Neal Adams versus Bernie Wrightson

[bhhooks22]

You know now that you mention it, the Kane era was likely my favorite to read and re read as a kid. To this day that Morbius arc creeps me out.

 

R.

 

 

They never used a 2nd-3rd rate artist on their Flagship book ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

[TheShadowKnows]

You don't put a 2nd tier artist on one of your flagship titles.

 

Actually they did that all the time, and still do. Sal Buscema on Hulk? Herb Trimpe on Hulk? Andru & Esposito on spidey? Frank Robbins on Batman? etc, etc.

 

 

Please do not get me wrong, Kane is a great. As a cover artist one of the masters. 2nd tier is not an insult when 1st tier is Folk like Wrightson, Adams, Wood, and similar absolute "Gods" of the medium.

You forget the worst one of all Frank Thorne after Kaluta on Shadow.The LCS had them on the counter with a sign "Free please take one"

[shiverbones]

Crumb, alone with perhaps Frazetta represents an entirely different aspect. Crumb Dwarfs every single artist who has been mentioned in these lists. He went from underground counterculture to mainstream culture in a way that no other single artist has been able to do, again except perhaps Frazetta.

 

He shouldn't even be considered in this discussion.

[VintageComics]

You know now that you mention it, the Kane era was likely my favorite to read and re read as a kid. To this day that Morbius arc creeps me out.

 

R.

 

 

They never used a 2nd-3rd rate artist on their Flagship book ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

OK, never mind. I got that wrong.

 

[Zonker]

You forget the worst one of all Frank Thorne after Kaluta on Shadow.The LCS had them on the counter with a sign "Free please take one"

 

Robbins, not Thorne.

[bhhooks22]

You know now that you mention it, the Kane era was likely my favorite to read and re read as a kid. To this day that Morbius arc creeps me out.

 

R.

 

 

They never used a 2nd-3rd rate artist on their Flagship book ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

OK, never mind. I got that wrong.

 

 

(thumbs u

 

 

[Bronty]

You forget the worst one of all Frank Thorne after Kaluta on Shadow.The LCS had them on the counter with a sign "Free please take one"

 

Robbins, not Thorne.

 

same crep

[Bronty]

No way is Gil Kane 2nd tier.

 

Not 2nd rate, not in any way. But 2nd tier compared to the 1st tier under discussion right now: Neal Adams & Bernie Wrightson. (thumbs u

 

You know...... when I think about it a little more I would say he is a

 

- 1st tier COVER artist (covers every bit as good as wrightson's and adam's)

 

but a 2nd tier (3rd tier?) INTERIOR PAGE artist.

 

He just 'got it' when it came to covers... they are remarkably well done. His interior work is more choppy, doesn't tell a story so well, doesn't have mood, faces all the same..

 

So maybe we are all coming at this from different angles about whether we talk about his cover work or overall work.

[BRB-migration]

No way is Gil Kane 2nd tier.

 

true... he's fourth...

 

Wrightson, Adams, Steranko - first tier

 

Kaluta, Jones, Maroto, Cardy, Aparo, Gonzales, and Redondo - second tier, mainly because of small or limited genre/publisher output

 

Crumb, Pound, Stout, Schultz, Williams - third tier, again because of even smaller and more limited genre/publisher output

 

 

! 4th? Put down the bong. His skill (and covers) are equal to Adams and Wrightson. Why do you think Adams liked working with Kane? Because Adams knew... he knew!

 

What does "limited genre/publisher output" have to do with the quality of an artist's work? If it did, Steranko wouldn't be 1st tier

 

I think Bronty got it right re: Kane.

 

Side note (Yeah Dennis, today was the day).

[bhhooks22]

No way is Gil Kane 2nd tier.

 

true... he's fourth...

 

Wrightson, Adams, Steranko - first tier

 

Kaluta, Jones, Maroto, Cardy, Aparo, Gonzales, and Redondo - second tier, mainly because of small or limited genre/publisher output

 

Crumb, Pound, Stout, Schultz, Williams - third tier, again because of even smaller and more limited genre/publisher output

 

 

! 4th? Put down the bong. His skill (and covers) are equal to Adams and Wrightson. Why do you think Adams liked working with Kane? Because Adams knew... he knew!

 

What does "limited genre/publisher output" have to do with the quality of an artist's work? If it did, Steranko wouldn't be 1st tier

 

I think Bronty got it right re: Kane.

 

Side note (Yeah Dennis, today was the day).

 

The only thing he ever drew was a slimy swamp monster.

