Lets be honest, the market has gone up for about 2 percent of collectors.

[homerwannabee]

Here's a simple picture of how I envision the CGC market:

 

Awesome analogy, and awesome picture.

[batman_fan]

Everything's cyclical. If books I like get cheaper, I'm happy because a) I can afford them now and b) even if I already own them, I can buy more, cheaper (dollar-cost averaging).

 

For me, the CGC modern crash has been great (Sandman 1, Death in the Family, Punisher Ltd. 1 in 9.8). Likewise, I'm biding my time before buying CGC 9.2-9.6 Bronze that's fallen precipitously (Defenders 1, Iron Fist 14).

 

Even early Justice Leagues are more affordable now that the movie hype's dead. IE--the CGC 4.0 # 1 that sold in Brent's auction last week for just over $400, 20% under GPA.

 

But GA's not immune either. GPA on say...Superman # 9 3.0 is basically the same as it was 3 years ago. And I'm trying to build out my Nedor collection, war cover and otherwise. Shouldn't we be concerned that the Exciting # 9 CGC 5.5 sold this week for basically the same price the 4.0 one sold for six months ago on C-Link (not reported on GPA, but still listed on their site)?

Or that Zaid's 8.5 Fighting Yank # 1 didn't meet reserve because it ended more than 30% under both guide and what he paid for it a few years ago?

 

How about the slabbed 6.0 Kubert Hawkman cover late Flash Comics that were selling for $90-$130 apiece in Brent's auction? Or the 5.0-6.0 slabbed sub-100 Batmans that went for under $100?

 

This isn't rocket-science. Buy what's being ignored for the time being, and when the tides shift, you'll be alright.

 

I would (and am) pour money into select Golden Silver Age comics right now rather than my stock portfolio or Gold. Although, if you can work out a good margin deal, I think a better bet against the U.S. dollar and Euro (thank you Greece!) over the next 12-18 months.

 

 

Great summary. A lot of people will talk about the "what I collect is expensive" but this is largely due to them collecting the current "flavor of the month". Granted, in many cases people are unfortunite enough to get caught in a situation where what they have been collecting for some time becomes the flavor which really sucks. What are the current flavors of the month?

 

Right now I would say Action, Superman, Pre Robin Tec (starting to slow down) Nedor war covers.

 

What were some of the previous flavors? More Funs for sure. Probably dropped 50% in value from the peak for mid grade copies. Batman, yes Batman. There were several people chasing runs that drove prices up quite a bit. In some cases, books have dropped 3x (Batman 68 in 8.0 anyone!). A lot of the people chasing runs have sold off everything at a significant discount from what they paid (actually monitor the sells thread to see people letting stuff go for less than they paid and in many cases the books don't sell even offering under what they paid).

 

Also Detectives in general. A lot of people that were working on runs have stopped (myself included) which has definitely affected prices, again especially in the mid grade range (4.5 to 7.5). I would even say Lou Fine stuff has slowed down (although the Wonderworld 7 sell was pretty high but not insane). Pre-hero Detectives and Adventures. And don't get me started on the silver and bronze age stuff. It is definitely much shorter lived than GA.

 

I think this message board drives a lot of this. Someone gets a cool book (there are a ton of them out there). They post it on here, everyone gives them kudos. Collectors see them get attention so on the bandwagon they jump. It is human nature.

[VintageComics]

Frankly, that bear looks a little scrawny...I think I'd kick its @ss if it came near me,

 

I guess you don't know much about bears - their musculature is insane (designed for digging and uprooting tree roots, rocks, etc.), kind of like a super-animal, and a bear could crush a lion's skull with a swat of its paw.

 

Pound per pound, they are many times stronger and have more stamina than a lion/tiger, so I'd bet even a baby bear (if it was sufficiently angry) could rip any weaponless human being apart. Plus, they can like 30-35 mph, so don't run.

 

Most people don't realize that vegetarian animals are generally the strongest on the planet.

 

I know that bears are omnivorous but they lean towards plant diets for the most part.

 

Personally, I find bears to be just big ugly rodents.

 

I'd hate to have a gorilla after me.

 

Or a pancake with legs.

 

I'm hungry.

[ComicConnoisseur]

People have been conditioned by the media to think bears are cuddly but bears can be vicious when provoked.

Some example of why bears don`t get respect like they should.

[joe_collector]

Or a pancake with legs.

