delekkerste

I had a busy summer of reading. Here's what I remember, but I may be missing a couple of books: Fiction: Dracula The Un-dead - Dacre Stoker and Ian Holt (in progress) Super Sad True Love Story - Gary Shteyngart The Girl With the Dragon Tattoo - Stieg Larsson The Girl Who Played With Fire - Stieg Larsson The Girl Who Kicked the Hornet's Nest - Stieg Larsson The Man in the High Castle - Philip K. D ick Non-Fiction: When Money Dies: The Nightmare of Deficit Spending, Devaluation, and Hyperinflation in Weimar Germany - Adam Fergusson The Inverted Jenny: Money, Mystery, Mania - George Amick My Word is My Bond: A Memoir - Roger Moore Old Masters, New World: America's Raid on Europe's Great Pictures - Cynthia Saltzman My Name is Charles Saatchi and I Am an Artoholic - Charles Saatchi Endgame: The End of the Debt Supercycle and How It Changes Everything - John Mauldin and Jonathan Tepper The Big Secret for the Small Investor - Joel Greenblatt The Tipping Point - Malcolm Gladwell Flat Out, Flat Broke: Formula 1 the Hard Way - Perry McCarthy

My Stevens pride & joy.

Wolverine has a half splash at the end of #180 (in full costume) and is referenced earlier in the book. It is, ostensibly, his true first appearance. That said, #181, like Sensation #1, is his first cover appearance and he's the star of the book. I was the underbidder on the 9.2 copy of Sensation #1 at Heritage a while back. I don't really collect slabs anymore and have never collected GA, but that book stood out to me with the first cover appearance. I would not have had any interest in AS #8.

AS8 = Hulk 180 Sensation 1 = Hulk 181 Gene

Thanks, Roy. (thumbs u Next question is whether anyone knows of a good safe or lockable storage box they can recommend. Probably looking more for a small lockbox, just to discourage opportunistic theft, rather than something big and bulky designed to withstand fire...my slabs aren't worth all that much.

Quick favor to ask of anyone who has a tape measure and CGC slab handy - can you tell me what is the EXACT length and width of a slab? I'm looking to buy a lockbox or home safe now, and need to make sure my slabs will fit. Thanks, Gene

OK, cool - so, if you saw it in '01, it must have really been one of the earlier books to get graded, before CGC had the benefit and experience of grading hundreds of HG copies of that book to readily determine between 9.6s/9.8s/9.9s. I recall that even around 2003-4 that there were still only like three to five 9.8 copies of Hulk #181 (as a friend of mine had two of them).

I looked over the book very closely and my opinion was that there's no way it would have gotten a 9.9 had it been cracked out and resubmitted. I'm skeptical that the book was ever a true 9.9 to begin with, and even from the marginal scans you can tell that it isn't now. I could be wrong about the next part, as it's been at least 7 years since I saw the book (it was either the '01, '02 or '03 SDCC where I saw it - I was one of the big players in Bronze back then), but I seem to recall that the book had one of the very earliest CGC labels when I saw it - the kind that didn't have the page quality listed. Does anybody recall the same? Was the book reholdered shortly thereafter? If that's the case, it might help to explain why CGC gave that book a 9.9 - it was graded very early on and they didn't have the benefit of having graded hundreds of high grade copies of the book to distinguish between what should be a 9.4/9.6/9.8/9.9. BUT, even if my mind is cloudy about the labeling part, the book was, in any case, graded fairly early on and that probably makes my last point very applicable anyway. Whether that matters to the ultimate buyer, who'll be buying the rarity of the grade on the label and not necessarily the best preserved copy of Hulk #181, who can say...

Wow, what's up with that URHC? Scans can be deceiving, but it doesn't look like a 9.9 to me. I held the book in my hands at the SDCC some years ago (2003 maybe?) The scan is not deceiving - it does not look like a 9.9 in person. No way would it get a 9.9 on a resub. I'm not sure the book is a victim of SCS; I recall it not looking minty fresh enough back then, and that it's very likely that the book was not a true 9.9 when it was graded and it just lucked out.

