, and more importantly, how it functions the best. If that buyer felt bad, how about the hundreds of millions of dollars that evaporated into thin air when Enron went down....?

 

Not every stock is Franklin Templeton. Not every book is Action #1. Prices go up, but perhaps most importantly, prices go DOWN, too.

[ComicSupply]

I agree with your Rock. SNE's actions have no direct influence on the market and he has no control over the market so why should he be concerned with the effects of the market. Stuff goes up, stuff goes down. It is what it is.

[RockMyAmadeus]

One more thing about the issue of "look at the 30,000 positives and include them in the context of the negatives."

 

As everyone reading this knows, a great seller is not determined by how many succesful transactions they have, but how they handle themselves when there's a problem.

 

Even if their success rate is 99.99999998%...how they handled that ONE customer who had a problem speaks louder than the other 99.99999998% who had no problems combined.

 

It's EASY to be a "good seller" when no one has a problem.

 

It's a lot harder....and speaks a lot more about an individual's character...to be a good seller when someone's got a problem that needs to be resolved.

 

Leaving spiteful feedback for any customer, at any time, utterly regardless of the justification for it, regardless of the "but see how many POSITIVE feedbacks I have!", will always make the seller look like a jerk, an arsehole, a whatever negative you want to call it.

 

If you lose your temper...even once....and appear petulant and vicious, it will haunt you as long as people remember what you said, even if you were 1000% justified in saying it...and all the good things said and done will vanish into thin air.

 

That's a lesson Alec Baldwin is just now starting to realize....

[RockMyAmadeus]

 

It is not so common today because we have CGC...but in the 90's collectors/dealers would often buy books that I disclosed as restored....and resell them at some point in time failing to disclose the restoration.

 

This has happened to me as well. I sold a Batman #169 that was badly trimmed on the right edge (like someone had drunkenly taken a pair of scissors to it) and it was obvious to anyone who looked at it for more than 10 seconds. In fact, I sold it to someone who has posted on this very thread.

 

I sold it for $15, or thereabouts, because it was otherwise a nice "VF-ish" copy.

 

Two weeks later, it was back up on eBay, with a long view pic that hid the curvy right edge, no mention of the "work", and offered at that same "VF" (I found it because I'm always buying Bat books.) It was the same exact book, sold to the same exact person, with the same exact flaws (when you've held a book in your hands, you know where to look for the flaws.)

 

It sold for $75.

 

I'll never forget that, even though it happened round about 2002.

 

I'll never forget who, either. Thankfully, since I'm not ShowcaseNE, or anyone of that stature, the eventual buyer didn't come back to me (if they had, I could have just shown them my original listing.)

 

I hope they noticed, though, and got their money back. I always feel bad that I, by selling that book to this "person", enabled what I consider to be fraud to be perpetrated.

 

Ah well.

 

nice story. it's too bad you don't feel obligated to out the person who you feel committed fraud. it would be nice for the rest of us, but it's your call

 

It's actually a pretty crummy story. I hope you'll understand and forgive me for not wanting to out the guy. I'm a little too new to be starting wars and whatnot.

 

As for me feeling they committed fraud....they sold a badly trimmed book as VF without mentioning the bad trimming, that they knew had been trimmed because they bought the book from ME with that disclosed not two weeks earlier....what would you call that?

 

Suffice it to say, I still have the scan on my old comp that I'd be more than willing to resurrect (provided my old comp isn't completely dead.) I'm sure he knows he did it, too (unless he plain just didn't care and has forgotten.)

 

Since I don't have THEIR auction (this was, after all, 4-5 years ago), I have no proof this happened....but I know it did, and he hopefully knows it did, and hopefully it never happened again.

[mica]

As for me feeling they committed fraud....they sold a badly trimmed book as VF without mentioning the bad trimming, that they knew had been trimmed because they bought the book from ME with that disclosed not two weeks earlier....what would you call that?

 

Suffice it to say, I still have the scan on my old comp that I'd be more than willing to resurrect (provided my old comp isn't completely dead.) I'm sure he knows he did it, too (unless he plain just didn't care and has forgotten.)