 

How about a combination:

 

[Forbush-Man]

Frankly, that bear looks a little scrawny...I think I'd kick its @ss if it came near me,

 

I guess you don't know much about bears - their musculature is insane (designed for digging and uprooting tree roots, rocks, etc.), kind of like a super-animal, and a bear could crush a lion's skull with a swat of its paw.

 

Pound per pound, they are many times stronger and have more stamina than a lion/tiger, so I'd bet even a baby bear (if it was sufficiently angry) could rip any weaponless human being apart. Plus, they can go like 30-35 mph, so don't run.

 

BS: Everyone knows that, Pound-for-pound, Chihuahua's are the nastiest, fiercest creatures on the planet.

[JiveTurkeyMoFo]

Frankly, that bear looks a little scrawny...I think I'd kick its @ss if it came near me,

 

I guess you don't know much about bears - their musculature is insane (designed for digging and uprooting tree roots, rocks, etc.), kind of like a super-animal, and a bear could crush a lion's skull with a swat of its paw.

 

Pound per pound, they are many times stronger and have more stamina than a lion/tiger, so I'd bet even a baby bear (if it was sufficiently angry) could rip any weaponless human being apart. Plus, they can go like 30-35 mph, so don't run.

 

I came face to face with a young adult black bear in the Colorado wilderness, and scared it away. While I'm not stupid enough to tangle with one, I know they do scare pretty easy and would rather not have anything to do with you.

[VintageComics]

Frankly, that bear looks a little scrawny...I think I'd kick its @ss if it came near me,

 

I guess you don't know much about bears - their musculature is insane (designed for digging and uprooting tree roots, rocks, etc.), kind of like a super-animal, and a bear could crush a lion's skull with a swat of its paw.

 

Pound per pound, they are many times stronger and have more stamina than a lion/tiger, so I'd bet even a baby bear (if it was sufficiently angry) could rip any weaponless human being apart. Plus, they can go like 30-35 mph, so don't run.

 

I came face to face with a young adult black bear in the Colorado wilderness, and scared it away. While I'm not stupid enough to tangle with one, I know they do scare pretty easy and would rather not have anything to do with you.

 

Let me guess, you pulled out a SA CGC book.

 

Was it a DC? If so that makes sense.

[JiveTurkeyMoFo]

Frankly, that bear looks a little scrawny...I think I'd kick its @ss if it came near me,

 

I guess you don't know much about bears - their musculature is insane (designed for digging and uprooting tree roots, rocks, etc.), kind of like a super-animal, and a bear could crush a lion's skull with a swat of its paw.

 

Pound per pound, they are many times stronger and have more stamina than a lion/tiger, so I'd bet even a baby bear (if it was sufficiently angry) could rip any weaponless human being apart. Plus, they can go like 30-35 mph, so don't run.

 

I came face to face with a young adult black bear in the Colorado wilderness, and scared it away. While I'm not stupid enough to tangle with one, I know they do scare pretty easy and would rather not have anything to do with you.

 

Let me guess, you pulled out a SA CGC book.

 

Was it a DC? If so that makes sense.

 

No, I asked it if it wanted to partner up in a new comic shop I wanted to open....that thought scared the cr@p out of it, and away it ran....

[Gatsby77]

 

 

 

Great summary. A lot of people will talk about the "what I collect is expensive" but this is largely due to them collecting the current "flavor of the month". Granted, in many cases people are unfortunite enough to get caught in a situation where what they have been collecting for some time becomes the flavor which really sucks. What are the current flavors of the month?

 

Right now I would say Action, Superman, Pre Robin Tec (starting to slow down) Nedor war covers.

 

What were some of the previous flavors? More Funs for sure. Probably dropped 50% in value from the peak for mid grade copies. Batman, yes Batman. There were several people chasing runs that drove prices up quite a bit. In some cases, books have dropped 3x (Batman 68 in 8.0 anyone!). A lot of the people chasing runs have sold off everything at a significant discount from what they paid (actually monitor the sells thread to see people letting stuff go for less than they paid and in many cases the books don't sell even offering under what they paid).

 

Also Detectives in general. A lot of people that were working on runs have stopped (myself included) which has definitely affected prices, again especially in the mid grade range (4.5 to 7.5). I would even say Lou Fine stuff has slowed down (although the Wonderworld 7 sell was pretty high but not insane). Pre-hero Detectives and Adventures. And don't get me started on the silver and bronze age stuff. It is definitely much shorter lived than GA.

