Which key is more key: Showcase #4 or FF #1?

[joe_collector]

Hey, I'm not disputing the START of the Silver Age, but in terms of the Which Key is More Key original question, I'm certainly not going to count a retreaded, second-string GA revamp on the same level as Fantastic Four 1.

 

In fact, I'd rate BB 28 as "more key" than Showcase 4, and AF15 ahead of FF 1.

 

Just because a random book and character started something does not mean every MUST agree it's the Biggest Key of the Silver Age.

[hobbes]

Fair enough. I agree wholeheartedly on you with the AF 15 bieng more important than FF1. Kids to day are far more familiar with Spider-Man than the FF. As far as I am concerned, that alone makes AF15 Marvels most important SA book.

 

As far as Showcase 4 goes, if I had a choice I would take a Showcase 4 over an FF1. For me, I would rather have that book sitting in my collection. I want the book that started the song, not the one that changed the melody. Of course, the fact that I am a fan of the Flash doesn't hurt either.

 

[Timely]

Without FF#1, no AF#15

without Showcase 4, no FF#1

without Flash Comics #1, no Showcase #4

without Action #1, no Flash Comics #1

without Famous Funnies #1, no Action #1.

 

 

I guess Famous Funnies #1 should be worth $1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000.00!

+ tax.

 

Timely

[hobbes]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'd still rather have Showcase 4.

[Rip]

I'm certainly not going to count a retreaded, second-string GA revamp on the same level as Fantastic Four 1.

And the Human Torch isn't? WIth FF's origin and team concepts swiped straight from the cover of a third string book? And isn't BB28 is just a collection of these revamped superheros forming a new JSA?

[Rip]

I guess Famous Funnies #1 should be worth $1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000.00!

or maybe the Yellow kid before that? or maybe the Brownies by Cox before that.... or the Adventures of Mr. Obadiah Oldbuck.....or maybe the........

[lou_fine]

Without FF#1, no AF#15

without Showcase 4, no FF#1

without Flash Comics #1, no Showcase #4

without Action #1, no Flash Comics #1

without Famous Funnies #1, no Action #1.

 

 

I guess Famous Funnies #1 should be worth $1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000.00!

+ tax.

 

Timely

 

I wish this was true since I do have a copy of Famous Funnies #1, but no copies of any of the other books.

[Aman619]

theres just too many ways to go about comparing these two very important books. Most of them have been mentioned. Right now, IMO, Im kinda down on Showcase#4. First SA, return of JSA as JLA, jumpstart super-hero revival, etc etc.

 

But, FF#1 was the beginning of The Marvel Age of Comics, of Stan and Jack's revolution in Superhero storytelling that continues its hegemony over the industry even today 44 years later! Its not so important what book led to th enext one. As illustrated above, you can string out a sequence of hundreds of building blocks of comicdom. But between these two, I vote for FF#1 as the cornerstone of the Marvel Age.

 

10 years ago, I would have voted for Showcase#4. As a DC guy, it made more sense. But today, nore than ever, its Marvel Marvel Marvel all the time. Having said all this, I still think AF15 is the MOST important Marvel , however.

[GoodyRickles]

I've always wanted a Famous Funnies #1!!!

[Timely]

Having said all this, I still think AF15 is the MOST important Marvel , however.

 

I'd have to disagree. I'd Say Marvel Comics #1 is the MOST important marvel!

 

Timely

[Aman619]

Thats not the kind of Marvel I mean, and you know it.

Though obviously youre a big fan of GA Timelys, Marvel#1 did far less for comics IMO than even FF#1. Introducing Torch and Namor (ho hum) who lasted for what, 8, 10 years?? versus the kickoff of the REAL Marvel Age?? which has continued unabated for 510 issues and counting?

[aardvark88]

Marvel #1 1939 also introduced the Angel who later morphed into an X-men. Torch & Sub-mariner had decent runs going from Timely to Atlas before the 1950s implosion/cancellation.

Later Showcase 4 entered the market to resuscitate superhero-dom.

[Mushroom]

Showcase #4 a hands down winner. Nothing Marvel has ever done has been original or important.

[Aman619]

gee, thats not too provocative a comment! sheeesh.

