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Disturbing Trend

Started by Foolkiller,

101 posts in this topic

greggy

greggy

Posted
Posted
Depends on if you need them before next month...

 

If I hand-deliver they're a lot cheaper... smile.gif

Dammit...I guess I need my odin and Bronty [!@#%^&^] present to watch out if you are pilfering my sweet DCs. When are you alledgedly coming again? smile.gif
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lighthouse

lighthouse

Posted
Posted
Depends on if you need them before next month...

 

If I hand-deliver they're a lot cheaper... smile.gif

Dammit...I guess I need my odin and Bronty [!@#%^&^] present to watch out if you are pilfering my sweet DCs. When are you alledgedly coming again? smile.gif

 

The Saturday after Thanksgiving... November 28th or so? Whatever that Saturday is. I'll be there before and after that, but that's when she is taking her test...

 

And I thought they were "sweet, sweet DC's"? They're only "sweet" now? insane.gif

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greggy

greggy

Posted
Posted
Depends on if you need them before next month...

 

If I hand-deliver they're a lot cheaper... smile.gif

Dammit...I guess I need my odin and Bronty [!@#%^&^] present to watch out if you are pilfering my sweet DCs. When are you alledgedly coming again? smile.gif

 

The Saturday after Thanksgiving... November 28th or so? Whatever that Saturday is. I'll be there before and after that, but that's when she is taking her test...

 

And I thought they were "sweet, sweet DC's"? They're only "sweet" now? insane.gif

Oh....they're really sweet! angel.gif
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Illiterati-migration

Illiterati-migration

Posted
Posted
Depends on if you need them before next month...

 

If I hand-deliver they're a lot cheaper... smile.gif

Dammit...I guess I need my odin and Bronty [!@#%^&^] present to watch out if you are pilfering my sweet DCs. When are you alledgedly coming again? smile.gif

 

The Saturday after Thanksgiving... November 28th or so? Whatever that Saturday is. I'll be there before and after that, but that's when she is taking her test...

 

And I thought they were "sweet, sweet DC's"? They're only "sweet" now? insane.gif

 

Greggy loves the iPod now.

 

specialproductimage.jpg

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BronzeBruce13

BronzeBruce13

Posted
Posted
Just to clarify my own position here... I do not believe that eye appeal and production quality should be factored into the grade except in extreme cases, whether that is extremely high grades or severe production flaws.

 

But I DO agree that eye appeal and production quality are significant factors in pricing.

 

The "right" 9.4 for one collector maybe the "wrong" 9.4 for another. And the pricing will reflect that. Sight Seen and Sight Unseen prices will, and should, be different...

 

I'm on board with that sentiment too 'House. For a professional grading service, I think grading "primarily" structure (except in extreme cases) and leaving the individual collector to value various "eye appeal" concerns to his/her particular tastes makes more sense. Eye appeal concerns are generally more visible than the defects themselves (in HG) unless there are DRA's (Distribution Related Additions: date stamps, arrival dates, distributor inking, etc.) that are hard to see on the FC... or on the BC. You might not be able to get an accurate feel for color saturation or gloss from a scan, but the centering of the book is pretty easy to see if the scan is not minuscule. Since the DRA's are not as visible I've always been in favor of them being listed on the label. That would further assist the buyer in determining all the EA factors before he/she factors everything in and decides if the book meets his/her needs and how much they are willing to pay for it.

 

The grading criteria may not be "known exactly"... but after 3 years+ of looking at many, many examples we've picked up quite a few revelations via interaction with each other here on the forum and asking CGC directly. Considering that... even still, there is debate among the most confident graders whether the CGC grade is on or off. Imagining a grading system that attempts to include eye appeal concerns just sounds like a much more difficult task that would lead to even more confusion and debate... at least at this point and time. I don't know about the rest of you, but my tastes have slowly evolved and changed as time has passed and I imagine others have too. I was, and still am more forgiving than most on the amount of miswrap I'll tolerate... providing its straight. Obviously, I hate them when they are angled. I also had little issue with production creases until it was brought to my attention most did not share that view. After considering it more, I agreed that I should be a bit more selective going forward, thus my EA preferences changed. The point here is that each person's eye appeal tolerances and preferences are at least slightly different from another's and/or are evolving in some cases. So, how does CGC create a system that pleases everyone? I have not studied Overstreet's criteria as much as some (FF/JC) but from what I gather from many threads on the subject, that criteria is not clear either and is evolving.

 

Maybe grading will continue to evolve and somewhere down the road someone is going to devise a better system that does include EA... but I don't think we're ready for it just yet... but keep trying James. Maybe someday we'll have the structure grade AND an EA rating beside it after the buying public reaches a point where they demand it?

 

We shall see.

 

BTW... Brian, Superb Thread Concept and insightful posts too! 5 Stars for you!

