Juno Beach

Great video... RIck from immaculate has demonstrated that some heat applied to the ball joints on the bottom of the case allow for the "tamper proof" pillars can be popped off w/o a problem. 
CGC, you need a new case design, right now. 

Since I already looked at all the ASM 300's a few dozen pages back, I thought I'd go back and look at them all again, but this time look at the entire submission groups when those ASM 300's were submitted. Found quite a few suspect books that will need closer examination, some already uncovered such as the ASM 194 I confirmed swapped in one of my other posts. 
Well, popped a red bull and looked at all the CGC cert pages for the books from his ASM 300 submissions, and found some more suspect books to look closer at.
Notes. Those saying the date doesn't get changed on a reholder, I may have to disagree with ya on that, as these results seem to indicate when the GROUP submission's original grade date was and with much different grading dates for a few of the books. I also flagged the books that had images in the census before CGC announded in 8/1/2023 they'd be providing that info for everyone to enjoy.
What is completely blowing my mind here is the consistency with how often similar books are being sent in, and how consistent the 9.8 assignments are, especially with all the really rare books like the canadian price variants. Many of the 9.8's have grader notes that indicate bends and/or stress lines you'd think would normally disqualify a book from a 9.8
Again, this isn't an exhaustive list of every submission, just the one I generated based on all the ASM 300's he submitted.
Quite a remarkable track record. 
4071124001 - 6/01/2022 ASM 194 9.4
4071124002 - 6/01/2022 ASM 194 9.8
4071124003 - 6/01/2022 ASM 238 9.8
4071124004 - 6/01/2022 ASM 300 9.8
4071124005 - 6/01/2022 ASM 300 9.8
4106625001 - 8/10/2022 ASM 238 9.8
4106625002 - 10/27/2022 ASM 194 9.8 Newsstand - Suspect Book (date)
4106625003 - 8/10/2022 ASM 300 9.8 
4106625004 - 8/10/2022 ASM 300 9.8
4094947001 - 7/25/2022 ASM 194 9.8
4094947002 - 7/25/2022 ASM 194 9.8
4094947003 - 7/25/2022 ASM 300 9.8
4094947004 - 7/25/2022 ASM 300 9.8
4154321001 - 1/5/2023 ASM 238 9.8 Newsstand - Suspect Book (date)
4154321002 - 11/09/2022 ASM 238 9.8
4154321003 - 11/09/2022 ASM 238 9.8 
4154321004 - 11/09/2022 ASM 300 9.8
4154321005 - 11/09/2022 Batman 608 9.8 Retailer Incentive
4154321006 - 11/09/2022 Secret Wars 8 9.8
4154321007 - 11/09/2022 Secret Wars 8 9.8 Canadian Price Variant
4109596001 - 8/12/2022 ASM 194 9.6
4109596002 - 8/12/2022 ASM 194 9.8
4109596003 - 8/12/2022 ASM 194 9.8
4109596004 - 8/12/2022 ASM 300 9.8 - Suspect book... This one sold THREE times on eBay
4109596005 - 8/12/2022 ASM 300 9.8
4137132001 - 10/11/2022 Secret Wars 8 9.8
4137132002 - 10/11/2022 Secret Wars 8 9.8 Canadian Price Variant
4137132003 - 10/11/2022 ASM 300 9.8
4137132004 - 12/01/2022 ASM 238 9.8 Newsstand - Suspect Book (date)
4129851001 - 9/22/2022 FF 48 5.5 
4129851002 - 9/22/2022 IH 181 7.5 
4129851003 - 9/22/2022 ASM 300 9.8
4121886001 - 09/12/2022 ASM 194 9.8
4121886002 - 09/12/2022 ASM 194 9.8
4121886003 - 09/12/2022 ASM 300 9.6
4121886004 - 09/12/2022 ASM 300 9.8
4121886005 - 09/12/2022 ASM 238 9.8
4121886006 - 09/12/2022 Secret Wars 8 9.8
4199541001 - 02/08/2023 ASM 194 9.8 Suspect Book, has image/custom label, prior to 8/1/2023
4199541002 - 02/08/2023 ASM 194 9.8 
4199541003 - 04/04/2023 ASM 238 9.8 Newsstand - Suspect Book (date)
4199541004 - 10/30/2023 ASM 300 9.8 Newsstand - Suspect Book (date)
4199541005 - 02/08/2023 ASM 300 9.8
4199541006 - 02/08/2023 Secret Wars 8 9.8
4148457001 - 11/01/2022 ASM 300 9.8
4148457002 - 11/01/2022 ASM 194 9.6
4148457003 - 11/01/2022 ASM 129 8.5 Suspect Book, has image/custom label, prior to 8/1/2023
4221342001 - 3/20/2023 ASM 238 9.8
4221342002 - 3/20/2023 ASM 238 9.8
4221342003 - 3/20/2023 ASM 252 9.8
4221342004 - 3/20/2023 IH 340 9.8
4221342005 - 3/20/2023 ASM 300 9.8 - Suspect Book, sold multiple times on Ebay
4221342006 - 3/20/2023 Secret Wars 8 9.8 Newsstand
4245189001 - 5/1/2023 Secret Wars 8 9.8 Newsstand
4245189002 - 5/1/2023 IH 181 9.0 - Suspect Book, has image/custom label prior to 8/1/2023
4245189003 - 5/1/2023 ASM 300 9.8
4245189004 - 5/1/2023 ASM 300 9.8
4245189005 - 5/1/2023 Captain America 261 9.8 - Quadruple Cover
4265049001 - 6/2/2023 - Secret Wars 8 9.8 Canadian Price Variant
4265049002 - 6/26/2023 - ASM 238 9.8 Newsstand - Suspect Book, date, and image in census shows a Canadian PV. Label Wrong 
4265049003 - 8/2/2023 - ASM 238 9.8 Newsstand - Suspect, date, Canadian Price Variant, it's imaged, Not the same book as cert#4265049002
4265049004 - 6/2/2023 - ASM 194 9.8 - Suspect, it's imaged in Census prior to 8/1/2023
4265049005 - 6/26/2023 - IH 340 9.8 Newsstand - Suspect, date/imaged prior to 8/1/2023
4265049006 - 6/2/2023 - ASM 300 9.8
4252433001 - 6/14/2023 - ASM 238 9.8 Newsstand - Suspect, imaged in census prior to 8/1/2023
4252433002 - 5/11/2023 - ASM 238 9.8
4252433003 - 5/11/2023 - ASM 252 9.8
4252433004 - 6/14/2023 - Secret Wars 8 Newsstand Canadian Price Variant - suspect Imaged in Census prior to 8/1/2023
4252433005 - 5/11/2023 - ASM 194 9.8
4252433006 - 5/11/2023 - IH 340 9.8
4252433007 - 5/11/2023 - ASM 300 9.8
 
