London comicon report (October 5th)

[Thegoldenage]

I have never found Harley to be reasonably priced on anything. Whenever I have seen him at shows his prices are very high in most cases over guide. This includes lower grade "run" books that have no valid reason to be priced over guide. Of course, what one person thinks is overpriced another person might think is a bargain.

[Thegoldenage]

How many own a copy, or how many total copies are out there and folks don't know it is in their attic or basement? I know of 10 copies in my home state and none of them are graded. I would not at all be surprised if there are 400-500 total copies still extant.

 

 

[Mushroom]

He tirelessly travels the world, even to Australia, to get his comics to everyone who wants them,

 

What do you mean "even to Australia"? Firstly...you are starting to make Harley sound like Chuck and that doesn't do anybody any favours. Secondly....bringing books to Australia (GA and SA), would be of little value to Harley due to the prices he charges. There is a not a large market here but those that do collect are very savvy around pricing and quality and do know how to use the internet.

 

Ask Blowout what he saw at an Australian comic con and he will say a few SA lower grades and a heap of moderns.

 

Moderns here get snapped up for rediculous prices......slabbed Bat #608 9.6 regular $80- ($65 US).

[Galactus]

Well you can add another copy to the tally of how many Action Comics #1's there are in the U.K.. I bought my copy over 20 years ago, and kept it in my collection up until i recently traded it in (as well as other items) to Comicana, who managed to locate a lovely looking fn- copy. I am also aware of 2 other individuals in this country that have in their collection unrestored, uncertified, medium to low grade copies.

 

Answering a previous point raised as regards to grading standards in this country. I find this to be a point of contention, as obviously grading is a very subjective matter. Personally i have dealt with most if not all of the main dealers in England and find that a few do stick out as being ahead of the rest.

 

Andy Coleman at Goldust is highly recommended, but i have had a better overall experience with John Skoulides at Comicana, whom i find to be a very tight consistent grader. Given than anybody can have an off day when grading, i find that looking at consistency is another key equation when evaluating an individuals ability to grade .

 

 

[EwanUK]

Wow - this is more like it - sorry to hijack the boards from our American friends but it's nice to see some Brits engaging in some decent debate. (But hey we've supplied all the best artists and writers to them in the last 20 years).

 

Here are some more new points / replies...

 

1. Ian - your massive collection of DCs - what an entertaining and interesting thread that was. Well done mate! And all collected in the UK too! I've always been a DC fan too (they're more "BBC" than Marvel's "ITV" I always think!) - but the more obscure the better. You ought to contact Dez Skinn and tell him to cover your search in CI - might liven up that now somewhat dreary, but fondly held, mag...

 

2. Negative opinions - no way chaps! I love UK fandom! But I want UK fandom to get more professional. It's too set in its ways... that smug, sneering "we know best" attitude that's so prevalent among the old skool dealers and publishers...

 

Your average dealer is so grudging and hard-done-by... "oh, no-one is intersted in my tatty, pence stamped over-priced rubbish... marts aren't what they used to be etc, etc..."

 

Well tough! Try starting with a little basic customer service skills (for goodness sake man, acknowledge your customers!), have a bath, and source some clean high grade stock - AND YOU'LL MAKE REAL MONEY!!

 

Appeal to my demographic! I WILL pay over the odds on high grade stock if you handle me well!

 

3. UKCAKs - hey, I was in my teens & early twenties then - went between 1986 and 1993. They were great fun! Met Moore, Kirby, Miller, Tharg and many more of the big boys.

 

I ask you, who did I see at the recent London "Comics Festival"....? The latest stars from the US?

 

NO! I saw some middle-aged women selling Beano fleeces... I didn't even get a free bag of leaflets! Pah!

 

4. UK Dealers wake up! Ebay is a billion times better now than any comic mart. To compete, you need to get a lot smarter - develop some proper client relationships. Stop selling junk!

 

5. If you are going to run shops - here's the rules: STOP stacking up piles of dirty 2000ads everywhere. STOP employing tedious "alternative types". STOP arranging your comics in manners that require me to a) stoop b) kneel c) jump AND PLEASE STOP selling toys! (Don't you know they're for kids!)

 

6. EMBRACE CGC!! A high grade golden age comic is a thing of beauty - and I want to preserve both IT and it's DESIGNATED GRADE! I'm hardly going risk damaging a ten grand comic am I?

 

Erm... I know I can't read it if it's slabbed, I spotted that... BUT that's what reprints are for!!!!

 

 

And etc...!

 

 

 

[goldust40]

Welcome to the boards, Richard. Your first ever post, and it's a dig at SOUTHERNERS. As if our American friends could possibly relate to this North/South concept. Oh wait a minute, maybe they could.............