 

Since I don't have THEIR auction (this was, after all, 4-5 years ago), I have no proof this happened....but I know it did, and he hopefully knows it did, and hopefully it never happened again.

You should PM me their name.

You know....in case something mysteriously happens to you in the next few days.

 

This thread keeps getting better and better.

[ShowcaseNE]

RE: JKC313

 

Thanks Keith,

 

......for the vote of support and a spirited defense of your business dealings with us.

[ShowcaseNE]

RE:

 

RockMYAmadeus

 

Thank you for your generally positive comments, and for sharing some of your experiences with others that have been similar to mine.

 

While I agree with many of the things that you have said.....there are a couple of areas in which I have a dissimilar opinion....which you openly acknowledged.

 

I will address the CGC VS. Overstreet difference in this post, and the "reliance on a dealer's representation as fair value" in the following post.

 

I thought these areas are notable, and are perhaps worthy of further discussion. Maybe there are others out there whom would be kind enough to share their positions.

 

First: My Opinion as previously posted:

 

Quote:

 

CGC grading standards have two material departures from Overstreet grading standards.

 

First: the cornerstone of the Overstreet grading system was "overall state of preservation" which took into account all of a books characteristics including structure, paper quality, color, gloss, etc.

 

The cornerstone of the CGC grading system is "structure"...first and foremost.

A book can't be graded higher under the CGC system, than the grade given to the overall structure of a book.

 

Second, under the Overstreet system of grading....you can not have a nm book without having NM paper quality.

 

Under the CGC grading system....you can have a book in 9.4 without NM paper.

 

This a material departure.....but I think, I think a change for the positive.

 

In CGC's defense...they probably viewed this as an improvement to the Overstreet grading system....in effect...they give a book two grades...one for paper....and one for everything else.

 

ShowcaseNE

 

Your response:

 

Quote:

 

CGC didn't CHANGE the grading standards....they took what had clearly been around, in detail, since the late 1980's (and in great detail with the 1992 OGG) and made their own (unpublished) standards which generally reflect Overstreet's.(end quote)

 

RockMYAmadeus

 

Your position and my position are opposite of each other. While I think I can build a strong and defensible argument for my position....the fact is that my view is widely held by many seasoned collectors and dealers. However, I do know of others that hold your position as well.

 

I want to point out your use of the words "their own (unpublished) standards which generally reflects Overstreet's". I am not sure what you are referring to here.....but I think many of the members in this chatroom might take issue with what you consider to generally reflect Overstreet, and further, what would be considered a material departure.

 

In my short piece....I only touched on two of the major areas where I thought CGC departed from Overstreet.

 

I think I could list at least 10 (minor departures however)....but here is one more which some of you might find interesting.

 

In the preCGC days....Overstreet defined NM as "newsstand NM"....which implies that some minor defects are permitted in grade. CGC has changed the definition of "newsstand NM" to "just off the press NM". They have, in effect, raised the standard of NM to a point in the distribution of the comic book that predates "newsstand NM". I think this change in standard helps me understand why structure is what drives CGC's grades, and drives it at the expense of other characteristics which were more important under Overstreet guidelines....like whiteness of paper and overall state of preservation for example.

 

And, again, this is just my opinion.

[ShowcaseNE]

RE: RockMYAmadeus

 

My second difference of opinion has to do with " a dealers representation of value" and "the subsequent reliance of buyer on the dealers representation".

 

Quote:

 

One of the biggest changes that has evolved in my maturing as a dealer is that I no longer have to make representations about a books value. The Ebay business model allows me to accomplish this. You may not think this is a big deal....but I think it is huge.

 

One of the biggest problems all collectors and dealers have in this hobby, or any other collectibles based hobby for that matter, is having sufficient competency to price a book based on demand, scarcity.....and a host of other factors.

 

After having dealt with many of the highest grade books, as well as many of the most valuable, and scarcest books, I can tell you with certainty that in many cases the prices paid for books...dealer to collector, collector to collector, dealer to dealer, are incorrect...some on the high side....some on the low side.

 

Bad deals happen every day, some worse than others, some just plain awful...and often times...some representation of value is involved (in most cases, with the best of intentions).

