The monthly why you should use CGC instead of PGX thread with PICs

[conditionfreak]

maloney:

 

hasn't that same thing been done, albeit by several different submitters and not just one? Many results have been posted on this site. I ain't saying that PGX is as good as CGC, but I am saying that grading differs depending on who is doing the grading, and what day it is. It is legendary and factual that books can be resubmitted without any work done on them, and the grading often changes. Even with the same company and presumably the same graders as the previous time said book/s were graded. I'm not sure how one would go about finding out if the exact same graders were involved in both gradings of a specific book though. So there is a slight flaw in the experiment there.

 

So, if you graded say...300 comics a day...Every day...5 days a week...Are you saying that if someone slid a book in that you had already graded, you'd never have any variance and would assign the same grade every single time?

 

person_without_enough_empathy, please.

 

 

I am saying exactly what you are apparently saying. There will be differences in the grading of previously graded books, on different days, even by the same person. I don't think that you are understanding what I wrote, that you quoted. I think we agree and I think that you are a little senile perhaps. Or just slightly under the weather, as they say.

[DiceX]

maloney:

 

hasn't that same thing been done, albeit by several different submitters and not just one? Many results have been posted on this site. I ain't saying that PGX is as good as CGC, but I am saying that grading differs depending on who is doing the grading, and what day it is. It is legendary and factual that books can be resubmitted without any work done on them, and the grading often changes. Even with the same company and presumably the same graders as the previous time said book/s were graded. I'm not sure how one would go about finding out if the exact same graders were involved in both gradings of a specific book though. So there is a slight flaw in the experiment there.

 

So, if you graded say...300 comics a day...Every day...5 days a week...Are you saying that if someone slid a book in that you had already graded, you'd never have any variance and would assign the same grade every single time?

 

person_without_enough_empathy, please.

 

 

I am saying exactly what you are apparently saying. There will be differences in the grading of previously graded books, on different days, even by the same person. I don't think that you are understanding what I wrote, that you quoted. I think we agree and I think that you are a little senile perhaps. Or just slightly under the weather, as they say.

 

I've been called a lot of things, but fortunately never "senile".

Thanks for popping that cherry.

 

 

[mschmidt]

maloney:

 

hasn't that same thing been done, albeit by several different submitters and not just one? Many results have been posted on this site. I ain't saying that PGX is as good as CGC, but I am saying that grading differs depending on who is doing the grading, and what day it is. It is legendary and factual that books can be resubmitted without any work done on them, and the grading often changes. Even with the same company and presumably the same graders as the previous time said book/s were graded. I'm not sure how one would go about finding out if the exact same graders were involved in both gradings of a specific book though. So there is a slight flaw in the experiment there.

 

Yup, the experiment is flawed in a lot of ways actually. The more I think about it there are a ton of things.

 

You can't take results from previous posts because those are likely only listed by people with an issue to expose or a bias to illustrate. So that would represent a bias sample.

 

I think the statement I highlighted illustrates my point about not buying 9.8 books too. How good are most of us at determining the difference between a 9.6 and 9.8. And if you can tell, are those flaws worth that much extra cash?

 

This isn't a bash on CGC at all. I love the service. It's just a caution I have about being burned later on.

 

The biggest thing I like about CGC is the ability to certifiy an expensive book is real, and not fake or restored. Plus, there grades give me a ballpark of how much the book is truely worth. I've only submited 2 books myself to CGC. The other were already slabbed when I bought them.

 

The 2 books I submitted were:

1.) My AF #15 I bought raw on eBay. Since it was expensive and I wanted the piece of mind that is was authentic and there was no resto. I remember paying the expensive fee to get it back quickly too. It did come back with a blue label and I was a happy camper. (thumbs u

2.) I submitted my Preacher #1 for Signature Series since Ennis and Dillon were at Wizard World Philly this year. Just a cool book, and I think the SS service is a cool concept.

 

 

It is, of course, your prerogative to not buy 9.8 books, just as it is mine to pretty much only buy 9.8's, but distiguishing between 9.4, 9.6, and 9.8 is one of the easiest things in the book, and there are a ton of people on this board who can do so with almost-perfect accuracy.

