CBS MarketWatch: Collectibles Are "The Stupid Investment Of The Week"

[duncan36]

Personally speaking, I like the SNES and forward for any potential spec activity. The Ataris are older, but I still feel that the SNES marked the beginning of the current Video Game Age.

 

I would agree with this for one simple reason: SNES (and newer) consoles are still readily available, and work with current TV sets. Older game systems are cool, but finding them is tougher, and getting them to work on today's televisions is tougher still.

 

The difference between older videogame systems and cartridges and older comic books is, you can always read the comic... I'm not sure just owning the cartridge for "Pitfall" is going to appeal to a wide audience... if you can't experience most of the 'magic' that made you love it in your youth, will you still spend more than a couple of bucks on it?

 

I'm not up on the SNES prices though I do know that the Final Fantasy games, etc go for good money.

It sounds like JC and you are implying that 2600 games arent sought after or highly collectible, I can assure you this is not the case. Heres a listing of fufilled auctions of 2600 games from several years back.

 

http://www.geocities.com/vvge2001/RarityLists/auction.txt

 

 

 

[joe_collector]

It sounds like JC and you are implying that 2600 games arent sought after or highly collectible

 

Not at all, but I was just outlining where I'd be buying if I were speculating in that area. It was more related to return-on-investment.

[Foolkiller]

i guess my roommate in college who went digging through boxes every saturday for old unused atari and other video games was smarter than I was... he was doing it 6 years ago...

 

but then again, he bought a bunch of old game systems, broke the games out of the boxes and started playing them...

[14 of spades]

The difference between older videogame systems and cartridges and older comic books is, you can always read the comic... I'm not sure just owning the cartridge for "Pitfall" is going to appeal to a wide audience... if you can't experience most of the 'magic' that made you love it in your youth, will you still spend more than a couple of bucks on it?

 

this can be quite easily refuted...

 

if you look at auctions for the Transformer "Optimus Prime" - you'll generally find 3 tiers where it will sell and it's approximate price (ballpark - since I don't track this):

 

1. The Toy Itself ($75)

2. Mint in Box ($250)

3. Mint in Sealed Box ($1000)

 

people in their 20s can finally buy the toy they always wanted as a child. since they can afford it, they want the best, most perfect example of the toy they can buy. as such, they buy MISB (mint in sealed box) and happily pay $1000 for it. they will not play with the toy, but instead, frame it as an emblem of fulfillment and requitement.

 

it's not about playing donkey kong - it's about having a mint donkey kong cartridge - because all throughout elementary school - you always wanted that game, and now you can finally own it...

[Aman619]

hyuhhh... imagine the simple-minded insufficiently_thoughtful_persons who'd ever do that!!

[Aman619]

good point..sound logic doesnt really enter collecting all the time.

 

Do 78 collectors collect them BECAUSE they are ALREADY valuable? Or are they music lovers who own the songs on playable media already and just like owning the original pressings? Cause I dont see a real equilavence between collecting old music and old games: old music doesnt ever get outdated..whereas many of the early games were upgraded with technological advances so that the earliest versions are merely a crude curiousity. The songs are still what they ever were. Same with comic books...and if you wanna say that earlier comics characters and GA stories in particular have been updated to a degree that old comics are sillly and unreadable (like the earliest games are unplayable or unenjoyable)...I see that point...but....

 

I trying not to condemn someone elses collectible (since they are all inherently valueless...)

But I still dont get it. Just not my thing, huh?

[COI]

I can see the nostalgic value of packaged video games. I didn't get much when I was a kid, and until I started buying things for myself, I didn't get much of anything. But I would always look at toy catalogues and in toy stores and see these games that I wanted. So in that way, the whole childhood fullfilment thing is linked with the packages themselves. I DID get to play the games, but there is no denying the power of the packages.

[joe_collector]

II DID get to play the games, but there is no denying the power of the packages.

 

No joke, and since this thread started, I've been scanning a few sealed, Genesis game auctions...

[PovertyRow]

Almost forgot.....those on this forum who predict that video games are the collectable of the future are extremely insightful....early intellivision, Commodore C64, Sega etc may just be the way to go. They meet all the criteria that has fueled collecting markets in the past.

 

Not my cup of tea but I will certainly be watching with interest.

 

Yes...I have brought them up a few times here as the "next hot collectible" but there is also something many don't know unless they are really into the games. They should be percieved in two distinct ways: as unopened (Mint in however they were packaged) and as opened. The opened ones will naturally fetch less than the unposned Mint ones. BUT...and this is a big but...back in the day (as we Codgers like to say) there were developed "vampire" programs. These programs were designed to "suck" the code from a ROM (Read Only Memory) chip, upon which these games are copied. Basicaly, you opened the cartridge, removed the ROM chip, put it on a board that was interfaced to your computer, and downloaded the game. Then, you put a fresh PROM in and dumped the game to it. A PROM is a PROGRAMMABLE Read Only Memory chip. Then, all you have to do is take a compatible game cartridge, open it up, remove the ROM chip and put in the PROM chip. You now have an identical copy of the game to play.

