Beware monsterscollectibles on Ebay.

[kimik]

WOW is PGX that bad for restoration checks? I just don't get how there are such ignorant collectors out there that prefer it to CGC.

 

There are two types who use pgx:

 

1: People who think using it is cheaper and thinking it is "certification". They just don't know any better. Many of us make the same mistake in using companies like that in our non-collecting life at some point or another. I got taken by a muffler place, they had great prices and good advertising. Bottom line, they ripped me off and it ended costing me more $ in the long run.

 

2: People who know something is wrong with their books and use pgx to claim "Hey, they are experts, they must be correct." They then go on and sell it with no way they can be accused of anything that they already knew was wrong.

 

You forgot to add this one:

 

3. People who buy a sizeable stash of books in November and need to get them slabbed in time for the brief post-Xmas rush. They make money in the short term but regret it after every unsold book (as well as the raw ones they did not feel would make the 9.4 cut) come back 1 to 2 grades higer on a resub from CGC. They leave $1000s on the the table and keep watching for those PGX serial numbers to come up again on eBay.

[TheDanimal]

The sellers who use PGX are usually just hiding restoration as no one in their right mind would use it simply because it's faster.

It's well known that CGC books sell for A LOT more freakin money! That's why I never understand a dealer that uses PGX.

[Dark Prime 0]

for me (a collector) i only use PGX if CGC won't grade the book.....the variant covers with overhang

 

that and i have a PGX sandman 19 error 9.9 off ebay (great price), will be sending it to CGC when Giaman does a signing......i expect it to come back 9.8, hopeing it retaines the 9.9 but doubt it

[RockMyAmadeus]

The sellers who use PGX are usually just hiding restoration as no one in their right mind would use it simply because it's faster.

It's well known that CGC books sell for A LOT more freakin money! That's why I never understand a dealer that uses PGX.

 

Think of it this way.

 

No one...with the possible exception of Todd Lange...can sell raw books for anywhere near what a slabbed book will on eBay.

 

This is especially true of 1975-up books. An Amazing Spiderman #300 in CGC 9.6 might sell for about $200. A raw copy isn't gonna sell for more than $80 or so. But a PGX copy, what would grade 9.6 at CGC could very easily grade 9.8 at PGX...or even a 9.9!

 

That PGX 9.8 copy would sell for about $400. So, the easy grading and the lower fees definitely make it more attractive.

 

(Of course, the same argument can be made for pre-screening at CGC....the argument isn't without problems. )

 

 

 

[KryptoSpidey]

Just a heads up for anyone buying from Ken Danker, aka monsterscollectibles. He's buying books, having them restored, and then sending them to PGX for blue labels and listing them on Ebay. I know he's a board member and has peddled his wares here before.

 

Happy to show proof if he dares to stick his neck out here. One more scumbag to add to the "avoid like the plague" list.

 

Maybe the concerns Trey Cannon had with him were justified after all.

 

How about some proof even if he doesn't show up in the thread It's a pretty serious accusation. What kind of resto? Is PGX complicit in this or just clueless as usual?

 

Here's the short version.

 

I bought a Zip 29 from him on Ebay here and I've been on the road 3/4 weeks this month so I didn't have much time to give it a good once over. The book came in, I looked at it briefly and it looked ok (definitely a little overgraded, but...), left decent feedback.

 

Then I cracked it out, the staples had been monkeyed with and it had been poorly pressed, not a big deal as I factored (a) a "generous" grade from PGX and (b) some similar work into the price when I bought it, but I had no idea if the seller had done it himself, so no big deal.

 

Then I see the same book having been sold here as a 1.0 and I take a closer look and there are some tear seals and amateur resto at the top of the spine & top staple. The time from the first sale to the second means that it almost certainly had to be the same person doing the work & submission to PGX.

 

PGX is of course incompetent, and as I said, I just factored that into the price when I bought it. But this all adds up to a deliberate intent to use PGX's incompetence to pass off restoration.