4153803001 - 11/18/2022 - UF 4 - 9.6
4153803002 - 11/18/2022 - UF 4 - 9.4
4153803003 - 11/18/2022 - UF 4 - 9.8
4153803004 - 11/18/2022 - ASM 300 - 9.6
4153803005 - 11/18/2022 - Batman Adventures 12 9.8
4153803006 - 11/18/2022 - Detective Comics 411 8.5
4324007001 - 9/13/2023 - X-Men 266 9.8
4324007002 - 9/13/2023 - X-Men 266 9.8
4324007003 - 9/13/2023 - ASM 252 9.8 Newsstand
4324007004 - 9/13/2023 - Secret Wars 8 Newsstand 
4324007005 - 9/13/2023 - ASM 300 9.8
4324007006 - 9/13/2023 - ASM 300 9.8
4324007007 - 9/13/2023 - ASM 300 9.8
4287881001 - 7/19/2023 - ASM 194 9.8 Newsstand, Suspect, Imaged prior to 8/1/2023
4287881002 - 7/19/2023 - ASM 300 9.6 Suspect, Imaged in Census prior to 8/1/2023
4287881003 - 7/19/2023 - ASM 300 9.8 Suspect, Imaged in Census prior to 8/1/2023

 

I'm not talking about a Blue book being switched with a lesser quality Blue book. This Hulk 181 was originally given a Green label, then regraded to Blue, in one working day, so no time for it to be sent to the seller for the switch. You could argue this was a mistake, but that same mistake has happened with 5 other Hulk 181s all sold by the same person. The switch of either the book or the label happened at CGC.