 

I think this message board drives a lot of this. Someone gets a cool book (there are a ton of them out there). They post it on here, everyone gives them kudos. Collectors see them get attention so on the bandwagon they jump. It is human nature.

 

Thanks for the support. I'm just saying--people who complain the market's on fire clearly aren't collecting GA Batman, More Fun, Flash, or (shock to me) Green Lantern.

 

Go ahead and keep pouring money into Silver Age Iron Man, Green Lantern or Avengers. Proof to me that SA Green Lantern is nothing more than a speculative bubble is how _dead_ the Golden Age books are, including All-American # 23, 7.0, that sold for less than $1100.

 

And lest you think "different character, no crossover," keep in mind that when the Flash movie director rumor hit a few days ago, speculation was it would feature Jay Garrick, not Wally West, albeit likely in the SA costume.

[VintageComics]

It's very easy to stand in the middle of a bunch of books that are on fire and say "look, that book is on fire and this one isn't" but the truth is that it's cyclical. Everything is.

 

Step back and you'll see that there has always been something hot and something cold in the hobby. Who would ever have thought that Fawcetts would be making a come back?

 

I'm not oblivious to the fact that as we get older the hobby ages with us, but I do know that every decade has been hearing the death knell.

 

I'm excited to see the record prices, I'm excited to share what I do with my time in the hobby and share that with others. I take pride in the comics that I own and the 30 years I've spent in the hobby.

 

I'm excited that people in their 20's and 30's are collecting Golden Age.

 

I'm excited that I see people bringing their kids to cons and local comics shops.

 

I know that sometimes my excitement gets other people involved. Lou had never picked up a comic before we met. Now she has her own collection.

 

There's lots of negative stuff to talk about, but it's really always been there.

 

 

[delekkerste]

What I find to be particularly amusing is that, after the, shall we say, disappointing sale at a particular auction site a couple of weeks ago, people were becoming a lot more realistic about the true health of the CGC market. Then, a week later, 2 comic books are sold for 7-figures in transactions which have nothing to do with 99.9999% of other comics or collectors, and suddenly everyone is just positively giddy about things again.

[Forbush-Man]

What I find to be particularly amusing is that. after the, shall we say, disappointing sale at a particular auction site a couple of weeks ago, people were becoming a lot more realistic about the true health of the CGC market. Then, a week later, 2 comic books are sold for 7-figures in transactions which have nothing to do with 99.9999% of other comics or collectors, and suddenly everyone is just positively giddy about things again.

 

So is it a Bear Market?

[Bosco685]

What I find to be particularly amusing is that. after the, shall we say, disappointing sale at a particular auction site a couple of weeks ago, people were becoming a lot more realistic about the true health of the CGC market. Then, a week later, 2 comic books are sold for 7-figures in transactions which have nothing to do with 99.9999% of other comics or collectors, and suddenly everyone is just positively giddy about things again.

Well, it's a Bear Market.

 

Vince worked long and hard on this outfit.

 

[*paull*]

What I find to be particularly amusing is that, after the, shall we say, disappointing sale at a particular auction site a couple of weeks ago, people were becoming a lot more realistic about the true health of the CGC market. Then, a week later, 2 comic books are sold for 7-figures in transactions which have nothing to do with 99.9999% of other comics or collectors, and suddenly everyone is just positively giddy about things again.

 

Sounds like everyone is talking about keys and classic covers. What about average GA books?

[batman_fan]

What I find to be particularly amusing is that, after the, shall we say, disappointing sale at a particular auction site a couple of weeks ago, people were becoming a lot more realistic about the true health of the CGC market. Then, a week later, 2 comic books are sold for 7-figures in transactions which have nothing to do with 99.9999% of other comics or collectors, and suddenly everyone is just positively giddy about things again.

 

Sounds like everyone is talking about keys and classic covers. What about average GA books?

 

Lets actually even take it a step further. We all agree, Batman and Superman are "kings" in the character world (I am not saying the only kings). Since they are kings, what would be the ultimate title? How about a comic with Batman and Superman together !!! Oh wait, we have World's Best/World's FInest and New York World's Fair 1940. Those must be in super high demand and worth a ton !!! Nope, hard to give away. Some of the World's Finest in the 50 to 100 range go for quite a bit because they are tough to find and there are a few collectors trying to assemble runs right now but once they complete their runs and aren't doing the upgrade thing look for those prices to drop. Especially when they decide to sell them off.

