Darkowl

Totally. USPS is another word for apathy.

This is shocking, and is enough reason for me to never do business with them. Crazy A-holes!

Indeed!

So when you say "foundational book", you're only referring its monetary value? Again, you keep overhyping the illegitimate ebay sales. I hate having to repeat myself, but the sales from other websites are not too far off from what ebay is selling books for, sometime it's more, sometimes it's less, but ebay sales are usually accurate. In regards to cancellations or returns, out of the hundreds of books I've sold on ebay, I've only had 1 return. Disney could screw up Wolverine or the X-Men, but what's more likely to happen given their ridiculously successful track record? Disney has already stated that they will continue to make R-rated Deadpool films, so I wouldn't bank too much on a "family friendly" version of Wolverine at this point.

Now that's a pretty copy! Good luck!

I couldn't disagree more that H181 is not a foundation book. Wolverine IS of iconic status. If you look at the most popular superhero polls across the web, you'll see that Wolverine usually ranks within the top 5. Saying Wolverine isn't an iconic character really comes across as biased. And the fact that H181 is not a rare book, but continues to fetch prices that defy decades of expectations should really tell you something about Wolverine's status in pop culture. "Hulk 181 is in a generation where adults are spending money on things they wanted when they were kids. They are becoming/are parents. but when their kids grow up living in a world where at the ripe age of 2/3 they start getting electronic things in their hands. The interests will go somewhere else and they may not view "old books" as something to spend money on." I agree that this is a possibility, however if this happens to H181, it's also going to happen to Action and Detective. Those books aren't immune from generation disinterest either. "I would say now a hulk 181 Is bragging rights for the guy who cant afford the foundational books." Another biased statement. Putting monetary value aside, I personally would much rather own H181 than AC1. I'm pretty sure I'm not in the minority there either. People aren't just buying H181, because they can't afford AC1, or AF15. If I wanted, I could buy an AF15 any day of the week. But again, I'd much rather own a copy of H181. "I would say in roughly 5 years time that will be the start of people not being able to make a profit, that will be the time when they will be fortunate to break even provided that they don't find someone's collection and give a fraction for it compared to online prices." Except you have ZERO data to base a statement like this on. Don't get me wrong, I think all things have their limits, but 5 years? No way. If you don't think Wolverine is an icon, or that H181 isn't a foundation book at this point, you're in for a rude awakening when Disney starts pushing out X-Men films. That's the thing about Wolverine, there's still crazy room for him to grow in popularity, whereas I'm not entirely sure how much more room there is for Batman/Superman. Regardless, Disney plans on making X-Men films in the next 2-3 years, and I can guarantee that It's going to be at least a 10 year run with the franchise. This will continue to drive up the price of H181. Just wait until they start selling Wolverine merch at Disneyland. "Housing is another factor. Some people would rather buy a home than a comic book. The 'Kidult' generation that is buying the things they wanted when they were kids will realize that life is going by quickly and they will need to grow up. They will still like the characters but it wont be the same. They wont spend big money on comics anymore, that is until prices come down. But if prices hover around where they are now, that's fine for the seller, but it is not going to be a foundational book category worthy of investment, where someone will pay millions of dollars for a hulk 181. I honestly don't think anyone would even pay hundreds of thousands for a 181." People will always have priorities, and will have to make sacrifices for what they want most. If someone owned a H181 that was worth 10K or 20K, and they wanted to buy a house, it actually might make sense for them to sell it so that they can have a down payment. However, It's really difficult to determine how many H181 owners are in this boat. I certainly don't think it's the majority. Frankly, I just don't think this particular argument is relevant enough to merit significant consideration. Ironically, H181 has proven to be a more solid investment than real estate. What someone is willing to pay doesn't make it a foundational book, but rather an outcome of it being a foundational book. I can guarantee that people would be spending A LOT more on H181 if it wasn't for the supply. In fact, 9.9 sold for 150K. "All the sale data isn't reflecting the comics shops in the country that have some copies come in their stores from old collectors that are, well...getting old, and getting rid of their stuff they've been holding on to for their whole life. The fact is they aren't charging the prices on ebay. they are charging less. I got my hulk in a brick and mortar comic book shop. I paid 1700. All I expected to get was a 181. To my surprise when I was looking over the 181, the shop owner tells me it was 1700 for hulk 180, 181, and 182. they are in great shape. I couldn't believe it, especially after seeing the ebay prices. My local shop owner has 2 copies. one is an 8.0 cgc and I cant remember what the other is. He can't get rid of them." You're correct in that the sales data is not complete, but the GPA data is a valuable tool for looking at general sale numbers. If you're LCS owner is having difficulty selling H181, then he's doing it wrong. In fact, If his prices are below GPA, then please provide me with his info so I can contact him. I'd be more than happy to buy an 8.0 below gpa. Seriously. You also have to take into consideration that selling comics locally is a different beast altogether. For one, sellers don't have to worry about fees, so they can sell cheaper than ebay, and still make a profit. Secondly, in my experience, it's actually more difficult to sell locally, because It's hard to generate the views and interest that's so easily achievable with ebay, and other online avenues. What took me 3 months to sell a book locally only took me 1 week to sell online, so I'd say selling locally and selling online isn't a fair comparison, and most LCS don't have difficulty selling copies of H181. That book is hotter than hot, and is one of the easiest books to sell. "The bottom line is at some point, there will be a number that people will not pay. I think in the next 3 to 5 years that number is going to show itself and I don't think it will be as high as what investors hoped for. I cant help but wonder about the data of loss/gain. What does the data say about the dip in profit? I paid the price I paid because I like the character but I had a number I was not willing to pay. The same has to be thought of people trying to "invest" what number is too low for their profit margin? I'm curious about the people that took losses on their investments. There is no way 181 is ALL profit. That doesn't even happen in the stock market. It's about loss/gain. If 181 is looked at as an investment where can I go to see the loss/gain data? cause I got a ton of cash (not bragging) I would absolutely spend in a heart beat for all profit, no loss comic books." I agree. H181 will eventually reach a number that people will not pay, but we aren't even close to getting there yet. Take a look at the sales data for AF15. The numbers are going down. I think the same thing will happen to ALL books eventually, and they will hit a steady sweet spot. This is why I don't think H181 is a bubble, because bubbles pop. If H181 does decline in value, it will be a gradual decrease. As far 181 not being all profit, if you stayed away from 9.8's before their pitfall, and had you played your cards right (buy at or around gpa, don't sell for less than what you paid, etc.) 181 would have been all profit. All you had to do was buy a copy and sit on it for a year, and you would have made money. When Logan hit theaters I picked up a 9.0 for around 2k. I sat on it for about 2 years, and was able to sell it for over 5k. That's only one of many 181 profit stories that I have. I have been buying and selling this book for over 10 years now, and it has been nothing but profit. One last point I want to make. H181 is still a safe investment. Why? Forget all the reasons I've already listed, just focus on the fact that H181 is a relatively inexpensive book. You can pick up a good copy for around 2k, and losing 2k is easily recoverable (that's the worst that could happen). It's not like when people lost hundreds of thousands of dollars back '09 on real estate, something that everyone told me was solid. I also want to reiterate the fact that this debate has been going on for years now. Like I said, you can dig up old threads and see all the naysayers proclaiming doomsday for H181, but they have been proven wrong ever since. Eventually, eventually, the closest they will ever get to being right is when H181 does slowly start to creep down, just like AF15 is doing, but we just aren't there yet.