 

Rule #1 : GOLDEN-AGE PGX slabbed books = Reciepe for disaster. AVOID!

[blazingbob]

Or they use PGX because of a "" contest" over Pedigree destinction.

 

Having heard 2 sides of the Diamond run story frankly I can see why Joe will not use CGC and why CGC did what they felt had to be done.

 

That being said frankly I do not hold the belief like I'm reading on these boards that every book in a PGX holder is suspect.

[Bruce1971]

The sellers who use PGX are usually just hiding restoration as no one in their right mind would use it simply because it's faster.

It's well known that CGC books sell for A LOT more freakin money! That's why I never understand a dealer that uses PGX.

 

Think of it this way.

 

No one...with the possible exception of Todd Lange...can sell raw books for anywhere near what a slabbed book will on eBay.

 

This is especially true of 1975-up books. An Amazing Spiderman #300 in CGC 9.6 might sell for about $200. A raw copy isn't gonna sell for more than $80 or so. But a PGX copy, what would grade 9.6 at CGC could very easily grade 9.8 at PGX...or even a 9.9!

 

That PGX 9.8 copy would sell for about $400. So, the easy grading and the lower fees definitely make it more attractive.

 

(Of course, the same argument can be made for pre-screening at CGC....the argument isn't without problems. )

 

 

 

I thought I have read a lot of higher grade books get a grade bump if you crack a PGX and submit it to CGC, not the other way around. Of course you take a chance of it coming back PLOD as well.

 

Bruce

[comicparadox]

Rule #1 : GOLDEN-AGE PGX slabbed books = Reciepe for disaster. AVOID!

 

One of the things I like about this thread is the lack of sweeping generalizations.

 

Or they use PGX because of a "pissing contest" over Pedigree destinction.

 

Having heard 2 sides of the Diamond run story frankly I can see why Joe will not use CGC and why CGC did what they felt had to be done.

 

That being said frankly I do not hold the belief like I'm reading on these boards that every book in a PGX holder is suspect.

 

What has it come to when Blazing Bob is the voice of moderation and reason? It must be "Good Bob" day.

[ComicConnoisseur]

WOW is PGX that bad for restoration checks? I just don't get how there are such ignorant collectors out there that prefer it to CGC.

 

There are two types who use pgx:

 

1: People who think using it is cheaper and thinking it is "certification". They just don't know any better. Many of us make the same mistake in using companies like that in our non-collecting life at some point or another. I got taken by a muffler place, they had great prices and good advertising. Bottom line, they ripped me off and it ended costing me more $ in the long run.

 

2: People who know something is wrong with their books and use pgx to claim "Hey, they are experts, they must be correct." They then go on and sell it with no way they can be accused of anything that they already knew was wrong.

 

You forgot to add this one:

 

3. People who buy a sizeable stash of books in November and need to get them slabbed in time for the brief post-Xmas rush. They make money in the short term but regret it after every unsold book (as well as the raw ones they did not feel would make the 9.4 cut) come back 1 to 2 grades higer on a resub from CGC. They leave $1000s on the the table and keep watching for those PGX serial numbers to come up again on eBay.

Can you explain that in more detail? I never heard about that. thanks in advance.

[mschmidt]

for me (a collector) i only use PGX if CGC won't grade the book.....the variant covers with overhang

 

that and i have a PGX sandman 19 error 9.9 off ebay (great price), will be sending it to CGC when Giaman does a signing......i expect it to come back 9.8, hopeing it retaines the 9.9 but doubt it

 

I can pretty much guarantee you that it won't - I've owned two of those PGX 9.9 Sandman #19's, and one came back a 9.8, and the other came back a 9.6.