 

In the 1990's I had to price books. This was my job. While I may have thought that the prices I put on books were fair at the time I sold them, the passing of time demonstrated in many cases that I got some of them wrong (not many as a percentage of all of the books I sold, but enough)....both in my favor, and not in my favor.

 

For example....Around 1995 or so, I sold a restored copy of Detective 1 for 50K. We all know

today that this was an awful deal for the buyer. But at the time...there were no copies for sale anywhere in the country...and one hadn't been for sale for quite some time. So The assumption I made was that it was just a very difficult book. After the price of the book got out......several copies of the book showed up in the year or two after....and the price got driven down to 10K.

 

That buyer, who was really desperate to get this book, was unhappy.....despite my best intentions.

 

Another Example, restoration was more widely accepted in the mid 1990's than it is today. A nicely restored copy of AF 15 by Susan Cicconi could sell for $3000 to $5000. And at that time everyone made the representation that the book was worth that kind of money. It turns out we were all wrong....that book today is really worth no more than two to three thousand dollars. Despite every one's best intentions, we were all wrong.

 

In the other direction, I sold the FF #1, 9.6, for 27K....today, it would be hard to put a price on the book....but I wouldn't put $250,000 out of the question.

 

The point is this....as market conditions change, and as more information about any one book becomes available, prices change. Many collectors, particularly in instances where they have bought books having potentially life changing values, however, don't want to hear that, or anything else for that matter.....because their the one holding the book.....The only thing they tend to remember is where they got the book. (end quote)

ShowcaseNE

 

Your position:

 

Quote:

 

The reasoning in this entire post is fundamentally flawed. Here's why:

 

When someone, anyone, sets a price for an item, any item, it's not the "wrong" price if a buyer will pay that. Provided (and this is the absolute key) that EVERYTHING is above board and up front, restoration is disclosed, the grading is accurate (or even just acceptable to the prospective buyer) and the seller is not hiding information that would affect the willingness of the buyer to pay, then NO price is out of line, or "wrong" on anything, if a buyer will pay for it.

 

The MARKET may not support the prices asked....but if there's a buyer willing to pay that price for that item at that time....and again, provided everything is disclosed....there is no such thing as the "wrong" price for anything, and that sale has now become part OF the market and must be recognized....for good or bad....by the market. (end quote)

 

RockMYAmadeus

 

While I respect your position, I do not agree with it.

 

I am not sure I was entirely clear in my post, however.

 

My point is this....sometimes buyers rely heavily on a sellers reputation and representations about what a book is worth. In situations where this "trust" exists....it is easy for sellers to take advantage of this trust....whether intentional or unintentional.

 

In the case of the Detective 1, the buyer relied on my competence, expertise and experience that the book was properly priced. In this particular case, I was wrong about the books value. Had either the buyer, or I, been aware of the "real" market value of that book, at the time....the sale would never have occurred.

 

The sale occurred because the buyer trusted my representations.

 

Adding to my point....when books are high and value, and "thinly" traded....experience has taught me that it is easy to be wrong about what a fair price is. Rather than be wrong about these type of books, at this stage of my career anyway, I would rather distance myself from potentially compromising positions.

 

While the term "fiduciary" has a specific legal meaning, and legally, has an interpretation outside the scope of defining the relationship between buyer and seller in the sale of comicbooks.....I like to think I do behave as if this relationship does, in effect, actually exist between our customers and Showcase New England.

 

Consequently....I will no longer make representations about value on thinly traded, and high value books.

[ShowcaseNE]

RE: RockMYAmadeus

 

Thank you for all your positive comments...and for sharing some of the experiences that you have had that are similar to mine...and for pointing out that not everyone agrees about everything.

 

Awesome posts though....

[HouseofComics.Com]

I agree, good posts.

[ajaxfarrell]

I think I'm the only person in this thread to have posted a picture. That was the Adventure 52 I bought from SNE. Thanks AGAIN !!!!!

[Transplant]

Stumbled on this and read a few pages. Thought it was worth a bump given people always question how Showcase gets those great prices.

[DrWatson]

Hey, thanks for the bump. Now I remember who it was that I put on ignore. (thumbs u