 

Don't get me wrong, I am not running down the hobby, I just try to look at it with an open mind. I have been collecting non stop since 1976. That is 34 years I have been doing this. The trend I have seen is with the increases prices on books, people have stopped collecting runs to a large degree which has lead to a huge increase in the key issue prices and classic covers. All the rest has gone down in value. I have also seen a trend in generating new "classic covers". Definitely a tried and true method for pumping up the price of a book. I see this trend continuing where people's collections grow smaller and smaller but have a higher dollar value.

 

The other thing I wonder is when more long time collectors will start dumping their collections? We have the Mile High Adventures, All Flash, and Green Lanterns coming to market. The recent Heritage auctons saw two collectors books coming to market. All these books sold to collectors in the 60s, 70s and 80s will show up at some point. Will it eventually create a glut? Maybe not for the keys and classic covers, but the other stuff, probably so.

[500Club]

Everything's cyclical. If books I like get cheaper, I'm happy because a) I can afford them now and b) even if I already own them, I can buy more, cheaper (dollar-cost averaging).

 

For me, the CGC modern crash has been great (Sandman 1, Death in the Family, Punisher Ltd. 1 in 9.8). Likewise, I'm biding my time before buying CGC 9.2-9.6 Bronze that's fallen precipitously (Defenders 1, Iron Fist 14).

 

Even early Justice Leagues are more affordable now that the movie hype's dead. IE--the CGC 4.0 # 1 that sold in Brent's auction last week for just over $400, 20% under GPA.

 

But GA's not immune either. GPA on say...Superman # 9 3.0 is basically the same as it was 3 years ago. And I'm trying to build out my Nedor collection, war cover and otherwise. Shouldn't we be concerned that the Exciting # 9 CGC 5.5 sold this week for basically the same price the 4.0 one sold for six months ago on C-Link (not reported on GPA, but still listed on their site)?

Or that Zaid's 8.5 Fighting Yank # 1 didn't meet reserve because it ended more than 30% under both guide and what he paid for it a few years ago?

 

How about the slabbed 6.0 Kubert Hawkman cover late Flash Comics that were selling for $90-$130 apiece in Brent's auction? Or the 5.0-6.0 slabbed sub-100 Batmans that went for under $100?

 

This isn't rocket-science. Buy what's being ignored for the time being, and when the tides shift, you'll be alright.

 

I would (and am) pour money into select Golden Silver Age comics right now rather than my stock portfolio or Gold. Although, if you can work out a good margin deal, I think a better bet against the U.S. dollar and Euro (thank you Greece!) over the next 12-18 months.

 

 

[*paull*]

I believe that the vast majority of non-key and non-classic-cover GA books are overvalued, particularly by dealers. There's a huge difference between what these books are selling for on eBay and the price at which they are priced at on dealer websites. I realize that eBay is a "got to have it now" market while dealers are willing to sit on books for a while, however the markup can be 3x-5x. I have a list of non-key books that I'd like to have at the right price, but dealer prices are way out of line. I'll go for it when I see them sell for a fraction on eBay.

[500Club]

Frankly, that bear looks a little scrawny...I think I'd kick its @ss if it came near me,

 

I guess you don't know much about bears - their musculature is insane (designed for digging and uprooting tree roots, rocks, etc.), kind of like a super-animal, and a bear could crush a lion's skull with a swat of its paw.

 

Pound per pound, they are many times stronger and have more stamina than a lion/tiger, so I'd bet even a baby bear (if it was sufficiently angry) could rip any weaponless human being apart. Plus, they can go like 30-35 mph, so don't run.

 

I came face to face with a young adult black bear in the Colorado wilderness, and scared it away. While I'm not stupid enough to tangle with one, I know they do scare pretty easy and would rather not have anything to do with you.

 

You're lucky it didn't know you were a Seahawks fan....

[Flee-Marquette]

If you let a bear chase you up a tree, one of two things will happen.

 

You'll fall out of the tree, or the bear will get you. Climbing higher doesn't do anything but delay the inevitable, and potentially make the fall even harder.

The bear could fall out of the tree first if it weighs more and the branches

are too thin to support it towards the top. Now a squirrel can get you no

matter where you go.