 

If you check the PGX census, they've graded 24 copies of this book - and 16 of them came back 9.9 or higher

[ChasingKingKirby]

for me (a collector) i only use PGX if CGC won't grade the book.....the variant covers with overhang

 

that and i have a PGX sandman 19 error 9.9 off ebay (great price), will be sending it to CGC when Giaman does a signing......i expect it to come back 9.8, hopeing it retaines the 9.9 but doubt it

 

I can pretty much guarantee you that it won't - I've owned two of those PGX 9.9 Sandman #19's, and one came back a 9.8, and the other came back a 9.6.

 

If you check the PGX census, they've graded 24 copies of this book - and 16 of them came back 9.9 or higher

 

 

Yeah, that seems likely.

[KryptoSpidey]

Rule #1 : GOLDEN-AGE PGX slabbed books = Reciepe for disaster. AVOID!

 

One of the things I like about this thread is the lack of sweeping generalizations.

 

Or they use PGX because of a "pissing contest" over Pedigree destinction.

 

Having heard 2 sides of the Diamond run story frankly I can see why Joe will not use CGC and why CGC did what they felt had to be done.

 

That being said frankly I do not hold the belief like I'm reading on these boards that every book in a PGX holder is suspect.

 

What has it come to when Blazing Bob is the voice of moderation and reason? It must be "Good Bob" day.

Not 100% sure what your comment means,but i as a person that cracks Pgx silver-age slabs on a regular basis,and consistantly get higher CGC grades,i'm pretty sure my reply is far from a "sweeping generalization" as i've followed a pretty large # of Golden-age Pgx books that have been de-slabbed as well,and then sent to cgc.

EVERY single one that i have followed,or know of,including several from G.A.t.o.r,have all come back lower in grade and/or with resto. ALL were failures.

Think my "sweeping generalization" stands pretty solid ground.

AVOID PGX GOLDEN-AGE BOOKS.

[Dale Roberts]

The sellers who use PGX are usually just hiding restoration as no one in their right mind would use it simply because it's faster.

It's well known that CGC books sell for A LOT more freakin money! That's why I never understand a dealer that uses PGX.

 

This is absolutely false. I know one very respected dealer who uses it because he is cost and time conscience. Now he is not a convention dealer, and doesn't really have an online presence, but he has 2 very successful stores and carries lots of GA/SA. He is not doing it to hide anything. Doesn't mean it is the best decision, but it is not done to hide anything.

[Dale Roberts]

Rule #1 : GOLDEN-AGE PGX slabbed books = Reciepe for disaster. AVOID!

 

One of the things I like about this thread is the lack of sweeping generalizations.

 

Or they use PGX because of a "pissing contest" over Pedigree destinction.

 

Having heard 2 sides of the Diamond run story frankly I can see why Joe will not use CGC and why CGC did what they felt had to be done.

 

That being said frankly I do not hold the belief like I'm reading on these boards that every book in a PGX holder is suspect.

 

What has it come to when Blazing Bob is the voice of moderation and reason? It must be "Good Bob" day.

Not 100% sure what your comment means,but i as a person that cracks Pgx silver-age slabs on a regular basis,and consistantly get higher CGC grades,i'm pretty sure my reply is far from a "sweeping generalization" as i've followed a pretty large # of Golden-age Pgx books that have been de-slabbed as well,and then sent to cgc.

EVERY single one that i have followed,or know of,including several from G.A.t.o.r,have all come back lower in grade and/or with resto. ALL were failures.

Think my "sweeping generalization" stands pretty solid ground.

AVOID PGX GOLDEN-AGE BOOKS.

 

My Superman #4 which is a CGC 6.5 was originally a PGX 5.0. No restoration.

[TheDanimal]

The sellers who use PGX are usually just hiding restoration as no one in their right mind would use it simply because it's faster.

It's well known that CGC books sell for A LOT more freakin money! That's why I never understand a dealer that uses PGX.

 

This is absolutely false. I know one very respected dealer who uses it because he is cost and time conscience. Now he is not a convention dealer, and doesn't really have an online presence, but he has 2 very successful stores and carries lots of GA/SA. He is not doing it to hide anything. Doesn't mean it is the best decision, but it is not done to hide anything.

