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No More Grades, Just BIG NUMBERS!

Started by joe_collector,

635 posts in this topic

joe_collector

joe_collector

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I can't go along with this notion that it was done for the reasons you stated. I also feel CGC's brief explanation does not seem to be reason enough either.

 

One thing is for sure, a company does not institute a serious change like this in the hopes of making LESS money. So how about the possibility of a 100-point grading system in the future, or else a extension of the 100-point system into the 8.0 and 9.0 areas?

 

Benefits:

 

1) Huge increase in resubs and arbitrage business, affecting the large segment of pre-existing comics.

 

2) Heads off 100-point competitors like 3PG.

 

3) Higher submission rates on the VF range comics that may not quite qualify for 8.5 or 9.0 CGC grades.

 

4) Overally anal - though not cash-rich - buyers upgrading current issues to more affordable mid-range numerical grades (ie. CGC 89, CGC 93, etc.).

 

5) The game starts again for many speculators.

 

 

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joe_collector

joe_collector

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What do you care, all you ever buy are bulk comics. insufficiently_thoughtful_person.

 

Sorry tubby, but I do buy CGC books here and there, including my "fun hobby" of all Byrne 70's Marvel books in CGC 9.4 or higher.

 

But then again, I couldn't expect you to take your greasy, pudgy face out of the KFC bucket long enough to realize this.

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clobberintime

clobberintime

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Wow nice to see that some of us can expalin in 7 or 8 paragraphs what could be said in one. But anyone who professes to know a lot about comics and the CGC market should know waht this is all about. And that is money. And then where is the money? It is certainly not with traditional collectors. No it is with the older card and Coin collectors. You know the guys most of us depise. It has been the intent od CGC and the major dealers all along to bring the big money into comics. First you do that by making fine,indiscernable distinctions of grade at the top of the scale so you get that guy with the 9.6 or 9.8 that has to have the 9.9. Then you can eliminate as much negative info about the book on the label as possible since you can't touch the book anyway. Then you do away with the ancient and outdated comic book vague grading terms and replace it with a numerical scale - just like they are familiar with in coinee land. This move may draw in more newbies by eliminating the negatives but I think the real money is in resubs - and with the JP crowd. Somene on here suggested picking up the phone and talking to CGC about all this. I have a better suggestion - pick up the phone and call Hritage and JP to get some real answers and input.

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lighthouse

lighthouse

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c'mon guys... it's a cool discussion

893naughty-thumb.gif893frustrated.gif

 

"love thy fellow forumite"

893applaud-thumb.gif

 

I'm right with you there, Bruce...

 

except Khaos seems to love my leg a little too much... 893naughty-thumb.gif ... Down Boy!! mad.gif

 

 

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BronzeBruce13

BronzeBruce13

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Rob...sorry I can't get my thoughts out as quickly as most. I know its cumbersome to read my entire posts sometimes. Its just my personaliity to try and get it out right the first time. I figure the follow ups to clarify or answer portions not detailed enough would amount to about the same thing in the long run. I'd think you'd cut me some slack though seeing how your writing style was attacked too and that I'm just trying to communicate the best way i can... where's the love? grin.gif

 

So, the coin market had nomenclature and then lost it as professional grading progressed.. you see an identical parallel?

 

If there is no move to more in-between grades... how will the loss of nomenclature spark more resubmissions?... do you mean "reslabbing" to get the new label?

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awe4one

awe4one

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What I took from all that I heard and read was the CGC indeed "bases" their system on Overstreet's, BUT certainly added some of their own criteria and grading views to form their own process. I'm not sure it has to be "black or white".

 

But that exactly the problem Bruce. They aren't using Overstreet but implying that they are. "We follow Overstreet unless....." doesn't wash. They are still using their own criteria which doesn't support their announcement.

 

Now that they are highlighting the numerical grade and doing away with grading notes makes it even more important that they follow Overstreet standards if that's what they're going to advertise.

 

Maybe not totally black and white. But they can't have it both ways either......

 

 

Jim

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awe4one

awe4one

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If there is no move to more in-between grades... how will the loss of nomenclature spark more resubmissions?... do you mean "reslabbing" to get the new label?

 

Well it was a good point brought up by someone here that collectors would be more apt to buy the "freshness" of the new label. 893scratchchin-thumb.gif

 

 

Jim

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comicwiz

comicwiz

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Prior to CGC, how did the "formalized" explanation for grading terms like "NM", "VF", or FN benefit the comic marketplace? Moreover, how has it benefited the current raw comic market?

 

A day doesn't go by on these forums without hearing about a forum members experiences with the gauging that occurs when a dealer/collector overgrades a comic by saying it is "Mint" or "NM" when everyone knows fully well its nothing more than a VF. How does formalizing "cute" grading acronyms into the grading scale help the hobby when a greater proportion of dealers and collectors are not even remotely familiar with any other interpretation other than Near Mint? Its not so much a problem that dealers have a loose interpretation of formalized terms like NM, but that the old toolkit for comic trading, specifically when looking at the volumes of formalized explanations for each grading point, seems badly out of place in the new world of consumerism.

 

The acceptance of universality is predicated on ease-of-interpretation. Have you ever had to explain or elaborate on "FN" or "VF" or "NM" to someone who has never collected comics? It works well with someone who is soliciting for such information, and is willing to read through a paragraph of writing, or a 2 minute conversation, but doesn't bode well with the new age consumer who posesses the attention-span of hummingbird. In my own experience, It has always been easier to explain to a "newbie" or the average joe about the 10 point grading scale, and how an 8.0 grade fairs on a 25 point grading scheme than to pull out the encyclopedia on comic grading terms.

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joe_collector

joe_collector

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when a dealer/collector overgrades a comic by saying it is "Mint" or "NM" when everyone knows fully well its nothing more than a VF.

 

So you're saying that if CGC's HUGE NUMBER philosophy is adopted industry-wide, that the overgraders will suddenly change their VF comic listings from reading "M/NM" to "8.0"?

 

Talk about a leap of logic....

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comicwiz

comicwiz

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So you're saying that if CGC's HUGE NUMBER philosophy is adopted industry-wide, that the overgraders will suddenly change their VF comic listings from reading "M/NM" to "8.0"?

 

Talk about a leap of logic....

 

No leap. Just logic. You can hold a seller to some form of accountability if their listing includes "9.4" in it. How many listings have you seen where a seller says "I'm not a grading expert, but the book looks NM/Near Mint?" Its rarer to see this happen when people use a numerical equivalent for a grade.

 

Morover, do you take a listing/seller seriously if the seller adopts a NM/Mint approach to grading, especially if they say they are no expert? Here is the logic part: a universal approach that is widely accepted, and is easier to interpret may serve as a way to compel ALL sellers to learn something about grading. At stake is the fact that if they don't, buyers will continue to pass on their offerings. Nothing hits you smack dab in the face harder than when a form of collector protest has adverse effects on your bottom line. It is also worth noting that if anyone has ever had an opportunity to achieve this grading benchmark, it is CGC, as their market penetration and widespread acceptance is enough leverage to accomplish universality in comic book grading.

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drbanner

drbanner

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On a related note, one other benefit of a numeric grade only is that it would reduce the old bait-and-switch tactic used by many sellers advertising "CGC NM" in the title, only to be trying to sell a 9.0 or 9.2. I hate that! mad.gif

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