 

Anyway, if anyone in mainland Europe has a spare 1,000 Euros, I suggest you go to the SD Comicon. It's an incredible, if in-your-face event. Then check those prices.

[Ian_Levine]

Thanks for the nice comments. I think I'd rather keep a lower profile though. I've been high profile enough in other areas. My DC collection is my private hobby rather than a public career.

 

I have to agree with another point you made, The B.O. at the UK fairs is unbearable, especially when you're wedged in trying to go through boxes between two others. Maybe these guys purposely don't bathe just so other collectors will give them a wide berth.

There's one shop in the East End of London (no names mentioned), where the guy's odour nearly forced me to leave without buying the comics he had that I needed.

[comicmankev]

WOW, well said again Ewan, maybe they should start a UK section so we can do some internal trading!

 

As for what you said about UK dealers and marts, thats sooooo true!

 

We are not trying to stop you from making money, but bump the image up a bit. Our man from Goldust had some good words too, but I must say, that it really makes no effect on the price just because we are in the UK? I get bargains all over the place then flip them on Ebay. The prices in the UK on 'nice' stuff is sky high, there is NO reason to charge it (unless of course you get regular sales at that price, which I'm sure is not the case?).

 

I would also like to stress that I have increasingly noticed that a lot of Mart atendees are rude! Theres still plenty of good ones, and I'm sure it's the same in the US in some areas. But a little chitchat/discussion about what your selling wouldnt go a miss. Goldust is great for a chat, but some of the others...

 

We should take a stand! I mean literally, take a stand at a mart and show some real stuff and how it should be displayed/sold. I wouldnt expect to sell a lot on the first try, but 'Rome wasnt built in a day'! I'm sure this can be turned around from the comicbook guy in the Simpsons to how it should be.

 

Main things for UK dealers to aim for:

 

1) Dress nice & wash (and don't forget the deo), maybe a haircut?!

 

2) Grade correctly - jus cos its in a bag doesnt mean it's NM.

 

3) Don't put a 1000% on it just cos it's encapsulated.

 

4) display nicely - show of ALL the nice stuff and have the rest alphabetised CORRECTLY, with proper dividers, not just bits of cardboard that highlight wher 'Spiderman' and 'X-men' are!

 

5) Chat with people - everyone knows courteousness comes before ALL. A friend telling a friend what a good guy it was at the Mart goes a LONG LONG way.

 

6) Don't smoke behind the table of a Mart.

 

7) Rotate your stock, and display good items! Whether you sell it or not doesnt matter, imagine what custom it would bring in if you had an Action #1 on display! (with proper security )

 

To summerise. The customer is ALWAYS right. If they don't agree with your grading, deal with it, money back, apologies, whatever it takes. You lose more by being rude? And beeing helpful, courteous, and giving a good deal is 1000% better than a '50% off everything sale' .

 

Again, I would like to apologise if you feel I have shown a generalisation, there are the good ones out there. Nobody has mentioned the guys at Chaos City who are great, and not a bad deal either (a bit overpriced on CGC stuff though?) Also H Markos who I know many on the boards has dealt with.

[EwanUK]

Ian, no worries - I respect your desire to remain a great unknown (It's something I've accomplished with amazing success for many years...)

 

Kev, agree on all points - have visited Chaos City in St Albans many times. A good shop and friendly staff. I've also bought from, and sold to, Harry Markos too - great chap.

 

My favourite every UK shop was the original Odessey (or was it Oddesey?) in Leeds which opened in 1986 but has long since become another faceless toy shop in the FP Empire. I remember buying Dark Knight Returns, Watchmen, Swamp Thing... oh those halycon days - and still having change from a fiver for my bus fare home...)

 

I also think it's great idea for us Brits to have our own area on these boards. What does everyone else think? We could even extend it to the other Europeans frequenting these boards?

 

It'd certainly raise the intelllectual standard a notch or two!

 

[herc2000]

Just thought you would like to know, Chaos city no longer deal at the conventions. The silverage comics they used to have and bring to the shows belong to Nick Beckett, they were never Chao's comics. He now sells his comics through Comicana, which go to all the London shows. Harry Markos is a nice guy, but only good for Hulk 102's .

[Joanna]

 

It'd certainly raise the intelllectual standard a notch or two!

 

 

Hey! Just cuz y'all talk pertier than us, an sound all fancy, don't mean we ain't got no learnin'! Why, my maw done taught me cyphers when I wuz... waitaminute, I don't know no cyphers. Okay, take out the 3rd 'l' in intelllectual and you win.

 

-- Joanna-Mae

 

p.s. why does everyone hate pence copies?

[comicmankev]

Oh yeah, I forgot nick left!

 

And Harry is also good for some Origns too!