 

BTW2... Blazingbob brought up a great point too about dealer grading and how it may have been "right on" initially... until 5 people handled the book. It made me consider the idea FF mentioned to me about a "see through" archival safe plastic backer board that allows for scrutiny within a mylar while still protecting it and removing the need to handle the book as much. If I was a dealer with expensive HG raw books, I would cringe every time my gems were handled (don't go there). If such a product was developed affordably buyers could get to the point where the are serious about buying a book before the need to look inside. That may preserve a ton of HG books... and keep dealer cheecks from clenching whenever the book is handled.

893scratchchin-thumb.gif

 

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drbanner

drbanner

Posted
Posted
It made me consider the idea FF mentioned to me about a "see through" archival safe plastic backer board that allows for scrutiny within a mylar while still protecting it and removing the need to handle the book as much. If I was a dealer with expensive HG raw books, I would cringe every time my gems were handled (don't go there). If such a product was developed affordably buyers could get to the point where the are serious about buying a book before the need to look inside. That may preserve a ton of HG books... and keep dealer cheecks from clenching whenever the book is handled.

 

I mentioned sometime last year that I had seen clear/stiff backing boards, and I think JR asked me where I saw them. Unfortunately, the guy that had them has not been around the local shows lately, so I've been unable to look into it any more. They were between 1/16 and 1/8" thick, and crystal clear and looked real sharp (or maybe I thought they looked sharp b/c the book was a nice Schomburg Cap cover)!

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sfilosa

sfilosa

Posted
Posted

until 5 people handled the book. It made me consider the idea FF mentioned to me about a "see through" archival safe plastic backer board that allows for scrutiny within a mylar while still protecting it and removing the need to handle the book as much

 

While I don't sell at conventions (therefore I only handle my books), I found a great solution to this ten years ago.

 

I don't know if they still even make these but if you can get Golden-Age Turtle Shell, that's the trick.

 

A Silver-Age standard mylar fits perfectly in a GA turtle shell. Put you comic book in the mylar (with no backing board). Now put the mylar in the GA turtle shell. Now you can see the back cover, you have a hard plastic case protecting your book, PLUS, you have no backing board touching the comic book. If you want to put a backing board between the mylar and turle shell for add stability, fine, just pull it out to see the back cover (without ever touching the book). Nothing ever needs to be replaced.

 

Of course, CGC'ing the book also works.

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drbanner

drbanner

Posted
Posted
Anyone know if this GA turtle shell is like a Mylite2 ? I've seen this display technique before, except with Mylars in Mylites... 893scratchchin-thumb.gif - great idea...

 

No - the bottom and side edges of the turtle shell are like 1/8" square posts, and the front/back are 4-6 mil mylar sheets. The top is open. Think of the CGC slab with the top cut off...

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drbanner

drbanner

Posted
Posted

Turtle shells were a pretty big revolution in comic book preservation and supplies when they were introduced (in the early to mid-90's?). They were (are?) available for gold, silver, and I assume modern and are really nice because of the rigid edges. How many books have we all seen with that telling creasing/wear along the spine from being stuffed into a too-tight box (no comments from the peanut gallery please!)?

 

The problem, IMHO, was that books didn't fit snug enough in them, so could be battered around a bit. The solution above, putting the book in another bag first, helps solve that...but then you're getting to the point of 1, 2, 3 boards/bags/shells to store your books.

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sfilosa

sfilosa

Posted
Posted

The problem, IMHO, was that books didn't fit snug enough in them, so could be battered around a bit. The solution above, putting the book in another bag first, helps solve that...but then you're getting to the point of 1, 2, 3 boards/bags/shells to store your books.

 

Well, basically it is a mylar and a turtle shell (which is exactly what CGC does). Only mylar touches the book and the Turtle Shell protects the book.

 

And as I said, the standard mylars fit perfectly (no movemnet what so ever).

 

I agree Bob, that it adds weight. For me, it works great because I have gone years without touching my books (they are in a safe) and I have never had to worry about the backing board touching the books (and leaving a transfer stain). You really don't even need backing boards, because even though Turtle Shells can bend, I'm not sure if they could bend enough to actually crease a book (but I haven't tried).

 

Obviously, this is not something for every $50 book, but if you have $500 books that aren't CGC'd, it might make some sense.

 

 

 

 

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Darthdiesel

Darthdiesel

Posted
Posted
Of course that works on my more expensive books, it also adds a lot weight, adds to the number of boxes I have to store and I love my back thank you.

 

Maybe you should get together with hammer and work out so you could sling those longboxes over your shoulder with the same ease that you do with your comic book hi-grade groupies at shows? insane.gif

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dam60

dam60

Posted
Posted
Of course that works on my more expensive books, it also adds a lot weight, adds to the number of boxes I have to store and I love my back thank you.

 

Lift with your legs Bob, lift with the legs cloud9.gif

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