Wow, that analysis so fundamentally flawed that I hardly know where to begin. Let me offer the most simple, yet overriding and powerful, argument for why one would be interested in collecting unmanipulated high grade books. And that is the sense of magic/awe/wonder of owning something that was meant to be used (read) and discarded decades ago, but instead somehow, miraculously even, survived the ravages of time, ownership, moving, floods, kid siblings and mothers cleaning out closets while you were away at college, etc. to remain in as pristine a state as possible. This is a sense that pressing and other manipulation does away with. Why do we revere pedigree collections? It's because we respect the extreme elements of our hobby who had the compulsion, if not the foresight, to accumulate tremendous #s of comic books in the 1930s-1960s and, defying all odds, managed to keep the books in pristine condition. While I understand that some people are not averse to owning pressed books, can anyone truly say that there is no difference between a book that was naturally and meticulously preserved as, say, a 9.4 over many decades and a book that was worn down to a 9.0 but was manipulated to achieve a 9.4 label? Can you not see why vast numbers of people, even those who endorse/accept/tolerate pressing, might believe the former book is the much more desirable one? I accept that some people are OK with pressed books while others like me are not. But, I do not accept the former camp trying to frame people like me as hypocrites or worse when there are sound, logical and obvious reasons (which have nothing to do with diminishing prestige or investibility) why many feel the same way I do. It's like listening to bad Soviet propaganda.

You've pretty much described exactly what I do now - I buy and read trades like they're going out of style, I collect OA and I actively interact with fellow collectors both here on the Boards and in real life as well. As for HG slab collecting...that's dead to me now. For a while, I was still bidding on the occasional book here and there (you may recall that I was the underbidder on that Sensation #1 9.0 or 9.2 earlier this year; you posted a response about it), but I've even cut that out of late. I just find it unfortunate that the hobby has gone down the path that it has...but, as you said, there are other ways to enjoy the medium.

I couldn't agree with you more. I suppose if you are a collector or dealer who only cares about the number on the label and the $$$ to be earned, and the acceptance in the marketplace of both, then what has happened to the hobby doesn't faze you and you just go with the flow. If, however, you still approach the hobby with a sense of awe and nostalgia, it's become a farce. No longer are high grade books a rare commodity that you can marvel over for having survived the ravages of time and multiple ownership, keeping in mind how most people treated their books as kids - the "untouched, real survivors" as you put it. Instead, they have become a manufactured commodity where the years can be rolled back through artificial methods. What pizzes me off the most is that these practices have become so pervasive that you almost have to assume that any high-grade, high-value book that hits the market has been potentialized - which means the awe about survivorship is gone. I find it truly befuddling how people can fawn over a high-grade book knowing with almost metaphysical certainty that it was thrown under the press multiple times (and hopefully not worse than that) to achieve that numerical grade. It is what it is, but where's the wonder in that? Or is it all about the grade/status and $$$ now?

As an indication of how much the shenanigans in this hobby have affected me, back in the day I spent hundreds of thousands of dollars on HG slabs--annually. I now spend less than ten thousand dollars on HG slabs each year. You should have put some of that money into HK real estate, buddy.

