NC101

Just to add to what ESeffinga said, it's also possible that you weren't being unreasonable/demanding, but in the past the artist has dealt with people who were and he was worried you were going to be like that so he was reacting as though you were already. In any case if he had an issue he should have stated it plainly, not hidden behind snarky comments.

I'm an artist but in a different medium and I've met heroes who were kind of a-holes. I wish I were able to completely separate the work and the person but it has sometimes soured me on their work a little, it sucks when it happens.

1 hour ago, RBerman said:

I'm having trouble finding the right size media storage for pages. I got an 11x17 Itoya portfolio, and another one that was 13x19, and thought I'd be good. But then I just got three Swamp thing pages that are 13x19.625, and I can't find a portfolio that makes sense for those.

I've heard others say that it's best to store a size up, ie put 11x17 in 13x19 sleeves, etc., you might want to use the 13x19 for the smaller pages and get another bigger portfolio

11 hours ago, malvin said:

yes, in general most sharpies will fade over time.  In general hanging it up will be worse for fading (regardless of whether or not you use UV or museum glass)

Malvin

Thanks! I'm thinking I'm gonna make a really high-quality scan of the work, print it and hang that up, and keep the original inks stored. It also came with the pencils on separate sheets, so at least those will last.

I bought a couple of pages from an artist who uses mainly Uni-Pen, but to fill in large areas uses black Sharpie. Does anyone have experience w/ sharpie art and recommendations for storing work that uses Sharpie, any special considerations? Should I expect the ink to fade and/or yellow over time whether or not I hang it up or keep it stored? TIA

This isn't "new" new, having a quality scan is though - Anna Andruchowicz - W Obcej Skórze/The Outer Skin p39

2 hours ago, vodou said:

"Was" nice in pencil form.

 

Too bad it was ruined by after-market inks to help bump flippability.

 

Maybe George can tackle some other "unfinished" junk next. My suggestion...

 

Is this common, that pencils are altered like this after the fact?

Spider-Man vs Mr. Fantastic in a Dream Machine-type setting.

2 hours ago, GotSuperPowers? said:

Flip or shill?

"Sold" at 6.1k

https://www.ebay.com/itm/TYLER-KIRKHAM-ORIGINAL-ART-TO-DEADPOOL-BACK-IN-BLACK-1-11X17-VENOM-DEADPOOL-/184135947663

BIN/Best offer listing at 10k with the exact same title/description

https://www.ebay.com/itm/TYLER-KIRKHAM-ORIGINAL-ART-TO-DEADPOOL-BACK-IN-BLACK-1-11X17-VENOM-DEADPOOL/164055025254

I'm really puzzled by the re-use of the same image, but at extremely degraded quality

Is it recommended to use silica bags or any other desiccant when storing work? If it makes a difference, I have my pages in mylar sleeves with backing boards & microchamber paper, stored in a flat file box.

Dr. Strange by Chris Bachalo - Sold in Nov or Dec 2019 for $700:

https://galleryzero.bigcartel.com/product/doctor-strange-pumpkins-one

Now risen an incredible 115% in value to $1500:

http://www.romitaman.com/GalleryPiece.asp?Piece=23566&ArtistId=1159

4 hours ago, RBerman said:

I got some Kitson pages today from Supergirl and the Legion of Superheroes #23. Two sketch pages (one in pencil and one surprisingly in ink) and the corresponding final inked pages. And then.... what is this? It's a shrunken ink rendition of one of the pages, on thick tracing paper. Signed and dated. Does it have some role in the production process? Or something else?

It might be vellum paper, iirc I was looking at an auction a little while ago of a Kitson drawing that looked similar and was described as being on vellum.

Edit: Sorry, I misunderstood the question - the other auctions of similar Kitson stuff are described as prelims

On 1/26/2020 at 5:09 PM, Blastaar said:

I will continue to preach that Grass Kings is underrated as a series and Tyler Jenkins is underrated as an artist. This series has been listed weekly on ebay, most pages going under $50. 

I 2nd Grass Kings, I grabbed this one a few weeks ago

46 minutes ago, Mycroft said:

You can have a look at the french market at 2Dgalleries https://www.2dgalleries.com/ 

or the BDGest forum dedicated to original art : https://www.bdgest.com/forum/originaux.html

and his US comics dedicated thread : https://www.bdgest.com/forum/avez-vous-des-planches-originales-de-comics-t16995-3960.html

I saw a link to your blog in that thread, I love it!

1 hour ago, Mycroft said:

Regarding the Blueberry page. 