 

I didn't mean to sound so absolute. Obviously not every dealer is doing it to mislead customers. I'm sure a ton of people simply use PGX because it's fast and cheap as your friend does. I wish he realized it's not a very smart business decision when more profit is to be made with a CGC book.

[Jeffro.]

Now, now guys. We've obviously misjudged good ol PGX and need to give them another chance.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[valiantman]

WOW is PGX that bad for restoration checks? I just don't get how there are such ignorant collectors out there that prefer it to CGC.

 

There are two types who use pgx:

 

1: People who think using it is cheaper and thinking it is "certification". They just don't know any better. Many of us make the same mistake in using companies like that in our non-collecting life at some point or another. I got taken by a muffler place, they had great prices and good advertising. Bottom line, they ripped me off and it ended costing me more $ in the long run.

 

2: People who know something is wrong with their books and use pgx to claim "Hey, they are experts, they must be correct." They then go on and sell it with no way they can be accused of anything that they already knew was wrong.

 

In summary:

 

There are two types who use pgx:

 

1: Innocent (but ignorant) penny-pinchers

 

2: Crooks

 

Since there is no end to the supply of either 1: or 2:, I would say that PGX will be around for a very long time.

 

[KryptoSpidey]

Rule #1 : GOLDEN-AGE PGX slabbed books = Reciepe for disaster. AVOID!

 

One of the things I like about this thread is the lack of sweeping generalizations.

 

Or they use PGX because of a "pissing contest" over Pedigree destinction.

 

Having heard 2 sides of the Diamond run story frankly I can see why Joe will not use CGC and why CGC did what they felt had to be done.

 

That being said frankly I do not hold the belief like I'm reading on these boards that every book in a PGX holder is suspect.

 

What has it come to when Blazing Bob is the voice of moderation and reason? It must be "Good Bob" day.

Not 100% sure what your comment means,but i as a person that cracks Pgx silver-age slabs on a regular basis,and consistantly get higher CGC grades,i'm pretty sure my reply is far from a "sweeping generalization" as i've followed a pretty large # of Golden-age Pgx books that have been de-slabbed as well,and then sent to cgc.

EVERY single one that i have followed,or know of,including several from G.A.t.o.r,have all come back lower in grade and/or with resto. ALL were failures.

Think my "sweeping generalization" stands pretty solid ground.

AVOID PGX GOLDEN-AGE BOOKS.

 

My Superman #4 which is a CGC 6.5 was originally a PGX 5.0. No restoration.

I stand corrected then,out of the now 27 Pgx to CGC GOLDEN-AGE resubs that I know of,I now know of 1 that has graded higher with CGC or not came back PLOD....

 

[blazingbob]

Frankly this thread reminds me of the Jason Ewert High grade thread. Hmm, didn't that thread start with a book that was sold to me by Jason.

 

What started creeping into the thread.

 

Oh yeah.

 

Every CGC high grade book is trimmed, don't buy CGC high grade.

 

Substiture every PGX book is restored, don't buy PGX books.

 

Sorry, feels the same to me.

 

 

 

[KryptoSpidey]

Frankly this thread reminds me of the Jason Ewert High grade thread. Hmm, didn't that thread start with a book that was sold to me by Jason.

 

What started creeping into the thread.

 

Oh yeah.

 

Every CGC high grade book is trimmed, don't buy CGC high grade.

 

Substiture every PGX book is restored, don't buy PGX books.

 

Sorry, feels the same to me.

 

 

really?

sounds more like people just expressing views about the subject.

As stated before,my thoughts are avoid PGX golden-age..

Yet i purchase as many high grade Pgx silver-age book as i can for cgc re-subs.

So i'm far from close minded about PGX,just smart enough to know what to avoid,on an everyday normal basis.

Doesn't mean that there aren't exceptions to either of my view points,just enough experience in the matter to have a pretty bias opinion.