 

Amoung the MINT collectors, these chips are quite popular, as it allows them to play the game without breaking open their Mint package. And the think is, since it is basically a computer program, there is absolutely no difference between it and the original, unlike comic books where CD-ROM repros or reprint books just do not feel the same.

[THE_BEYONDER]

Almost forgot.....those on this forum who predict that video games are the collectable of the future are extremely insightful....early intellivision, Commodore C64, Sega etc may just be the way to go. They meet all the criteria that has fueled collecting markets in the past.

 

Not my cup of tea but I will certainly be watching with interest.

 

Yes...I have brought them up a few times here as the "next hot collectible" but there is also something many don't know unless they are really into the games. They should be percieved in two distinct ways: as unopened (Mint in however they were packaged) and as opened. The opened ones will naturally fetch less than the unposned Mint ones. BUT...and this is a big but...back in the day (as we Codgers like to say) there were developed "vampire" programs. These programs were designed to "suck" the code from a ROM (Read Only Memory) chip, upon which these games are copied. Basicaly, you opened the cartridge, removed the ROM chip, put it on a board that was interfaced to your computer, and downloaded the game. Then, you put a fresh PROM in and dumped the game to it. A PROM is a PROGRAMMABLE Read Only Memory chip. Then, all you have to do is take a compatible game cartridge, open it up, remove the ROM chip and put in the PROM chip. You now have an identical copy of the game to play.

 

Amoung the MINT collectors, these chips are quite popular, as it allows them to play the game without breaking open their Mint package. And the think is, since it is basically a computer program, there is absolutely no difference between it and the original, unlike comic books where CD-ROM repros or reprint books just do not feel the same.

 

Truly insightful.....

[PovertyRow]

Truly insightful.....

 

Why, a most sincere Thank You!

[THE_BEYONDER]

Why, a most sincere Thank You!

 

You are most certainly welcome.

[FlyingDonut]

Get a room.

[Freiherr]

It is funny that I just had a conversation about investments with my girlfriend over the phone and collectables came up.

 

The first thing I think about is how many things are collected and how many people i my life are collectors.

 

When I was a kid, my grandfather got me into stamp collecting. He had collected stamps as a kid and refreshed his own enjoyment of the hobby by getting me involved. We dug deep into the hobby like going to local shows and keeping our collections current every week. I watched the market boom and bottom out 3 times since then.

 

My girlfriends grandmother collects all kinds of antiques from cars to dolls. One friend collects old firearms, another civil war items, and yet another friend collects old video games (from Atari to coin-ops). There are more acquaintances of mine that collect something than not.

 

Is collecting these items a wise investment?

 

For the true collector, probably not. A true collector is not looking for an investment so there is not even a debate. However, the reality is that most collectors are concerned somewhat with what they have invested so there is some consideration.

 

I believe that a smart collector will never lose over time. Nothing is certain, but one could always minimize any potential loss. I have dabbed into many things and here are the rules I go by.

 

1. Collectables go in cycles. Like the stock market, you buy when they are low and sell when they are high (if that is where your interests are).

2. If someone is already making money, chances are it is too late for you to do so as well.

3. Stay away from “fads” (like those bean animals). Anything that jumps immediately in value will more than likely drop just as fast.

4. As long as the item or medium still exist so will a market (but see rule #1).

5. Anything with historical significance (as my friends civil war items) will always be in demand, but will only increase in value as its history becomes more obscure.

6. Never buy anywhere near the top going price if you are looking for an investment.

 

In my opinion, when done with intelligence (and with realistic expectations), collectables can be more profitable for the average person. Real estate and the Stocks can obviously pay off big, but only if you already have the money and can risk the loss.

 

Personally, I usually never buy any collectable with investment in mind. What few items I have profited from were either by mistake or I got for an insanely cheap price.

 

Example.

 

A friend and I stop by a store that sold items that were marked of by insurance companies. Not sure how it worked, but I think they got items from other stores that had written the stuff off as damaged for some reason and in return the this store bought those products from the insurance company. Usually there wasn’t any real damage to the items and my guess was that most of the stuff was passed off as damaged because it was old stock

 

We were there for cheap electronics, but came across a shelf full of Transformer toys (still in the boxes with no damage) for $5 a piece. This was in 1992 I think and there wasn’t really a market for them. I bought 6 of them knowing what a huge hit they were and knowing full well that someone would want them in the future. There was no doubting this considering the huge impact these toys made in their time. I took them home, tossed them in a box and forgot about them.

 

What I didn't know was how much they would go for (though positive more than $5 a piece). In 2000 discovered Ebay and sold every one I had for $300 or more. Poor investment? I think not. I bet many real estate and stock players would like to claim such a percentage on their investments in such a short period of time.

