Gatsby77

? Here's Bosco's latest chart of the DCEU films to date. And even though it's a week out of date, it clearly shows that - even then - The Batman outperformed the average revenue ratio of all of those movies. Revenue-to-cost ratio matters here, because it accounts for inflation. It was different a theatrical world in 1978 when Superman: The Movie hit as it was in 2008 when The Dark Knight hit.

Lots of words, my man. Deadline's numbers are more reliable than those of ComicBook.com. And note, that Deadline's reporting references "Warner Bros.'s reporting" - not Samba's.

I'm confused. *Now* we're suddenly trusting ComicBook.com as a reliable source? Deadline's reporting different numbers: https://deadline.com/2022/04/the-batman-hbo-max-viewership-1235009362/ Notes The Batman clocked 4.1 million household views in the first 7 days - yes. But that Wonder Woman 1984 was viewed by 3.2 million households in its first week vs. Zack Snyder's Justice League pulling just 2.2 million households. Again, I went to public school, but I'm pretty sure 3.2 million > 2.2 million.

Me too - especially when I realized his book is more than 16 years old.

The Deadline article author has mastered the fine art of understatement: "Though El Muerto isn't as popular as Venom or Kraven the Hunter..."

Except it didn't. Go back and look at Bosco's chart - that's blatantly false. And while technically it may have "underperformed the average of every Batman movie" - it still well out-performed the likes of Batman Returns, Forever, Batman & Robin and Batman Begins. As for the *extra $200 million* it *should* have made, just look to China. While it's still on track to book $30 million there, that's a far cry from the $150-$200 million norm. But that's because 40% of China's theaters were closed due to Covid the day The Batman opened there, and it's only gotten worse in the weeks since. Shanghai went into complete lockdown two weeks ago and Beijing followed suit last weekend. China's basically a non-factor for this film - not because it wasn't released there or wasn't popular there, but because of widespread Covid lockdowns.

I will die on hill that Doomsday's first (cameo) appearance is Man of Steel # 17, while his first full (and cover) appearance wasn't until weeks later in Man of Steel 18 (with continued cameo appearances in the other Superman books in between). But I refuse to offer the same courtesy to say...Web of Spider-Man 18 / 24 re. Venom. Because nobody at the time knew...and many folks who were reading ASM weren't also reading Web. I can't shake the feeling it was (at least in part) revisionist history by Michelini -- not so with the Doomsday intro. However, I also *hate* the decades later revisionist history that OAAW 83 is now the "first Sgt. Rock."

I personally think Wolverine's first appearance is indeed Hulk 180. He may only appear in the last panel but he talks during two of them - as in, more than one sentence. I draw the line at advertisements, however. So Action Comics # 1 over More Fun # 31, and New Mutants # 87 for Cable over New Mutants # 86. Likewise, I think Spawn 1 is Spawn's first appearance and TMNT # 1 is the TMNT's first appearance (because mere advertisements don't count).

Iko Uwais was the best part about the Mark Wahlberg film Mile 22. The whole thing would have been a totally forgettable but for his performance, and the last 10 minutes.

? Non-sequitur and irrelevant deflection. For someone who claims to be a fan (or at least, to have read both Original Sins and Dangerous Habits) I'm honestly baffled that you came away thinking the Constantine film was anything close to good.

Right. And Batman and Robin had: A Bruce Wayne who was incredibly intelligent & could solve absurd problems with his wealth A rebellious teenage Robin A novice Batgirl unsure of her place who slowly finds her footing as superhero Super villains who threaten all of Gotham with their plan to (here freeze, rather than flood) the city. In broad strokes, faithful. But the execution was still absolute horse-shiiiiiit

It was like fifth on the list of major f--ck-ups in that film- but it matters. Even beyond the blonde and British thing, Keanu was miscast because he didn't play the character with the appropriate mix of world-weary arrogance and aloofness that is absolutely fundamental to Constantine's character. That's primarily a -script problem - but his acting didn't help matters. Note: I had zero issue with Tilda Swinton's Gabriel, and actually thought the gender-blind casting there was inspired. Because she still conveyed Gabriel in ways that were true to the character we saw in Ennis's run.

Correct. Because 2x in only 10 days equates to well over 3.5x theatrical over a short 9 week run. Velocity. Or...are you overlooking that - even though many on this very comic book message board waited to see it at home on HBO Max rather than pay to see it in the theater, that The Batman's not only clocked the top domestic gross of the year so far, but it's also out-grossed every other DCEU film listed on Bosco's chart domestically but for Wonder Woman. That means it out-did most of them domestically *even accounting for inflation.*

It's velocity, jack-. 2.0x after 10 days is world's removed from 2.0x after 24 days - particularly when the former film cost nearly 3x as much. Oh - and it's $150 million, not $150,000. #MathIsHard

And you continue to not just accept but defend mediocrity in comic book films that deserve better - and seem to get mad defensive whenever anybody notes the emperor has no clothes, or even says they deigned to dislike a film.

