HooDeeDoo vs Motor City Comics

[blazingbob]

Boy that was fast and I'm sure we will have more verbal sword play at future shows.

 

And there in lies the problem as a dealer.

 

How much is enough? How would you, the buying public like dealers to communicate that you (not just you Andy but all of you out there) are getting enough? I have said and have had it said to me by other dealers. I am not in business to make you money. And a dealer buying from me is buying to make money off me. I rarely get 25 - 35% off high grade books from other dealers. If you are getting 25-35% than you are a better buyer than me. You (Andy) are not buying my VG+ to Fine copies. You are buying my VF or better copies, books that I am not buying for 25% of guide. When I am giving someone a good deal (In my eyes anyway) and they keep asking, I wonder why do they keep pushing for more? If the show is bad why do they need to make it worse by grinding me down even further. I have no problems with our dealings and I have communicated directly that enough is enough.

 

By the way the 2nd quote was not directed your way at all.

 

 

[fantastic_four]

Ebay - Charges to sell, item doesn't always sell, they own paypal which also charges fees to complete the transaction. Ebay is a great company, they have taken the IRS and tax system model to a new level.

 

Did you have a point with that with regards to people choosing to sell via E-Bay instead of selling to a dealer?

 

 

Comiclink - Is a dealer

 

Yes and no. Anybody can list their comics on Josh's site using his new software...can we all list our comics on your site, too, Bob?

 

 

Almost all collectors are this board are dealers in disguise. Buying and selling is what dealers do, many of you do the same, therefore you are "dealers".

 

Now, if I can only find one of those "collectors".

 

It's more accurate to use more than just the terms "dealer" and "collector". Here are the terms I use:

 

Dealer -- someone who sells comics. Example = Comgeek or BlazingBob

Collecting Dealer -- a dealer who both sells comics and also maintains a personal collection. Example = BlazingBob but not Comgeek (or so I've heard, who knows, maybe he does collect something)

Dealing Collector -- a person who primarily collects comics but does a small amount of flipping or selling of the comics they've upgraded from. A "dealing collector" probably doesn't have a business license, and they probably don't report what they earn on their taxes. They primarily look at selling as something they do to enhance comics as a hobby and have more invested in their personal collection than in their for-sale inventory. Example = most people in this forum.

Collector -- a person who buys comics but may or may not ever sell them.

The collector who never acts as a dealer will get rarer and rarer thanks to the Internet allowing us to reach other collectors in a truly revolutionary way.

[fantastic_four]

[JiveTurkeyMoFo]

Almost all collectors are this board are dealers in disguise. Buying and selling is what dealers do, many of you do the same, therefore you are "dealers".

 

You're right, but I don't think I ever met a high grade collector who didn't fit this definition to some degree.

 

If you want a true collector, look for the guy showing you his coin slot while rummaging through the dollar bin, scouring for G/VG copies of Tales of Suspense # 97.

[blazingbob]

Ebay is a place where you become a "dealer" to sell your book.

[fantastic_four]

Doesn't the IRS have financial guidelines for when the buying and selling of items crosses the line from hobby to a business? Once you've crossed that line, you're a dealer, but I wouldn't call anybody who slaps something up on ebay a dealer.

[blazingbob]

Three out of those four definitions had the word dealer in them. Splitting hairs but if you are selling books to "make money to buy more books" you are a dealer.

 

I sell books to buy more books, I am a dealer.

 

There now repeat after me people, I sell books to buy more books. I AM A DEALER.

 

Bob

 

 

[joe_collector]

Ebay is a place where you become a "dealer" to sell your book.

 

Correction, EBay is a place where I SHOULD become a "dealer" to sell off my dupes.

[g-man]

Doesn't the IRS have financial guidelines for when the buying and selling of items crosses the line from hobby to a business? Once you've crossed that line, you're a dealer, but I wouldn't call anybody who slaps something up on ebay a dealer.

 

this is good...then i am still a collector. or at least i used to be.

[goldust40]

 

[/quote

 

What ever happened to the Anglo-American alliance??

 

 

It's about the only alliance the U.K. has left these days. All joking aside, it's as strong as ever. U.S. dealers have (obviously) greater access to higher grade unstamped cents copies, and although the relationship is one way as long as there are dealers who grade carefully such as yourself and the Blazing One (don't get a big head from this unsolicited praise!) it'll continue for the foreseeable future.

 

As for Harley, he's been coming to England twice a year for about a decade now, even before the demand for quality books took hold. And no, I don't think anyone else has the temperament to keep making those exhaustive transatlantic trips. That bloke is completely unflappable (i.e. in control).

[joe_collector]

this is good...then i am still a collector. or at least i used to be.

 

... in a past life.

[fantastic_four]

Three out of those four definitions had the word dealer in them. Splitting hairs but if you are selling books to "make money to buy more books" you are a dealer.

 

I sell books to buy more books, I am a dealer.

 

There now repeat after me people, I sell books to buy more books. I AM A DEALER.