 

(It's the mid & lower grades that are hard because you're looking at an accumulation of defects, instead of just trying to find a single spine tick or a corner that's slightly rounded.)

 

Whether it makes sense to pay that much extra for a 9.8 versus a 9.6 is a completely different discussion, but the actual spotting of those top grades is a walk in the park.

[conditionfreak]

maloney:

 

hasn't that same thing been done, albeit by several different submitters and not just one? Many results have been posted on this site. I ain't saying that PGX is as good as CGC, but I am saying that grading differs depending on who is doing the grading, and what day it is. It is legendary and factual that books can be resubmitted without any work done on them, and the grading often changes. Even with the same company and presumably the same graders as the previous time said book/s were graded. I'm not sure how one would go about finding out if the exact same graders were involved in both gradings of a specific book though. So there is a slight flaw in the experiment there.

 

So, if you graded say...300 comics a day...Every day...5 days a week...Are you saying that if someone slid a book in that you had already graded, you'd never have any variance and would assign the same grade every single time?

 

person_without_enough_empathy, please.

 

 

I am saying exactly what you are apparently saying. There will be differences in the grading of previously graded books, on different days, even by the same person. I don't think that you are understanding what I wrote, that you quoted. I think we agree and I think that you are a little senile perhaps. Or just slightly under the weather, as they say.

 

I've been called a lot of things, but fortunately never "senile".

Thanks for popping that cherry.

 

 

Yea, I feel a little bad about using that word senile. But since you used a sound alike to "beach, please" I just went with it. I really do not like using denegrating words and such in my debates, but I am only human and sometimes slip when they are used towards me.

[DiceX]

maloney:

 

hasn't that same thing been done, albeit by several different submitters and not just one? Many results have been posted on this site. I ain't saying that PGX is as good as CGC, but I am saying that grading differs depending on who is doing the grading, and what day it is. It is legendary and factual that books can be resubmitted without any work done on them, and the grading often changes. Even with the same company and presumably the same graders as the previous time said book/s were graded. I'm not sure how one would go about finding out if the exact same graders were involved in both gradings of a specific book though. So there is a slight flaw in the experiment there.

 

So, if you graded say...300 comics a day...Every day...5 days a week...Are you saying that if someone slid a book in that you had already graded, you'd never have any variance and would assign the same grade every single time?

 

person_without_enough_empathy, please.

 

 

I am saying exactly what you are apparently saying. There will be differences in the grading of previously graded books, on different days, even by the same person. I don't think that you are understanding what I wrote, that you quoted. I think we agree and I think that you are a little senile perhaps. Or just slightly under the weather, as they say.

 

I've been called a lot of things, but fortunately never "senile".

Thanks for popping that cherry.

 

 

Yea, I feel a little bad about using that word senile. But since you used a sound alike to "beach, please" I just went with it. I really do not like using denegrating words and such in my debates, but I am only human and sometimes slip when they are used towards me.

 

person_without_enough_empathy, please.

 

 

[conditionfreak]

maloney:

 

hasn't that same thing been done, albeit by several different submitters and not just one? Many results have been posted on this site. I ain't saying that PGX is as good as CGC, but I am saying that grading differs depending on who is doing the grading, and what day it is. It is legendary and factual that books can be resubmitted without any work done on them, and the grading often changes. Even with the same company and presumably the same graders as the previous time said book/s were graded. I'm not sure how one would go about finding out if the exact same graders were involved in both gradings of a specific book though. So there is a slight flaw in the experiment there.

 

So, if you graded say...300 comics a day...Every day...5 days a week...Are you saying that if someone slid a book in that you had already graded, you'd never have any variance and would assign the same grade every single time?

 

person_without_enough_empathy, please.

 

 

I am saying exactly what you are apparently saying. There will be differences in the grading of previously graded books, on different days, even by the same person. I don't think that you are understanding what I wrote, that you quoted. I think we agree and I think that you are a little senile perhaps. Or just slightly under the weather, as they say.