 

 

[TheShadowKnows]

You forget the worst one of all Frank Thorne after Kaluta on Shadow.The LCS had them on the counter with a sign "Free please take one"

 

Robbins, not Thorne.

Youre right.Tried to block that out of my mind. (thumbs u

[bhhooks22]

You know now that you mention it, the Kane era was likely my favorite to read and re read as a kid. To this day that Morbius arc creeps me out.

 

R.

 

 

They never used a 2nd-3rd rate artist on their Flagship book ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

OK, never mind. I got that wrong.

 

 

Not exactly a JIM #89 is it ?

[Shadow]

As evidence of being drawn to Wrightson, here was my version of Swamp Thing rendered in 1980 at the age of 14. I thought the cover was so cool at that age that I had to try and recreate it. (BTW, I used the professional medium of markers and crayons. )

[/img]

 

I also drew the Batman "running in the sand" by Adams around the same time but can't find it. (It was also the modified cover to a Limited Collectors Edition I still have.)

 

God, I used to love doing this as a kid and find myself enjoying it again. I'm currently painting a Batman picture for my nephew while I'm between semesters.

[dekeuk]

Gil Kane is much better than Aparo.

 

yes Kane is 1st tier, aparo definitely 2nd tier

 

 

 

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doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh! doh! doh! doh! doh! doh! doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!doh! doh! doh! doh! doh!

 

 

 

[dekeuk]

No way is Gil Kane 2nd tier.

 

true... he's fourth...

 

Wrightson, Adams, Steranko, Marshall Rogers - first tier

 

Kaluta, Jones, Maroto, Cardy, Aparo, Gonzales, and Redondo - second tier, mainly because of small or limited genre/publisher output

 

Crumb, Pound, Stout, Schultz, Williams - third tier, again because of even smaller and more limited genre/publisher output

 

 

Fixed that for ya (thumbs u

[Flaming_Telepath]

No way is Gil Kane 2nd tier.

 

true... he's fourth...

 

Wrightson, Adams, Steranko, Marshall Rogers - first tier

 

Kaluta, Jones, Maroto, Cardy, Aparo, Gonzales, and Redondo - second tier, mainly because of small or limited genre/publisher output

 

Crumb, Pound, Stout, Schultz, Williams - third tier, again because of even smaller and more limited genre/publisher output

 

 

Fixed that for ya (thumbs u

 

 

Inked by Terry Austin on Detective, Rogers did a lovely run. Lovely, but not exemplary.

 

However, go look at his Silver Surfer run for a second opinion. Utter, utter turd.

[VintageComics]

No way is Gil Kane 2nd tier.

 

true... he's fourth...

 

Wrightson, Adams, Steranko, Marshall Rogers - first tier

 

Kaluta, Jones, Maroto, Cardy, Aparo, Gonzales, and Redondo - second tier, mainly because of small or limited genre/publisher output

 

Crumb, Pound, Stout, Schultz, Williams - third tier, again because of even smaller and more limited genre/publisher output

 

 

Fixed that for ya (thumbs u

 

 

Inked by Terry Austin on Detective, Rogers did a lovely run. Lovely, but not exemplary.

 

However, go look at his Silver Surfer run for a second opinion. Utter, utter turd.

 

He's got Batmanitis.

 

 

There are a small handful of artists that were contemporary to Adams that could be spoken in the same breath as NA. Rogers is not one of them.

 

You have Kirby, Adams, Wrightson

 

Never mind. I'll start a new thread.

[40sJohn]

I'm in the same boat as Jim. My borther and I have been long time comic readers and we used to mock Kirby and Ditko work. MOCK IT! It was hilarious. I used to wonder how they could pay someone to draw like that.

 

I see it now. You do see things differently with age. Thor was always my least favorite Marvel character and now he is a fave.

 

I don't really get Ditko. I'm still trying to. I can see the creativity and the breadth of work but I don't really see the appeal. Maybe I will one day.

 

Neal Adams blew me away from the first second I saw him. I think I had a reprint of his X-men work or something. I'd never seen anyone stretch the boundaries of comic art so immediately. The first thing that came to my mind IIRC was that this guy had no limits. He was a giant among children.

 

I never felt that for Wrightson. Wrightson was an acquired taste much like Kirby. The mood, the detail, the storytelling. It took time to appreciate. Neal Adams was instant gratification. It was like a sugar intravenous. It was instant energy. Wrightson needed to be digested.