The French market value pages way more than the comics market, partly because of the slower rythm of production (hence pages are a scarce commodity), partly because we love "art".

Moreover Blain is something of a superstar of the french comic book industry.

The price may be optimistic, but not that much ...

 

 

Do you find that French collectors are mostly interested in French/European artists, or are they equally interested in comic art from America and other countries outside of Europe?

15 minutes ago, vodou said:

Definitely; the word doesn't apply to comic art at all (or collectibles at all). The correct word is: speculation

Makes sense to me

4 minutes ago, vodou said:

If the price is the same/greater than an amount you'd miss if you lost your wallet: it's an investment

I don't think that's true, but maybe we're defining investment differently.

3 hours ago, vodou said:

Everything Eric wrote is great, however he skipped an exceptionally salient point (an obvious and intentional omission to us old hands here) - there is a reason crummy comic art by crummy artists sells for a lot. That reason? It's not about "The Art" (aka everything that Eric is pointing you toward) but "The Collectors" (and/or also "The Dealers"   aka The Market.)

What this means is, Sal Buscema's sharp angles may make you want to slit your wrists BUT The Collectors (en masse) have determined that Avengers, Spider-Man, and a mountain of fill-ins are worth more for the "content" than the art. (As long as those favored characters are: IN COSTUME ) You miss this point, you will end up with a rather aesthetically pleasing stash of stuff (to you, a few others probably too but almost nobody else with eyes only for: comic art) that without a growing audience will sit flat or decline in value over time (not only in inflation adjusted but even real terms), even faster if you overpaid to begin with. (Paid vs. Over/Underpaid is very much a separate topic too.)

The above doesn't mean you have to collect "popular" (but not-so-great at best) art, but the awareness should be there that when you buy offbeat/niche "artsy" comic art you may have left your money behind at POP never to return. Either your collecting DNA (and bank account) can accept this (the absolute consumption aspect of money spent) or not. If not, then try to find art that others like now and will continue to like even more that also tickles your aesthetic view of the art world too. At least then you have a chance of evening out over time. Otherwise, you have zero chance of changing the world...it will move as it does, and that may or may not be closer than today as far as seeing comic art as comic ART

Skottie...who knows. But not cheap today, is it? (So are you willing to throw a larger amount away never to return?)

Thanks, that's good stuff to keep in mind. Right now I'm just interested in work I want to see on my wall, I get the impression that buying for investment is kind of a crapshoot anyway, but maybe further down the line when I'm more knowledgeable I'll feel differently. Also if I look at something amazing that I got for cheap, that feels really satisfying, I don't know if I could enjoy work the same way if I knew I'd paid a lot for it. But I got really excited by the talk about SY's brush work, that kind of thing is really interesting to me.

2 hours ago, ESeffinga said:

I'm not 100% sure I know what you are asking for here.

If it's about the hobby of comic art collecting, and the variety of ways comic art is created and it's effect on pricing, the thread Blastaar posted is a good place to start. In general, read as much as you can of this board. Take every bit of art advice you read with a grain of salt, and apply it to your own experiences as it makes sense to do so. There are almost as many opinions on any topic in art collecting as there are collectors giving them.

If you are talking strictly about digging deeper into art appreciation and understanding the ways of artists create their art (i.e. the forms and effects of mark making, and it's dynamics and composition. Noticing things like the loss of immediacy from a pencil rough, to the stiffening effect that can come from tracing during inking. Or even comparing and contrasting art styles and their pros and cons, who's good at what, etc... there are a number of avenues to explore, but the biggest most general one is look at everything. Old, new, good and bad. Look at it all. Observation is important for any artist. Observation is equally important for any art collector. Some work will be obvious in what sets it apart. Other work will require more careful study. Not everything has to come to you at a glance. Is it just a bowl of oranges? Is there something else happening that needs further consideration? The world of comic art is vast (    V  A  S  T    ) but don't stop there. Look at other art. Look at illustration. Look at anything that you have the opportunity to. All throughout history as well. The very best teacher is experience. Drawing yourself is a great way to understand the work of others, BUT that's not what I mean. I mean, you can read all the writing by someone else in the world (especially me)  about a visual medium, but it is truly only the direct observation of it that will really yield the most concrete understanding of that work, and how it stacks up against all the other work you've seen. Become an art sponge & filter.

Check out CAF if you aren't on there, as it's an amazing resource. Really spend time there. Use it to go back to and look up artists work that you don't normally look at, Make friends with other OA collectors. Get yourself to any gatherings, con events or other opportunities to see original art. Seeing the colored published work is often distracting at best and misleading at worst. Look at the real deal in the flesh. You don't have to own it all to see it all.