 

I don’t necessarily disagree with the statements, but I think it is more targeted to the inexperienced or ignorant collector (investor). Even though even the smartest and most seasoned collector can still make mistakes, I fail to see them losing money in the long run if they buy with intelligence and realistic expectations.

[PovertyRow]

Get a room.

 

Screw you hippie!

[THE_BEYONDER]

Get a room.

 

Screw you hippie!

 

[PovertyRow]

Get a room.

 

Screw you hippie!

 

 

I don't know how to reply to "352.gif"!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Bronty]

Alright, as someone who has been selling off comics to build a factory sealed video game collection, I feel like I have to weigh in on all this video game talk

 

My sense is that the current and future generations will not only be less interested in reading and collecting comics, but they will be less interested in collecting in general.

 

Gene, this I could not disagree with more. A huge part of collecting is about nostalgia. Nostalgia is all about future shock. The rapid change of the environment around us makes us remember fondly the obsolete things from our childhood. The pace of technology is only increasing daily. I see there being more people drawn to collecting, not less.

[PovertyRow]

Gene, this I could not disagree with more. A huge part of collecting is about nostalgia. Nostalgia is all about future shock. The rapid change of the environment around us makes us remember fondly the obsolete things from our childhood. The pace of technology is only increasing daily. I see there being more people drawn to collecting, not less.

 

Makes sense to me! Nostalgia is not going to go away anytime soon. Just re-manifest itself.

[Bronty]

Personally speaking, I like the SNES and forward for any potential spec activity. The Ataris are older, but I still feel that the SNES marked the beginning of the current Video Game Age.

 

This is an insightful comment. Some game systems are TOO early/primitive to really be collectible, in my opinion. Atari is somewhat collectible, but I see the NES (the original Nintendo, just before the Super Nintendo or SNES that Joe is referring to) as the Marvel Silver Age of video games, so to speak. There are a number of reasons why I see it evolving as the premier system in terms of collectibility:

 

1) Advanced enough gameplay that the games are still fun today

2) It was the best selling system of all time - EVERYBODY had one or knew someone that had one. Everyone played our age played it, everybody remembers it.

3) The games are complex enough that some of them that took days and days and days to finish - as I said once before on these boards there are a lot of memories tied up in something you spent 200 or 300 hours on when you were 12 years old

4) There is that elusive mix of rarity and availability of high grade copies that will make the mint freaks happy and fuel price increases. Factory sealed copies are available and common on some titles while extremely (and I mean EXTREMELY) scarce on others. Low grades are generally plentiful, giving low grade collectors an option.

5) Completing a sealed set of all 800 titles would be a herculean task but it's within the realm of possiblity.

6) Most of today's big video game franchises have their roots in the NES. Consider the following franchises - all of them started on the NES.

a) Legend of zelda series

b) Final fantasy series

c) Mega Man series

d) Ninja Gaiden series

e) Contra series

f) Gradius series

g) Super Mario series

h) Metroid series

i) Metal Gear series

...etc etc etc........

7) Many software publishers' first console games were for the NES. Capcom, Taito, Bandai, Square/ Enix, Rare... all developed their first console games for the NES, I believe. And yes, many people do collect by publisher.

 

Atari games, by comparison, have little or no link to modern games due to the limitations of the hardware. And then there is the warehouse.... what you all may or may not realize is that when Atari went down, it went down HARD!!! There were MILLIONS of unsold SEALED cartridges left in inventory when the company went belly up. There's a warehouse out in the desert (an old mine, no joke) with two MILLION sealed Atari games in it, to this day!!!!!! I forgot the name of the website/dealer. Certain atari titles are so common sealed it's scary. Anyway, while many titles are rare/non-existent sealed, I'd be VERY skittish about putting money into Atari games without knowing EXACTLY what was in that warehouse. They are also easier to reseal. NES on the other hand was successful and had a high sell through of inventory, leaving WAY less potential for significant warehouse finds. Nintendo also had a no returns policy, thus no sealed warehouse returns. But as far as I'm concerned the key point is that so many video series started on NES... you'd be surprised at the number of today's "hot new" games that are remakes, sequels, etc of older games. That will provide a historical link for future collectors, and lead to more than just my generation being interested in them, in my opinion. This is not the case with atari. I see the atari market as limited to one generation, more or less. With the NES on the other hand, I can very much see a kid whose favorite game is Mega Man #17 (yes, there are that many in just 15 years) being fascinated with the idea of seeing or owning a sealed #1. Much like the comic collector whose first comic is Spiderman #211 wants to own that 9.4 AF #15...

 

Dan

 

NOTE I have some doubles for sale (factory sealed, naturally) if anyone wants in on the ground floor! No junk - all solid titles. $50 - $500. PM me for details. I can also put together "investment lots" for interested parties.