"What drives you to collect? " Nostalgia and an appreciation for the art, stories, creators and characters developed over the last 27 years of reading comics. "Do you love the medium and just can't get enough of comic art originals?" I love the medium, but it's not true that I can't get enough of OA. I don't think it's healthy to let your collecting pursuits become all-consuming. I also think that it's natural for collectors to run into the law of diminishing utility - I certainly experienced that in comics, where the acquisition of my 300th slabbed comic gave me very little incremental joy compared to my first, and led me to eventually give up that hobby entirely. I still enjoy getting new art, but that is because I am now very selective and only buy things that will enhance my collection and my enjoyment thereof. If I was on the prowl for new art all the time and just collecting for collecting's sake, I don't think I would be enjoying life, let alone collecting, very much. Are you a "Prestige" collector and only looking to pick up some top pieces?" I would say in the beginning that was definitely not the case - I didn't particularly care for prestige or monetary value if I liked the artist, subject matter and the quality of the art. "Buy what you like", as it were. However, I realize in hindsight that I was not selective enough and ended up overpaying for a number of pieces since I was focusing more on artistic quality than prestige (which is directly correlated with marketability/market value). Nowadays, artistic quality and nostalgia still drive my purchases, but that is balanced against selectivity and trying to buy the better examples. I like having nice pieces in my collection and will no longer buy something "just to have a piece by a certain artist or from a certain run", for example. "Are you really just a comic book collector that ran out of stuff to get and this seems the next logical step?" That was initially the case, but I have come to appreciate OA more than I ever did comics. And, despite the faults in the OA hobby (and there are many), I feel the comic book hobby has become such a fetid cesspool that I'm glad to be out of it. "Are you interested because of the money aspect and if you're going to invest money, it might as well be something fun you're interested in." The money aspect has played a minuscule role in my collecting. I have never made an art trade and the number of pieces I have ever sold you can count on one hand (all very low value stuff that I just didn't care for anymore; profit was never a consideration). I have never bought anything that I couldn't pay for immediately without the benefit of trade bait, time payments or relying on the sale of another piece. I have never viewed my collection as an investment - investing is my day job and I would never want it to cross over into any of my hobbies! That said, as market prices and the value of my collection have increased, I have become more aware of it. I used to mentally value my collection at zero, but now I mentally value it at around what I think I could be confident of getting in a true fire sale liquidation (less than half of FMV). I'm not someone who counts on making a profit from my collecting or who thinks the market will always be so accommodating as to allow me to recoup all my costs (let alone reap a big profit) should I ever need to sell. I consider the enjoyment I get from looking at the art, especially the many pieces I have hanging up around my apartment, to be "return" enough on my investment. "Are you a full time collector or just dabbling?" I was a full time collector for a while, but now I'm just adding incremental pieces when the opportunities arise. Something really needs to grab me and the prices have to make sense for me to pursue something these days. I'm very happy with my collection and, while there is more art out there that I would like to own, if I had to call it a day in the hobby here, I could still be very content with my collection as it is. I have other hobbies/pursuits that I am equally passionate about, so OA is definitely not crack to me - if nothing strikes my fancy, or if the price for a piece I want doesn't make sense to me, I'm happy to find other ways to spend my money!

Thanks, guys! Yes, it was my birthday gift to myself - good thing it became available, otherwise I wouldn't have gotten myself anything!

Just got this in today - one of my very favorite Fables covers by James Jean (issue #45)! Thanks to Brett (Solar) for making it happen!

I'm sure if we met each other in person, we'd get along great. And I'd still tell you that you're crazy to your face. (thumbs u Just so we're clear, I'm all for people doing/buying whatever makes them happy as long as they are being fiscally, ethically, legally and morally responsible about it. I've certainly made some crazy purchases in the past when it comes to comics myself, and if someone wants to give me stick on the Boards for having done so, that just goes with the territory. By the way, this is well on its way to being the greatest thread ever and would make a great Mastercard commercial: The first New Mutants #98 CGC 9.9: $12,250. 10 sessions with a psychiatrist: $3,500 The notoriety gained from making the most ridiculous comic purchase ever: Priceless