[comicmankev]

p.s. why does everyone hate pence copies?

 

Long debated issue! It's because some people think that the comic is'nt (what we call them in the UK) and 'American comicbook'.

 

Total rubish to me, I never have a problem shifting my pence copies!

[chromium]

Please stop talking about setting up a new board for UK collectors...next thing you know the Canadians will want one too....and then we'll really be in trouble

[Joanna]

Please stop talking about setting up a new board for UK collectors...next thing you know the Canadians will want one too....and then we'll really be in trouble

 

Don't the Canadians already have this board and the rest of us are just visitors?

[EwanUK]

PENCE

Joanna, it's not the pence copies per se - but those blessed UK pence STAMPS plastered across the covers. These signify only one thing: the comic was distributed to some coastal back-water in the mid 60s and left out in the rain.

 

It was then bought by some degenerate who used it to line his pigeon loft for twenty years... until spotted by some canny dealer, who realising its pedigree, wiped it down with a wet cloth, bagged it in mylar, graded it as a "VFN minus" and sold it for £300 to some unsuspecting dimbo at the last London mart.

 

CANADIANS

Yes, that could indeed be a potential down-side - but if we Brits can extend our invite to the French - then I think you guys can welcome your Northern Cousins.

 

COMICANA

Yes, great shop - but why all the colour photo copies of rare golden age comics stuck to the bargain boxes? When I first walked in I thought I'd entered Edgar Church's bedroom.

And you have to be very flexible.

 

[Joanna]

Thanks to all for the pence explanations.

 

As for Canadians, they have a reputation for being good, kind people. What's not to like?

 

-- Joanna

[Darthdiesel]

And Harry is also good for some Origns too!

 

Harry Markos, ebay ID: Markosia, CGC Forum ID: spartacus

 

A great guy and stand up character. New father as well to a beautiful baby girl. Is working on writing his own comic (with that dude who used to draw Lobo in the 90s) and also a mystery murder novel.

 

He has gotten rid of most of his modern stock, holding onto a few Silver and Bronze keys. talking about a new hot book out in the UK..I'm actually gonna see it for the first time as he won a copy here in the US...

 

If I ever am in Hertsfordshire, I'm dropping by his place...

[goldust40]

Hi Ewan,

You make a few interesting points and your posts are funny but you're simply generalizing too much. Anybody reading your posts will probably conjure up this bizarre vision of an English comic mart which consists of "smug, sneering" Dickensian, filth- encrusted caricatures trying to sell piles of remaindered tat (that they themselves refer to as "rubbish") whilst complaining that marts "ain't what they used to be" (I get this mantra only from buyers- dealers have NEVER had it so good).

I can't vouch for cleanliness of other dealers and their stock (or their social skills). I'll have to remain neutral there, as I don't know everyone, by any means. However if they were really as misshapen and hopeless as is implied, they'd be out of business by now. Oh all right there are one or two stinkers. Who are grudging (?)

If ebay is a billion times better than comic marts then the inherent question must be WHY do these lost and degenerate souls continue? Ebay is great but it has similar problems to any marketplace, online or otherwise. I do agree that acknowledging customers is crucial. IN ANY BUSINESS. Nevertheless, there's a kernel of truth there. And competing with ebay is tough, even for U.S. dealers.

UKCACs were basically glorified comic marts with a few panels (usually Bob Kanigher and Brian Bolland), an iffy costume parade, a union bar, LESS dealers and ONE, or maybe even TWO major U.S. guests (but usually one. one year we had John Buscema, the following year his brother Sal came, and NO-ONE else). Remove thy rose- tinted specs!

Not that I wish to laud the competition but London comic shops have moved on since the 1970s. I really don't see "dirty piles of 2000 ADs" and inaccessibly arranged stock in most stores. As for toys, surely you know that most London shops (I can't speak for elsewhere in the U.K., but it can't be that different) would be out of business were it not for such merchandise. It's an economic fact that comic shops can't survive on new comics alone. And as for comic staff being "alternative types" - I just can't see a comic shop assistant in a suit and tie.

Well that's enough rhetoric. I didn't really understand what you meant about embracing CGC. No-one in their right minds would ever want to harm a £10,000 comic, raw or otherwise. And you can preserve rare and expensive comics in Mylars, which did just fine on an exclusive level until 3 years ago when CGC provided their (expensive) alternative. Not that I'm knocking CGC - I think that their effect has been far more positive than negative, at least in terms of grading standards, and (obviously) buying online. But if all English dealers embrace CGC, it'll lead to price rises. Plus one of the few things I pride myself on this business is my grading. I'll be redundant if all comics get CGC'd.

 

[comicmankev]

spartacus aye Good job we only said good things about him then