The 9.8 Canadian Price ASM 238 I found sold by the perp on ebay 8/2/2023, a book that CGC notes indicate was graded ON THE SAME DAY, is still my favorite WTF? in all this mess.
 

So what does this all mean for collectors?  Blind allegiance and loyalty to the company? Angry posts and videos that amount to words only and no action? Jumping ship to the only real choice in 3rdPG? 
The reality is, nothing will come of this. Nothing at all. Collectors will complain and moan, all the while still sending CGC books for grading and CGC smiles at you and gives you the finger. Another scandal arises and it's rinse and repeat from collectors ad nauseam.
This thread will do nothing toward sparking any tangible change because it will do nothing to negatively impact revenues which is the only thing corporations respond to.

Gift grade or switcheroo?   The question we’ll all be asking going forward….

That guy makes zero sense. I have about 750 CGC graded books currently in my possession, but in his mind, I want to see CGC die. Ok, whatever. I think a lot of us on these boards want to see CGC to succeed, but we also can't turn a blind eye towards any tampering or shenanigans with their product. We want to see them own this and come out stronger as a result. 

That's the sixth I just posted
Update: Here is the summary of all six in a chart and with direct links to each certification comparison, as well as original auciton listing and images.

Guy is a dope.
We've already seen that he, as Automatic Comics, stole info from comicwiz in his comments, deleted them,, and stated it was his discovery

At least some Facebook groups are allowing the information to get out there. 

Most noticeable characteristics to ascertain exact match, same wrap, same spine ticks, particularly by Wolvie's forearm, there is a diagonal crease that travels from the spine in a diagonally downward direction by the fist area, vertifical colour break running just above the D in Incredible to the MCG banner, crimped top right corner with diagonal colour break. Red pen mark (resembling a cursive handwritten m) on back cover.
4155507003 - CGC Qualified 6.0 - Hulk 1818 - Sold Feb 13, 2023 - $2750 (GD: 11/16/2022)



 
4120217003 - CGC Universal 6.5 - Hulk 181 - Sold Apr 11, 2023 - $4216 (GD: 09/06/2022)

You can follow this logic-based argument all you want, but it doesn't fit the data, and that is where it fails.

Thanks again for this info Comicwiz. The 4 day difference in grading each book makes it really suspicious. Talk about a fast moving operation where this guy has a book teleported to him from CGC after grading, does the whole business with swapping the inner wells / labels, teleporting the book back to CGC, and then somehow having CGC graders drop everything and regrade his book before other people who have $50k Walk-Thru books sitting there. 

Most noticeable characteristics to ascertain exact match, same wrap, same spine ticks, particularly by Wolvie's forearm,non colour-breaking triangular crease on bottom right corner
4206646001 - CGC Qualifed 7.0 - Hulk 181 - Sold May 11, 2023 - $3799.99 (GD: 02/24/2023)



Became
↳ 4209759001 - CGC Universal 8.5 - Hulk 181 - Sold June 12, 2023 - $6900 (GD: 02/28/2023)

I don't understand why so much of the conversation is focused on variants and CGC's reholdering process. If someone was able to crack a slab open and then swap out the book without CGC's own graders being able to notice the tampering, then the average customer DEFINITELY wouldn't be able to spot it. A person could generate massive amounts of crooked profits by taking midgrade copies of the most popular bronze age keys (GSXMen, ASM129, Hulk181, etc...) and swapping in a book 2 points lower. Think about a GSX 6.0 and a GSX 8.0. After you swap in the lower grade, you sell it for about 3k and then original 8.0 (now out of the case) regraded. It's much easier to fudge the grade on a midgrade book than a 9.8. And CGC sees so many midgrade giant size x-mens that the scammer could just keep sending the book in under different names/locations and they'd have no reason to think they're seeing a suspicious number of that book at that grade. But if you do this with 9.8's then all of us a sudden you're blowing up the census and people might start lookin' more closely. The real problem people are describing is that fake that, if swagglehauses conspiracy theory is true, then slabs cannot be considered tamper proof and that would be a DISASTER for CGC as a company...however...
 