 

I've been called a lot of things, but fortunately never "senile".

Thanks for popping that cherry.

 

 

Yea, I feel a little bad about using that word senile. But since you used a sound alike to "beach, please" I just went with it. I really do not like using denegrating words and such in my debates, but I am only human and sometimes slip when they are used towards me.

 

person_without_enough_empathy, please.

 

 

Ha Ha. Good finish to a short slap fight

[RockMyAmadeus]

maloney:

 

hasn't that same thing been done, albeit by several different submitters and not just one? Many results have been posted on this site. I ain't saying that PGX is as good as CGC, but I am saying that grading differs depending on who is doing the grading, and what day it is. It is legendary and factual that books can be resubmitted without any work done on them, and the grading often changes. Even with the same company and presumably the same graders as the previous time said book/s were graded. I'm not sure how one would go about finding out if the exact same graders were involved in both gradings of a specific book though. So there is a slight flaw in the experiment there.

 

Yup, the experiment is flawed in a lot of ways actually. The more I think about it there are a ton of things.

 

You can't take results from previous posts because those are likely only listed by people with an issue to expose or a bias to illustrate. So that would represent a bias sample.

 

Everyone has a bias.

 

I think the statement I highlighted illustrates my point about not buying 9.8 books too. How good are most of us at determining the difference between a 9.6 and 9.8. And if you can tell, are those flaws worth that much extra cash?

 

The people who get all dramatic and wring their hands about how "you can get different grades on different days" are simply not in touch with reality: grading between "grades" is SUBJECTIVE, and always will be. There is TRULY, therefore, no genuine issue when a book gets a 9.6 on one day, and gets a 9.8 on another, or an 8.5 one day, and a 9.2 the next, or a 4.5 one day, and a 3.5 the next.

 

It's just a big "so what?"

 

The issue...broken record time...isn't CGC and subjectivity, which is natural and right. The issue is the people who either cannot, or refuse to, understand that a book that may grade 9.6 on one day could just as easily grade 9.8 the next, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that, but instead choose to whine about it on an internet message board.

 

 

[maloney414]

maloney:

 

hasn't that same thing been done, albeit by several different submitters and not just one? Many results have been posted on this site. I ain't saying that PGX is as good as CGC, but I am saying that grading differs depending on who is doing the grading, and what day it is. It is legendary and factual that books can be resubmitted without any work done on them, and the grading often changes. Even with the same company and presumably the same graders as the previous time said book/s were graded. I'm not sure how one would go about finding out if the exact same graders were involved in both gradings of a specific book though. So there is a slight flaw in the experiment there.

 

Yup, the experiment is flawed in a lot of ways actually. The more I think about it there are a ton of things.

 

You can't take results from previous posts because those are likely only listed by people with an issue to expose or a bias to illustrate. So that would represent a bias sample.

 

I think the statement I highlighted illustrates my point about not buying 9.8 books too. How good are most of us at determining the difference between a 9.6 and 9.8. And if you can tell, are those flaws worth that much extra cash?

 

This isn't a bash on CGC at all. I love the service. It's just a caution I have about being burned later on.

 

The biggest thing I like about CGC is the ability to certifiy an expensive book is real, and not fake or restored. Plus, there grades give me a ballpark of how much the book is truely worth. I've only submited 2 books myself to CGC. The other were already slabbed when I bought them.

 

The 2 books I submitted were:

1.) My AF #15 I bought raw on eBay. Since it was expensive and I wanted the piece of mind that is was authentic and there was no resto. I remember paying the expensive fee to get it back quickly too. It did come back with a blue label and I was a happy camper. (thumbs u

2.) I submitted my Preacher #1 for Signature Series since Ennis and Dillon were at Wizard World Philly this year. Just a cool book, and I think the SS service is a cool concept.

 

 

It is, of course, your prerogative to not buy 9.8 books, just as it is mine to pretty much only buy 9.8's, but distiguishing between 9.4, 9.6, and 9.8 is one of the easiest things in the book, and there are a ton of people on this board who can do so with almost-perfect accuracy.

