Miller DD over 100k with the vig

[DarkKnightReturns]

must be a record for a miller at auction?

 

makes me wonder what a truly top tier miller like Dark Knight #2 would get

 

+1

 

I find nothing notable/special about this cover. What would that fetch at auction or Wolv LS1

 

This piece will get people talking for sure and the next Miller will rake in big bucks too

[stinkininkin]

must be a record for a miller at auction?

 

makes me wonder what a truly top tier miller like Dark Knight #2 would get

 

150k. At least. Trust me.

 

Scott Williams

[comicartcom]

and I forgot to add that it isn't even a good cover...!!!

 

I like your honesty on this, but this is why discussions on how 'CRAZY" something is is somewhat relative. I think this cover is TERRIFIC. I mean, a superb cover from such an influential and important run of Daredevil, and I would LOVE to add this to my collection. I think it went for well over what I would have guessed (75k), but THIS type of art is exactly the type of art that I am not surprised by when it goes for an aggressive number. I think a lot of art is WAY overpriced, but this old time collector sees the logic in overpaying for THIS cover a lot more than a lot of other stuff I see for sale.

 

Scott Williams

 

Scott.. there is absolutely NOTHING about this particular cover that makes it special. As far as art goes, you are supposed to judge any particular artist's work on a curve according to quality of design, concept & finished work. Of all the Miller DD covers - this is one of the worst and this is not a new thinking. When it came out (meaning, when it was published) we all wondered aloud what a piece of it was.

 

Comics is a strange collecting field in several ways that don't measure in any way with other hobbies. Any comic book can be suddenly recognized as something "historic"

 

ie:

This is the first comic featuring Dung Beetle

This is the first cover appearance of Dung Beetle

this is the first issue exposing Dung Beetle's identity as Star Nosed Mole's brother

 

that's a bunch of hooey and they are what called "hype" so that something sells better. But comic fans deserve it if they fall for it just like any moe-ron who buys a $60,000 house for $150,000.

 

This Frank Miller cover is a low quality work and some fool just spent $101k on it. Fortunately any fool who spends that jack can afford to lose it or bury it or burn it and if it was bought by someone whose financial strata is not that he could burn teh cash.. he's an even bigger fool

 

 

 

 

[r1982rhoads]

Dreadful cover...100k for this? Ouch...sell sell sell

[jbud73]

must be a record for a miller at auction?

 

makes me wonder what a truly top tier miller like Dark Knight #2 would get

 

150k. At least. Trust me.

 

Scott Williams

 

Scott does that mean you will pay 150K at least if it ever came up so that's at least what it would take.

 

I really like this cover a lot. Some of the pre-auction talk was that there was someone willing to shell 50K (that might have been the person on Heritage Live cause they were out around that level) the two people on the Floor were obviously willing to pay much more.

 

I think the Miracleman 15 cover at 45K surprises me much more than this cover at 100K, as they say two for the Tango and it was danced in Dallas this afternoon. There was no video or sound (at least I didn't get it at work) but the atmosphere in there must have been cool.

 

[Nexus]

Check out all of Miller's DD covers (158-161, 163-191) here:

 

http://www.coverbrowser.com/covers/daredevil/4

 

One of the "worst"? I don't agree. There are a couple of dogs in there...this isn't one of them to me. I wouldn't spend $100K on it, but that doesn't change the fact that I do like it a lot. Congrats to the winner, both for winning the cover and having the $100K to blow!

[stinkininkin]

and I forgot to add that it isn't even a good cover...!!!

 

I like your honesty on this, but this is why discussions on how 'CRAZY" something is is somewhat relative. I think this cover is TERRIFIC. I mean, a superb cover from such an influential and important run of Daredevil, and I would LOVE to add this to my collection. I think it went for well over what I would have guessed (75k), but THIS type of art is exactly the type of art that I am not surprised by when it goes for an aggressive number. I think a lot of art is WAY overpriced, but this old time collector sees the logic in overpaying for THIS cover a lot more than a lot of other stuff I see for sale.

 

Scott Williams

 

Scott.. there is absolutely NOTHING about this particular cover that makes it special. As far as art goes, you are supposed to judge any particular artist's work on a curve according to quality of design, concept & finished work. Of all the Miller DD covers - this is one of the worst and this is not a new thinking. When it came out (meaning, when it was published) we all wondered aloud what a piece of it was.

 

Comics is a strange collecting field in several ways that don't measure in any way with other hobbies. Any comic book can be suddenly recognized as something "historic"

 

ie:

This is the first comic featuring Dung Beetle

This is the first cover appearance of Dung Beetle

this is the first issue exposing Dung Beetle's identity as Star Nosed Mole's brother

 

that's a bunch of hooey and they are what called "hype" so that something sells better. But comic fans deserve it if they fall for it just like any moe-ron who buys a $60,000 house for $150,000.

 

This Frank Miller cover is a low quality work and some fool just spent $101k on it. Fortunately any fool who spends that jack can afford to lose it or bury it or burn it and if it was bought by someone whose financial strata is not that he could burn teh cash.. he's an even bigger fool

 

 

 

 

If you feel that "hype" infers an artist/writer fully in his prime nearing the completion of a multi-issue storyline considered one of if not the best of it's era, then yup, I'm all about the hype!

 

Scott Williams

[stinkininkin]

Check out all of Miller's DD covers (158-161, 163-191) here:

 

http://www.coverbrowser.com/covers/daredevil/4

 

One of the "worst"? I don't agree. There are a couple of dogs in there...this isn't one of them to me. I wouldn't spend $100K on it, but that doesn't change the fact that I do like it a lot. Congrats to the winner, both for winning the cover and having the $100K to blow!