Umm… No it was largely based on Dangerous Habits. But it was about as garbage an adaptation of that brilliant storyline as X-Men: The Last Stand was to the Dark Phoenix saga. I’m not talking about “Constantine’s neither British nor blonde” - I’m taking about - it was an affront to Garth Ennis’s masterpiece of a story.

This. Constantine is decent as a stand-alone movie if you've never read the book. Even Shia LaBeouf does a decent job. But as a Hellblazer adaptation, it's hot garbage.

I'd nominate Predestination (with Ethan Hawke). Absolutely brilliantly written, but after the opening scene, the next 45 minutes is 100% exposition - just two people talking in a bar. Could lose a *lot* of people before the plot kicks into high gear. But if you stick with it, it's phenomenal.

It's relevant because our esteemed friend @Jaydogrules was noting how close Morbius was to 2x its production budget back on April 10, in his attempt to call Morbius's poor results comparable to those of The Batman. Both @paperheart and I, using math, have each since noted that Morbius was, in fact, *nowhere near* 2x its production budget on April 10 -- a point underscored by the film's still not being there as of Apr. 21 (and may not even get there this weekend).

Here's an example - a profile of RDJ in the LA Times a week before Iron Man's release. Not the article I was talking about above, but an example of the typical pre-release coverage of RDJ, which leaned *heavily* into his personal redemption arc / Cinderella story. Sure - maybe 15 year-olds weren't reading this (or active on social media, or watching The Simpsons) at the time, but basically anyone who knew who the actor was *at all* knew his criminal history. *Particularly* because it was a key storyline of his press tour for the film (pre- and post-release). https://www.latimes.com/entertainment/la-ca-downey27apr27-story.html

Sure. However, I have a very specific memory of an online interview (I forget which outlet) with RDJ as he was still getting in shape for the role in which he discussed not only his training but the studio's initial reticence to anchor a major studio film to him, given his past drug addiction and history of relapses. Specifically, Downey Jr. himself mentioned they resolved this by splitting his ($500,000) salary for the film in two - structuring the deal so he received only half up front and the remaining half only when he completed filming (basically - a contingency because he was still deemed uninsurable at the time). That was - at the time - a unique payment structure, and was part of his media talking points far in advance of the release of the Iron Man film.

Doesn't change that the internet, Twitter and Facebook were all around in 2007-2009. And that RDJ brought up his troubled past and Cinderella story in nearly every interview. Just because a 15 year-old in 2008 may not have seen RDJ's earlier work or remembered the news reports (or even seen that Simpsons clip I'd posted earlier) doesn't mean they weren't aware of his past legal troubles in 2008. They weren't just common knowledge - they were also actively milked as part of the marketing campaign for the first Iron Man film. I will concede a slightly different (but related) point, though. Had the "Me too" movement - which seemed to accelerate online "cancel culture" - happened 10 years earlier, there's ZERO chance RDJ gets nominated for an Oscar for playing in blackface. That he got less blowback for that than Sir Lawrence Olivier did 30+ years earlier is mind-blowing.

What Buzzetta said. First, the internet existed in 1997, and 2000, and 2008. As did the tabloids, Entertainment Weekly and shows like Entertainment Tonight. In other words, RDJ's troubles were extraordinarily well-known. Hell, they literally *let him out of jail* to film U.S. Marshals. And he was memorialized in one of my all-time favorite Simpsons clips: But he'd also: 1) Been a household name for 25 years at that point. 2) Had secured an Oscar nomination (for Chaplin) 3) Done his time (repeatedly); and (most importantly): 4) Worked his way back up in Hollywood - starting with Ally McBeal. Yes - he was ultimately fired from Ally McBeal for back-sliding and another drug arrest, but that was a pivotal turning point - and he was one of the first movie stars to join a major TV series, before that became fashionable/acceptable, and long before streaming gave us the era of prestige TV. Then he continued to work - and in the three years prior to Iron Man turned in stellar performances in films like Kiss Kiss, Bang Bang; Good Night and Good Luck; A Scanner Darkly and Zodiac. Having folks like George Clooney, Richard Linklater and David Fincher willing to vouch for you goes a long way towards minimizing the casting risk on Iron Man -- to say nothing of his aforementioned long-standing friendships with Mel Gibson and Jodie Foster - each of whom (as Bosco noted) gave him key chances at redemption earlier. Absolutely no comparison between RDJ and Ezra Miller.

I did some wikipedia'ing to try to get up to speed - I think it lists 10 people who have wielded the hammer in the comics -- err, a hammer, as I believe both Beta Ray Bill and Erik Masterson had different ones. But I immediately thought of this Fantastic Four cover from Civil War. One of my absolute favorites. In the story in question, Dr. Doom uses Mjolnir to escape from hell.

Not quite. $75 million x 2 = $150 million. Current (estimated) total: $146.42 million. $146.42 < $150