 

(It's the mid & lower grades that are hard because you're looking at an accumulation of defects, instead of just trying to find a single spine tick or a corner that's slightly rounded.)

 

Whether it makes sense to pay that much extra for a 9.8 versus a 9.6 is a completely different discussion, but the actual spotting of those top grades is a walk in the park.

 

I agree with you on the prerogative part. To each there own of course. Everyone should collect what they like.

 

But i've had the grading conversation with my local comic book shop owner. He's been in the business for over 30 years and even he's had books he thought were 9.8 come back 9.6 and vice versa.

 

"A ton of people on the boards" is cherry picking a sample of trained eyes verse the general population paying for those 9.8's too. One of my friends is into the 9.8 craze for example and he can't grade for . It's kind of the novelty of having a perfect book and the belief that they are going to continue to increase in value.

 

He's one of the reasons I'm reminded of the 90's variant cover phase too. There are a lot of people who aren't buying them because they appreciate and want a perfect comic. They believe they are going to be worth a fortune in the future. They don't understand that more of them exist and just haven't been graded yet (referring to moderns). I think of this every time I see a 9.8 book sell for a crazy price that isn't a 1st appearance, #1, or key book of any kind. Just a 9.8.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[RockMyAmadeus]

 

He's one of the reasons I'm reminded of the 90's variant cover phase too. There are a lot of people who aren't buying them because they appreciate and want a perfect comic. They believe they are going to be worth a fortune in the future. They don't understand that more of them exist and just haven't been graded yet (referring to moderns). I think of this every time I see a 9.8 book sell for a crazy price that isn't a 1st appearance, #1, or key book of any kind. Just a 9.8.

 

 

If you haven't already, get a subscription to GPA and you'll see exactly what you're talking about. Prices for almost everything post 1975 are dropping like rocks. It's 1989 all over again.

[RockMyAmadeus]

Oh, and I wouldn't put any faith in anyone who's been "in the business for over 30 years" who is not intimately involved with CGC graded books. 30 years ago, grading standards were almost non-existant, which was ok, because most comic books weren't worth thousands of dollars. Only a small handful were.

 

A lot of folks who were grading 30 years ago have not kept up with the changes in the industry, and either can't be bothered to learn, or sneer at 'the picky collectors" as they happily overgrade for $$$$.

 

Harry Thomas is a PERFECT example.

[slym2none]

 

 

 

-slym

[Mr 9.8]

Oh, and I wouldn't put any faith in anyone who's been "in the business for over 30 years" who is not intimately involved with CGC graded books. 30 years ago, grading standards were almost non-existant, which was ok, because most comic books weren't worth thousands of dollars. Only a small handful were.

 

A lot of folks who were grading 30 years ago have not kept up with the changes in the industry, and either can't be bothered to learn, or sneer at 'the picky collectors" as they happily overgrade for $$$$.

 

Harry Thomas is a PERFECT example.

Who's harry thomas?

[Old Fashion PB and J]

maloney:

 

hasn't that same thing been done, albeit by several different submitters and not just one? Many results have been posted on this site. I ain't saying that PGX is as good as CGC, but I am saying that grading differs depending on who is doing the grading, and what day it is. It is legendary and factual that books can be resubmitted without any work done on them, and the grading often changes. Even with the same company and presumably the same graders as the previous time said book/s were graded. I'm not sure how one would go about finding out if the exact same graders were involved in both gradings of a specific book though. So there is a slight flaw in the experiment there.

 

So, if you graded say...300 comics a day...Every day...5 days a week...Are you saying that if someone slid a book in that you had already graded, you'd never have any variance and would assign the same grade every single time?

 

person_without_enough_empathy, please.

 

 

I am saying exactly what you are apparently saying. There will be differences in the grading of previously graded books, on different days, even by the same person. I don't think that you are understanding what I wrote, that you quoted. I think we agree and I think that you are a little senile perhaps. Or just slightly under the weather, as they say.

 

I've been called a lot of things, but fortunately never "senile".

Thanks for popping that cherry.