Look at work you like and at work you don't like. Think about why that is. Look at the corrections. Look at the methods and materials the artists use. Pay attention to the little things. A smudge can be the sign of an amateur, or a great master, depending on how it is used (intelligently and with purpose, vs accidentally). The original work speaks for itself. Or at least it better.

There are some books that can help, if you want to read in between visits to every art museum at every city you visit, or Cons you are able to attend.

Understanding Comics by Scott McCloud is a great book, done in a simple and easy to follow way. It's more fun than a textbook, using the very medium he is discussing. Gary Martin and Steve Rude's Understanding Inking is a solid book as well, for understanding some of the nuts and bolts of how inking is not just a form of drawing outlines for a pencil piece, but the dynamic changes it can make to a single image. There are countless books on general art composition, theory and philosophy. I like Molly Bang's book How Pictures Work, if you want to get into a real understanding of composition. Beyond that there is so much available out there. Andrew Loomis had some incredibly solid books on drawing, etc. The more you understand these things, the deeper your understanding of what comic artists are doing as illustrators and storytellers, and where they fall short. The more info you absorb, the more you'll know what appeals to you and what doesn't. You may also discover the things that were "good enough" before, don't hold up as well and your appreciation of them may decline. On some level with most comic art, you have to find a balance between knowledge, sophistication and nostalgia, and take the good with the bad.

Not everyone in comics is going to be Mazzuuchelli (even Mazzuuchelli in the early days).

Sorry for the TL/DR for those who could give a fig about this stuff.

Thank you! That's really helpful (I was asking about the art appreciation, sorry that wasn't clear). I think I'm gonna start with the Scott McCloud book and go from there.

I'd like to to learn more about the aesthetic qualities of comic oa, things the artist is doing on the page, learn why I like the work I like and gain a better appreciation for what goes into the craft of comics. Does anyone know of any good resources for learning more about this, books or websites or anything else that have been helpful? What terms would I even search for to find more info about this?

11 hours ago, ESeffinga said:

Pretty sure Skottie is working with digital thumbnails printed as bluelines and then inked.

From what I gather, his digital pencils are generally loose guidelines, and then the piece is drawn in ink.
Which is to say if you are looking at older forms of comic art with separate pencils and inkers, you would be used to tight(ish) pencils from one guy, and then an inker that comes along and interprets the first guy's drawing to finish things out. Some take more liberties than others.

What Skottie is doing is often giving himself the rough composition as blueline, and then doing his actual drawing over that skeleton. I'm sure some pieces are sketched out a bit tighter than others, but he adds so much character in his work. it'd be dumb for him to draw a bunch of expressions or details twice. And he is also one of those creators whose linework is about spontaneity and attack. You can't fake that by tracing it, and he is brilliant at it in the way that Watterson is. So he waits until the inking stage to really flush the drawing out. I think of it like a blueline thumbnail under the ink drawing.

So, it's a bit different than a lot of artists work.

Others have been going this way for a while. And I don't mean blueline, I meant skipping tight pencilling. Ashley Wood for instance, has abandoned any penciling, and draws straight with pen and ink on paper in order to capture all his spontaneity, but he also means the pieces that don't look great get trashed. So his "original comic pages used to be made up of a series of panels. THe last few years he's become so good at doing his thing, he is doing whole pages without pencils or piecing them together. That is supremely ballsy and freaking hard.

 

Sort of off-topic, but I'm really interested in learning about things like this and building a more sophisticated appreciation for the art, what would I look for to learn more?

2 hours ago, pinupcartooncollector said:

Yes.  i know if you have a mat, you're okay, as it keeps the art from the glass, but I want to float some of my art so you can see all the editorial comment/marks.  Turns out you have to buy frame spacers online, and it's like $50/100 ft.

 

This site has shorter lengths for cheaper: https://www.metroframe.com/Products/PLastic-Spacers-for-Picture-Frames/

I just found their site the other day and am not sure if they're archival or not, though

On 1/10/2020 at 8:19 PM, glendgold said:

In fact -- here's a $395 Gene Colan piece which I had Steve Leialoha ink. You might note that Gene, as required by some internal law I would never question, gave Doom one leg. And the raven over Doom's shoulder?  One leg.

Doom does not require two legs, bipedalism is a crutch for beings lesser than Doom!

On 11/5/2019 at 9:29 AM, cbaileypacker said:

Moon Knight by Paul Davidson

 

 

 

 

Oh wow I was just reading this issue yesterday and wondering if the art had ever been for sale, nice!