I think all of this might be a moot point since as far as I can tell, no one has actually gotten one of these "fake slabs" in their hands. I think the questionable ebay dealer is just a guy dummying up fake sales data on ebay rather than a CGC surgeon who can actually swap out books without leaving any evidence of tampering. Seriously, until someone can actually demonstrate a process for cracking and replacing a book in a slab without leaving any indication, we have no reason to believe it's actually happening.
 
There are two accounts claiming to have bought slabs from the dealer in question and both accounts had absolutely no posting history until this controversy. Can anyone point to any part of this scam definitively taking place in the real world?

It's also odd how the versions of the grader's notes significantly deviates.
Specifically the foxing notation, which I thought was a fairly important criteria to document.
And the fingerprints don't disappear from the back cover but they do from the notes.
-bc

oh, COME ON, CGC. 

I don't want to get argumentative here, but I strongly beg to differ. This is more akin to an auto manufacturer discovering that the flex hose they equipped a fleet of vehicles malfunctions under certain pressure circumstances, that also disables the sensors on the brakes from funcitoning properly. Rather than issuing a voluntary recall, they put out some obscure form using an alpha-numeric code stating they will cover the repairs up to 15 years should an issue happen, not send a letter or notice to any of the car owners, and when something happens, they blame it on the driver for being negligent and not doing their part to check their brakes, drain and refill their brake fluid every six months. Such a thing actually exists. When have you ever heard a car manufacturer offer a warranty of any kind, for up to 15 years? Just try not to ask me how I know all this.
When we are talking about a "supposed" self-appointed impartial third-party that has a made-up word in their name that functions as a euphanism for "warranty" or some type of guarantee, then you need to use the right comparison, and that needs to be on the level of a fundamental safety flaw that could cause a catastrophic event.

Welp, then I'm wasting my time even bothering digging up questionable sales. People are so addicted to the CGC bump they get from selling their 9.4/9.6/9.8's that they'll never stop throwing money at the machine and CGC will have zero incentive to change. 

“Can sum up the Cole Schave scam in a few sentences”
 
- responds with a link to a thread with 5,000 posts  LOL
 
 

I don’t think that makes a whole lot of sense. It was pretty clear when this buyer posted yesterday, if you looked at the tracking information that the information was clear. The tracking number was shown in the eBay messages between them, in that post..It showed the post office location where the comic book was shipped from. I would put it at 1 million to one, that this is anything more than what That Incredible Hulk 340 buyer’s post, showed  it to be.
If you were a scammer, and you were sending someone a comic book that wasn’t quite worth the $5000 that the buyer thought it was , but it was actually worth $2000, Would you put fake return address information on the box, that would cost you $2000 if for some reason that package needed to come back to you? Your argument might make a lot more sense except for that.