 

[TeenTitans]

Went I was cracking this one out, I KNEW this was going to be trouble. It's got a 1 inch tear on the back, real nice book, but CGC does tend to frown on those sorts of things. PQ up two ticks.

 

 

 

Well is it the First or Second appearance of ODIN?

 

i looked it up on overstreet price guide, it is the first appearance of odin.

[JazzMan]

Went I was cracking this one out, I KNEW this was going to be trouble. It's got a 1 inch tear on the back, real nice book, but CGC does tend to frown on those sorts of things. PQ up two ticks.

 

 

 

Well is it the First or Second appearance of ODIN?

 

i looked it up on overstreet price guide, it is the first appearance of odin.

 

PGX got one over on CGC!

[mschmidt]

Went I was cracking this one out, I KNEW this was going to be trouble. It's got a 1 inch tear on the back, real nice book, but CGC does tend to frown on those sorts of things. PQ up two ticks.

 

 

 

Well is it the First or Second appearance of ODIN?

 

i looked it up on overstreet price guide, it is the first appearance of odin.

 

No, it's not.

 

Odin appears in one panel in #85 which is why CGC treats it as his first appearance - Overstreet also lists it as "1st brief app. Odin".

[Old Fashion PB and J]

Went I was cracking this one out, I KNEW this was going to be trouble. It's got a 1 inch tear on the back, real nice book, but CGC does tend to frown on those sorts of things. PQ up two ticks.

 

 

 

Well is it the First or Second appearance of ODIN?

 

i looked it up on overstreet price guide, it is the first appearance of odin.

 

No, it's not.

 

Odin appears in one panel in #85 which is why CGC treats it as his first appearance - Overstreet also lists it as "1st brief app. Odin".

So this is like Hulk 181 debate. Yet they didnt get that one right either.

[seanfingh]

Went I was cracking this one out, I KNEW this was going to be trouble. It's got a 1 inch tear on the back, real nice book, but CGC does tend to frown on those sorts of things. PQ up two ticks.

 

 

 

Well is it the First or Second appearance of ODIN?

 

i looked it up on overstreet price guide, it is the first appearance of odin.

 

No, it's not.

 

Odin appears in one panel in #85 which is why CGC treats it as his first appearance - Overstreet also lists it as "1st brief app. Odin".

So this is like Hulk 181 debate. Yet they didnt get that one right either.

 

Hulk 180 hoarder.

[Old Fashion PB and J]

Went I was cracking this one out, I KNEW this was going to be trouble. It's got a 1 inch tear on the back, real nice book, but CGC does tend to frown on those sorts of things. PQ up two ticks.

 

 

 

Well is it the First or Second appearance of ODIN?

 

i looked it up on overstreet price guide, it is the first appearance of odin.

 

No, it's not.

 

Odin appears in one panel in #85 which is why CGC treats it as his first appearance - Overstreet also lists it as "1st brief app. Odin".

So this is like Hulk 181 debate. Yet they didnt get that one right either.

 

Hulk 180 hoarder.

Only one copy for me. Double sig though Wein and Trimpe. Plan to upgrade after I buy 181 though.

[ChasingKingKirby]

Went I was cracking this one out, I KNEW this was going to be trouble. It's got a 1 inch tear on the back, real nice book, but CGC does tend to frown on those sorts of things. PQ up two ticks.

 

 

 

Well is it the First or Second appearance of ODIN?

 

i looked it up on overstreet price guide, it is the first appearance of odin.

 

No, it's not.

 

Odin appears in one panel in #85 which is why CGC treats it as his first appearance - Overstreet also lists it as "1st brief app. Odin".

 

Still think they may have a label problem. The label I saw for a slabbed 85 doesn't mention Odin at all. So does that mean that CGC does not designate Odin's first appearance?

 

http://www.comiclink.com/itemdetail.asp?back=%2Fsearch.asp%3Fwhere%3Dsell%26title%3Djourney%2Binto%2Bmystery%26x%3D17%26y%3D12%26ItemType%3DCB%26pg%3D2&id=791508