 

Since you're a collecting dealer, I really don't understand why you'd argue to blur the lines between you and us. I trust collecting dealers more than I trust dealing collectors because they've got more experience at what they're doing. I'm not sure how good the grading or selling policies on most people on ebay or these forums are, but I know you've got a lot of experience with both of those...are you saying it doesn't matter who you buy from, that a dealer is a dealer? You're effectively arguing that there's no value in choosing to buy from someone like yourself!

[JiveTurkeyMoFo]

There now repeat after me people, I sell books to buy more books. I AM A DEALER.

 

From my local DA meeting:

 

Hello. My name is George, and I am a dealer. I haven't flipped a book in three hours.

 

 

[ArAich]

Hi, my name is Rick. ...and I'm a dealer...

[deathlok]

Almost all collectors are this board are dealers in disguise. Buying and selling is what dealers do, many of you do the same, therefore you are "dealers".

 

WRONG.

 

A dealer is someone who makes a living from selling comic books. That is the distinction. Most of here do not make a living from selling comic books, we sell to reinvest in other comic books.

[g-man]

this is good...then i am still a collector. or at least i used to be.

 

... in a past life.

 

well at one point i had over 7K books but did several shows, sold a bunch to Teddy and have been buyin/sellin over the past few years as a hobby. "Back in the day" I could find many bargains at shows and books selling at guide or less for nm or better. Not 2 much anymore. Many times the books are cherry picked long b4 the show opens by other dealers who then send them to FLA and make some nice coin. Not that there is anything wrong with that.........Now of course I have limited experience setting up or going to shows (boston,NY,philly) but when a collector shows up and is selling his goods, the sharks come a callin.

[drbanner]

There now repeat after me people, I sell books to buy more books. I AM A DEALER.

 

From my local DA meeting:

 

Hello. My name is George, and I am a dealer. I haven't flipped a book in three hours.

 

 

Three hours? If that's the case, we can expect withdrawal symptoms any moment now:

 

"...must...bump...marketplace...post..."

[joe_collector]

"Back in the day" I could find many bargains at shows and books selling at guide or less for nm or better. Not 2 much anymore. Many times the books are cherry picked long b4 the show opens by other dealers who then send them to FLA and make some nice coin.

 

I agree that there's nothing wrong with that, but it's one reason I'm not so into collectiing anymore. It's like comic books have reached their apex with CGC, everyone's high-grade crazy, and it's not as fun to go to a show and see the same books, over and over, at the same outlandish prices.

 

Like many have said before, this boat has long since sailed, and woe is he who enters now with a stack of money.

[blazingbob]

I'm not saying that I'm bluring the lines.

 

By the way I work a day job and I'm a dealer. Does that make me a Dealer with a day job vs a dealer who just does this for a living?

 

The dealer with a day job isn't in the same financial situation as a dealer who needs to pay the mortgage etc. I have a steady income whether I sell a book or not and that's not bragging or being curt, it just changes the dynamics of my selling style which obviously doesn't always cater to some.

 

I prefer dealing with "dealers", those that are paying the "dues (show fees, expenses etc) versus the guys running around shows picking off customers and asking you for badges just so they can buy the same books I would be buying.

[goldust40]

Boy that was fast and I'm sure we will have more verbal sword play at future shows.

 

And there in lies the problem as a dealer.

 

How much is enough? How would you, the buying public like dealers to communicate that you (not just you Andy but all of you out there) are getting enough? I have said and have had it said to me by other dealers. I am not in business to make you money. And a dealer buying from me is buying to make money off me. I rarely get 25 - 35% off high grade books from other dealers. If you are getting 25-35% than you are a better buyer than me. You (Andy) are not buying my VG+ to Fine copies. You are buying my VF or better copies, books that I am not buying for 25% of guide. When I am giving someone a good deal (In my eyes anyway) and they keep asking, I wonder why do they keep pushing for more? If the show is bad why do they need to make it worse by grinding me down even further. I have no problems with our dealings and I have communicated directly that enough is enough.

 

By the way the 2nd quote was not directed your way at all.

 

 

 

I just happened to go on the boards when this thread started heating up. To be fair as a dealer myself (I admit it) I should have at times been more sympathetic to your predicament - although in response you've always been firm enough to draw a line that it's tacitly understood should not be transgressed (actually you're not as subtle as that, but that's fair enough - I prefer directness.)

 

Yes a good deal is in the eye of the beholder, but if both buyer and seller understand the marketplace, then there'll be an agreement.

 

As for the definition of dealer, I'm simply going to paraphrase something that Bob said to me at an NYC show in 1999 regarding dealers who have ND labels on their books. A dealer is someone who DEALS. In other words, is open to negotiation. Admittedly, as far as major shows are concerned, a "deal" would have to involve a decent amount of cash.

 

Under English law (I can't speak for the U.S.) the moment you sell anything for a profit, you are a seller, or a vendor, and thus open to taxation. The word "dealer" per se denotes some level of profession, whether it be part time or otherwise.

 

Clearly ebay and its' host of lazy, uninformed ingenues who can't grade and have no scanner or understanding of the market is running riot over these definitions.