Hello. I am the Ebay buyer that purchase the two Amazing Spider-Man 238s Newsstand from briva3 or Comic Selects  and possibly by way of ComicLink  an Incredible Hulk 340. I became aware of this scam via the negative feedback left on briva3 Ebay seller account and the podcast provided by West Coast Davengers and 9.9 Newsstand.  I also believe the New Mutants 98 book that was part of the New Mutants Mark Jewler scam that was discussed in one of the podcast is possible a regular Newsstand edition I won in an auction from briva3 prior to the New Mutants Mark Jewelers auction by him. I suspect at last minute he needed the regular NM 98 newsstand as after I successfully won the auction he canceled the purchase through Ebay.  There has been a question of briva3 real name, location and possible contact information. Based on the shipments of the ASM 238s, a conversation I had personally with him as well as messages exchanged and most recently information provided to me by Ebay for the return of the ASM 238 books to him, I have contact information for him.
In my attempt make a claim with Ebay, I also submitted a return request, as that was the only option available, through their resolution center noting that the seller had been identified as defrauding buyers and that I would like to file a fraud claim. My hope was that  using the term fraud would trigger a keyword alert in their system and that someone from Ebay would reach out to me directly. It was to my surprise on Friday that I received a response from Ebay stating that the seller, briva3, had responded and approved my return request for the ASM 238 books. This concerns me as I now don't believe Ebay is aware that this is a case of the seller defrauding buyers and subsequently attempt to take action against the seller. If that is in fact the situation, it ties into my other concern of the books from buyers requesting returns being shipped back to the seller and used later in some new manner to defraud collectors in the future. While I want to be made whole financially, if possible. I don't want the books to be returned to briva3 only to be used in some nefarious manner down the line because of lack recourse or actions that allow briva3 to slip through the cracks. From the perspective of being one of the buyer's impacted by this scam, I would much rather CGC request the books forward to them, make the concessions to the buyers and either retain the books or regrade them accurately to possibly be sold at a later date at the new correct grade. In conjunction with that effort, enact new security measures that prevent a scam like this and the defrauding of buyers, in this manner, from occurring in the future. 
I would like to thank Dave at West Coast Davengers as after receiving the approved return response from Ebay, I reached out to him and he provided me his thoughts on the issue I am facing in returning the books to briva3 as well as recommended that I post on this forum for the perspective, thoughts and awareness of its members. 
Below are the links to the auctions for the ASM 238s I won on Ebay as well as the auction I won for the NM 98 that briva3 retracted the purchase for. If you look at the feedback of the bidding history and feedback count of the buyer for the auctions, you can see they were all won by the same buyer. Also, I have provided a link to the Incredible Hulk 340 that sold on Ebay and then was sold to me via ComicLink a few months later. The certification numbers are the same but I believe the books could possibly be different.
 
 
ASM 238s   Amazing Spider-man # 238 cgc 9.8 1st App of Hobgoblin Stan Lee Newsstand Romita | eBay        Amazing Spider-man # 238 cgc 9.8 1st App of Hobgoblin Stan Lee Newsstan...
1st Appearance of Hobgoblin ! Recently graded. Hobgoblin has been rumored to make his appearance eventually. Key...
        Amazing Spider-man # 238 cgc 9.8 1st App of Hobgoblin Stan Lee Newsstand Romita | eBay        Amazing Spider-man # 238 cgc 9.8 1st App of Hobgoblin Stan Lee Newsstan...
1st Appearance of Hobgoblin ! Recently graded, Beautiful White Pgs. Hobgoblin has been rumored to make his appea...
      NM 98   New Mutants # 98 cgc 9.8 1 st Deadpool Weapon X Rare Newsstand Ed. Wolverine | eBay        New Mutants # 98 cgc 9.8 1 st Deadpool Weapon X Rare Newsstand Ed. Wolve...
The Deadpool Franchise is here to stay and only increasing in popularity. Wolverine is coming back so this book ...
    IH 340   Incredible Hulk # 340 cgc 9.8 1 st Newsstand Stan Lee Todd Mcfarlane 181 | eBay       Incredible Hulk # 340 cgc 9.8 1 st Newsstand Stan Lee Todd Mcfarlane 181...
The Hulk Franchise is here to stay and only increasing in popularity. Wolverine is coming back so this book only...
  INCREDIBLE HULK #340 COMIC BOOK SALE CGC 9.8 NM/MT         INCREDIBLE HULK #340 COMIC BOOK SALE CGC 9.8 NM/MT
ComicLink is the Online Vintage Comic Book and Comic Art auction destination featuring comic book auctions spotl...
  Reposting as a new member my post was awaiting moderator approval

I'd go with homage to Planet Comics 58.

Cool game. You change what I said in a direct quote in an insulting way, I report it to moderators on this board. Merry hoho.