 

I think over all Neal made the bigger impact. He is still considered a giant among men. He's the Michael Jordan version of comics. Even though Dr. J was great, there will not be another MJ any time soon. MJ was so much more than just basketball the way NA was about more than just drawing. There will never be another NA anytime soon either.

 

R.

 

 

I know I am going to get flamed for this, but here goes.

 

I still do not get Kirby art in the '70s. What am I missing? I didn't like it then and I still don't like it now. In the Bronze Age: Adams - IMHO the best....Wrightson - great stuff.....Kubert - great stuff.....Aparo - great stuff....Grell - very good, but not consistent....Kirby - yuck

 

Kirby in the 40's - 60's - good stuff, but for me, it got worse each year in the '70s...

 

Thick skin is on - so, let me have it! ?

[DiceX]

I'm in the same boat as Jim. My borther and I have been long time comic readers and we used to mock Kirby and Ditko work. MOCK IT! It was hilarious. I used to wonder how they could pay someone to draw like that.

 

I see it now. You do see things differently with age. Thor was always my least favorite Marvel character and now he is a fave.

 

I don't really get Ditko. I'm still trying to. I can see the creativity and the breadth of work but I don't really see the appeal. Maybe I will one day.

 

Neal Adams blew me away from the first second I saw him. I think I had a reprint of his X-men work or something. I'd never seen anyone stretch the boundaries of comic art so immediately. The first thing that came to my mind IIRC was that this guy had no limits. He was a giant among children.

 

I never felt that for Wrightson. Wrightson was an acquired taste much like Kirby. The mood, the detail, the storytelling. It took time to appreciate. Neal Adams was instant gratification. It was like a sugar intravenous. It was instant energy. Wrightson needed to be digested.

 

I think over all Neal made the bigger impact. He is still considered a giant among men. He's the Michael Jordan version of comics. Even though Dr. J was great, there will not be another MJ any time soon. MJ was so much more than just basketball the way NA was about more than just drawing. There will never be another NA anytime soon either.

 

R.

 

 

I know I am going to get flamed for this, but here goes.

 

I still do not get Kirby art in the '70s. What am I missing? I didn't like it then and I still don't like it now. In the Bronze Age: Adams - IMHO the best....Wrightson - great stuff.....Kubert - great stuff.....Aparo - great stuff....Grell - very good, but not consistent....Kirby - yuck

 

Kirby in the 40's - 60's - good stuff, but for me, it got worse each year in the '70s...

 

Thick skin is on - so, let me have it! ?

 

I understand, man. I don't like Kirby from ANY era.

I realize the man was a workhorse and what he did for the industry, but I hate his art.

He is iconic to me on the scale of what he did, not how it looks.

 

I'm not a fan of Ditko, either. I like him even less than Kirby.

 

 

[Mephisto]

I'm in the same boat as Jim. My borther and I have been long time comic readers and we used to mock Kirby and Ditko work. MOCK IT! It was hilarious. I used to wonder how they could pay someone to draw like that.

 

I see it now. You do see things differently with age. Thor was always my least favorite Marvel character and now he is a fave.

 

I don't really get Ditko. I'm still trying to. I can see the creativity and the breadth of work but I don't really see the appeal. Maybe I will one day.

 

Neal Adams blew me away from the first second I saw him. I think I had a reprint of his X-men work or something. I'd never seen anyone stretch the boundaries of comic art so immediately. The first thing that came to my mind IIRC was that this guy had no limits. He was a giant among children.

 

I never felt that for Wrightson. Wrightson was an acquired taste much like Kirby. The mood, the detail, the storytelling. It took time to appreciate. Neal Adams was instant gratification. It was like a sugar intravenous. It was instant energy. Wrightson needed to be digested.

 

I think over all Neal made the bigger impact. He is still considered a giant among men. He's the Michael Jordan version of comics. Even though Dr. J was great, there will not be another MJ any time soon. MJ was so much more than just basketball the way NA was about more than just drawing. There will never be another NA anytime soon either.

 

R.

 

 

I know I am going to get flamed for this, but here goes.

 

I still do not get Kirby art in the '70s. What am I missing? I didn't like it then and I still don't like it now. In the Bronze Age: Adams - IMHO the best....Wrightson - great stuff.....Kubert - great stuff.....Aparo - great stuff....Grell - very good, but not consistent....Kirby - yuck

 

Kirby in the 40's - 60's - good stuff, but for me, it got worse each year in the '70s...

 

Thick skin is on - so, let me have it! ?

 

Kirby art in the 70's ranks among some of the worst comic art I have seen. Some of his Kamandi covers are absolutely terrible. I HATE this cover.