This thread

ASM 71 is a fav of mine! I still need to pick up X-Men 4!!!

Ooooohhh! I could have sworn you said, "It's surprising that a Buffy the Vampire Slayer movie hasn't ever been made". Just busting your balls. Seriously though, I actually liked the movie more than the show. I'm with you though, would love to see a full length film get made.

The manipulated/cancelled/whatever ebay sales you describe are the exception to the rule. Most ebay sales are legit, and the final numbers are quite comparable to other websites, like Heritage Auctions, for example. ebay usually has higher sales though, because there are more people aware of ebay than they are of HA (and other sites), so you're going to have more bids driving that price up. Btw, I don't see us living in a world where AC1, or DC27 are investment books, and H181 isn't, because H181 is also a foundation book! It clearly doesn't matter how many copies are available (to an extent), because the demand has been exceeding that for years, long before they started making X-Men movies. Wolverine is right up there with Superman, Batman, and Spiderman, and his popularity CONTINUES to grow. I've heard the same old argument from collectors for YEARS! "Don't invest in H181! It's a bubble! Look at how high those numbers are! It's overpriced! OMG!" Blah, blah, blah. Ironically, this exact same conversation has been occurring for quite some time. You can dig up threads from years ago with people saying the exact same thing, and they were proven wrong time, and time again. Had I listened to any of those kinds of statements, I would have lost out on thousands, and thousands of investing dollars. I'll just say one last thing, If there is a H181 bubble, and it bursts, then the reason behind it is going to be a scary one, and it will effect us all.

7.0

It was made, long before the show.

It didn't.

SOLD! !

SOLD!

The Avengers 1 CGC 2.5. Excellent centering! $1800 shipped

SOLD!

Will always be one the coolest scenes in any superhero movie. I would loved to have seen a solo QS film!

I'm sold. I REALLY like this fresh approach. They were smart to hire Joaquin Phoenix to play the role. The dude's acting chops are off the charts.

Keep a weather eye out mates!

Take per PM

Dang. I've been waiting forever for a good deal on a HOM 174. Good job guys.