It's a perfectly rational explanation, but, unfortunately it is still rendered completely meaningless by the fact that OMFG, DUDE, YOU PAID $12,250 FOR A FREAKIN' NEW MUTANTS #98. I mean, I get your faith in CGC and your exponential valuation explanation, but this is still New Mutants #98 we're talking about and paying $12,250 for it is just , no matter what the # is on the label, how many copies of that grade are in the Census and/or how wealthy someone is. If multiple people are willing to pay at/near that price, far from justifying it, it just means you're all just totally bonkers. People can make any argument they like ("what I collect..." is my favorite bit of relativistic nonsense (thumbs u ), but this is just prima facie nuts and anyone who's honest with themself knows it. And just who are these "colleagues" of yours who have offered you a "significant" return on your "investment" already? People are queuing up to pay you, what, $15K+ for this book before it's even in your hands? If that's true, please forward me their names and contact info because I have a giant Ponzi scheme great investment opportunity to sell them. You say you are an economics professor who is now "sans ballz" having shot your wad, so to speak, on this book? Are you telling us that you are not the second coming of Roman Abramovich who can light his cigars with $12,250 checks?? If so, you are clinically insane braver than I thought.

Actually, Mr. Abramovich lost billions of dollars last year. In any case, I'm far less appalled surprised by a multi-billionaire spending $47K for a celebratory business lunch (where the overwhelming majority of the cost was due to premium vintage wines whose market prices are high but well established - as are restaurants' large customary mark-ups, to be sure) than anyone spending $12K+ for a New Mutants #98 CGC 9.9, a book that is practically without value except for the big 9.9 on the label (and which some would deem arbitrary vis-a-vis some strong 9.8s which sell for 1/50th the price). :doh:

Hulk/Thing bondage =

How about several 9.8 copies, a couple of Hulk #181 CGC 9.6s and a few thousand bucks cash thrown in for good measure? Is that something you might be interested in?

What is objectionable is the price, not the book. It's not the "what", but, rather, the "how much". OK, OK, you got me - Rob Liefeld and Deadpool both suck too.

I know this has been discussed in the Pedigree Comics auction thread, but, seriously, this travesty sale deserves to be pilloried highlighted in its own thread for posterity: New Mutants #98 CGC 9.9 Sells for $12,250 I don't know whether to or because the little bit of faith in humanity I had left has been ripped to shreds.

2002 towards2112, FlyingDonut, gman, ArAich, greggy, fingfangfoom, Chromium, supapimp, Bronzebruce13, CaptainOfIndustry, valiantman, drummy, nearmint, Zonker, Architect, dena, SilverandBronze, chrisco37, bronty, fantastic_four, mr_highgrade, comic paradox, sborock, TheVisitor, joe_collector, awe4one, tkg2627, scottish, clobberintime, ComicDiva89, comiclink, comicwiz, comix4fun, delekkerste 2003 Scrooge, Earl, BrianR, WEBHEAD, goldust40, sckao, Theagenes, detective27kid, Flaming_Telepath, Aces, Silver, shiverbones, Silver, telerites*, sakaridis, 500Club, BurntBoy, seank, newerthannew, Mephisto, Calamerica 2004 xsmanx, JordanScott, r1970d, Stronguy, namisgr, Currin Comics, marvelcollector, toro, Buck Biggins, Norinn Radd, bounty_coder, iggy, nerfherder-3 2005 Sal, kingofrulers, Crows, Cryptkeeper59, theHumanTorch, John72tex, RockMyAmadeus, BigMike, JmC, Benz, Point Five, Inhuman Fiend 2006 joeypost, nepatkm, lookwhoitis, MCMiles, thirdgreenham, Monstro, TimMaY, DrWatson, Korvac Saga, Ciorac (2003*/2004*), Karma23, Superman2006, ernster 2007 BlowUpTheMoon, MacMan, Count, blue808, Mr. Diggler, trmoore54, cheetah, bosco685, MR. COMICBOOK, JazzMan, bronze_rules, Spidermanontilt, Designer Toast, TupennyConan, shark2557, snitzer, rtarturo, almoe, the shadow knows, cloudofwit, Dale Roberts, nwpassage, Big Daddy 2008 Comicopolis, Boozad, Nmtg9, Dollarbill, PEP, Black Lantern, Junkenstein99, Cimm, ShortstackComics, Universal Soldier, Lebowski 2009 slym2none, ashsaytr