You must be looking for the Argument Clinic.

Its two dorrs down. sorry.

[FFB]

Same here, and me too.

 

Even though I collect NOTHING but Marvels, I'd have to grudgingly concede to Showcase #4.

 

Even though it kills me to say it.

 

Rick

[FFB]

All true and great points. I guess it comes down to a matter of opinion about why the "more key" book is "more key." My opinion is that Showcase #4 is more important because it marks the beginning of the Silver Age. On the other hand, FF#1 is extremely important because it marks the beginning of the "Marvel Age," so to speak. But to my own personal collecting leanings, AF#15 is the most important book *to me,* because it was the first appearance of my favorite character -- Aunt May.

 

theres just too many ways to go about comparing these two very important books. Most of them have been mentioned. Right now, IMO, Im kinda down on Showcase#4. First SA, return of JSA as JLA, jumpstart super-hero revival, etc etc.

 

But, FF#1 was the beginning of The Marvel Age of Comics, of Stan and Jack's revolution in Superhero storytelling that continues its hegemony over the industry even today 44 years later! Its not so important what book led to th enext one. As illustrated above, you can string out a sequence of hundreds of building blocks of comicdom. But between these two, I vote for FF#1 as the cornerstone of the Marvel Age.

 

10 years ago, I would have voted for Showcase#4. As a DC guy, it made more sense. But today, nore than ever, its Marvel Marvel Marvel all the time. Having said all this, I still think AF15 is the MOST important Marvel , however.

[Timely]

Well lets' think...what's more important, the Marvel Age or the Silver Age (which also incompases the Marvel Age)?

 

The answer seems pretty clear to me!

 

Timely

[FFB]

You will note that in the post directly above the one you're replying to, I grudgingly admit that I think Showcase #4 is the "more key" of the two.

 

Not that I'm happy about it.

 

Actually, let me add to this -- what would the Silver Age have been without the Marvel Age (i.e., Lee and Co.'s new brand of realism in comics)? Probably nothing more than a half-baked re-hash of the Golden Age that would have resulted in an implosion of the superhero market along the way. I don't think that the Marvel Silver Age comics would have had as much ongoing readership or as much of a fan base both from a comic-reading and non-comic-reading standpoint (i.e., people who buy Spidey shirts and lunchpails and videogames, but who don't read the comics) if Lee & Co. hadn't done comics the way they did, starting with FF #1. One might say that the Silver Age was only "great" because of the Marvel Age. I'm not sure that I buy this 100%, but there is definitely the basis for an argument there.

 

Well lets' think...what's more important, the Marvel Age or the Silver Age (which also incompases the Marvel Age)?

 

The answer seems pretty clear to me!

 

Timely

[Zonker]

Actually, let me add to this -- what would the Silver Age have been without the Marvel Age (i.e., Lee and Co.'s new brand of realism in comics)? Probably nothing more than a half-baked re-hash of the Golden Age that would have resulted in an implosion of the superhero market along the way. I don't think that the Marvel Silver Age comics would have had as much ongoing readership or as much of a fan base both from a comic-reading and non-comic-reading standpoint (i.e., people who buy Spidey shirts and lunchpails and videogames, but who don't read the comics) if Lee & Co. hadn't done comics the way they did, starting with FF #1. One might say that the Silver Age was only "great" because of the Marvel Age. I'm not sure that I buy this 100%, but there is definitely the basis for an argument there.

 

As a primarily DC collector, I think there's a lot of truth to the above-- and I also like Timely's formulation of the Marvel Age as in fact a subset of the larger Silver Age. Though I'd dispute that what the late, great Julie Schwartz & co. did was merely a 'half-baked re-hash,' I do think it clear that without Stan Lee's and Jack Kirby's later innovations, you'd not have had the acceptance of comics among the older, even college-age readership by the late 1960s. Marvel made comics cool again, and legitimately part of the youth culture of the times. And my very favorite DC books were primarily a reaction to Marvel breathing down their necks by the late 60s. 1968-1974 were great, high-quality years for mainstream comics in America, and unlike the earlier Silver Age, (which I also prize for nostalgia's sake) many of these stories hold up well today.