 

Couldn't have said it better, or illustrated the point any better myself.

 

Scott Williams

[stinkininkin]

must be a record for a miller at auction?

 

makes me wonder what a truly top tier miller like Dark Knight #2 would get

 

150k. At least. Trust me.

 

Scott Williams

 

Scott does that mean you will pay 150K at least if it ever came up so that's at least what it would take.

 

I really like this cover a lot. Some of the pre-auction talk was that there was someone willing to shell 50K (that might have been the person on Heritage Live cause they were out around that level) the two people on the Floor were obviously willing to pay much more.

 

I think the Miracleman 15 cover at 45K surprises me much more than this cover at 100K, as they say two for the Tango and it was danced in Dallas this afternoon. There was no video or sound (at least I didn't get it at work) but the atmosphere in there must have been cool.

 

 

Even if I had 150k to blow at the time such a mythical sale was offered, I am quite confident I would be blown out of the water if such an opportunity were to be made publicly.

 

Scott Williams

[chrisco37]

$100K for that cover? That's just downright retarded. I'm sure all the OA Market bulls will dismiss my comment but how about a reality check here? When I see auction results like this I see speculation, manipulation and business. That is not the kind of hobby I want to be a part of. I've seen it happen gradually over the last 7 or 8 years. For me, this is like watching a big slab fall off of my idea of a hobby that I've been watching crumble for some time.

 

That's shocking! I agre with what you said.

 

I haven't been following any of the auctions (or even the lead up to), but when I read the title of the thread, I assumed (incorrectly) that it must be the cover to 168.

 

 

[delekkerste]

One of the "worst"? I don't agree. There are a couple of dogs in there...this isn't one of them to me.

 

I actually don't find that many of the covers in the run are particuarly great, except that they tie in to some of the most brilliant sequential storytelling ever seen in comics. I find that how much I like a particular cover in the Miller DD run is directly correlated with how much I like the interior art and story. I feel that the #188 cover is actually one of the exceptions to that rule, as the cover stands up pretty well on its own, one of only a very few in the run that is able to do so (looking at these covers now, I can't imagine that the OA to most of them is actually all that impressive). But, the flip side of that is that it's still the cover to DD #188, which was a decent issue, but not one of the most memorable in the run, and which thus begs the question...$101,575 for the Daredevil #188 cover? Really?

[FatComicMafia]

I thought this was one of the best Miller covers ?

 

What other Miller covers surpass this one ?

 

It's really complete, with lush dark values, and a menacing mood that brings one into the web.

 

 

 

 

Also, with the Miller Daredevil pages, I see a lot of them where Janson may or may not have been the penciler, or Miller may have only done layouts. And then there are some where Miller really did the pencils. Many seller can get away saying it's miller or having him sign it, because he often wrote it. Is there a way to find out which pages were true Miller Pencils ?

 

 

 

I sometimes see Janson credited as the penciler, with Miller as secondary, then later sold by someone else, just mentiong it's Miller pencils, and getting 5 times more.

 

 

[chrisco37]

It's a nice cover, yes.

 

But the 100K is crazy.

 

168 has the be the top dog on his DD's. After that maybe "No More Mister Nice Guy". I wouldn't have put either of those near 100K. But, they've got to be now.

 

You also have to put Wolvie #1 and all the DKR covers above that as well.

 

I'd love to see the DKR#1 cover at auction. Just to see what it would bring.

 

 

[comix4fun]

I thought this was one of the best Miller covers ?

 

What other Miller covers surpass this one ?

 

It's really complete, with lush dark values, and a menacing mood that brings one into the web.

 

 

 

 

Also, with the Miller Daredevil pages, I see a lot of them where Janson may or may not have been the penciler, or Miller may have only done layouts. And then there are some where Miller really did the pencils. Many seller can get away saying it's miller or having him sign it, because he often wrote it. Is there a way to find out which pages were true Miller Pencils ?

 

 

I sometimes see Janson credited as the penciler, with Miller as secondary, then later sold by someone else, just mentiong it's Miller pencils, and getting 5 times more.

 

 

 

Back Issue Magazine #21 had an article about it

 

http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=105048

 

In Summary:

 

158-172 Tight Miller drawings (he also spots blacks), Janson inks.

 

173-185 Looser Miller pencils, Janson inks and spots blacks. 179 Janson starts coloring as well.

 

185-190 Miller layouts on small sheets of paper. Janson draws, inks and colors.

 

[Nexus]

I've posted that a bunch here and on Comicart-L...was looking for it to cut/paste...you beat me to it!

[comix4fun]

I thought this was one of the best Miller covers ?

 

What other Miller covers surpass this one ?

 

It's really complete, with lush dark values, and a menacing mood that brings one into the web.

 

 

In numerical order (not in order of preference) I would rather have

 

#158, 160, 161, 165, 168, 179, 181, 189 (maybe 169 and 170 too)

 

before the 188.

 

But that's just me.

[comix4fun]

I've posted that a bunch here and on Comicart-L...was looking for it to cut/paste...you beat me to it!

 

 

 

 

Just trying to ease your burden a bit. (thumbs u

[gambron]

Wow what a testament to subjectivity!!! I will admit to be a little surprised when I saw the hammer on this piece, however, I am truly shocked at how many in this thread are so vehemently throwing this piece under the bus. For my part I thought the high contrast style, the white paint, the black widow in the web, etc at the very least made for an interesting composition. And another interesting thing about this piece is that when compared to alot of others from the run (and the genre in general), it has a certain appeal as a stand alone piece of art. I mean it's not a Frankenstein Plate, but there's a certain appeal to it, almost like one wouldn't have to know anything about the story, or the characters to appreciate it. Not the best Miller DD (I'm partial to the #175) but FAR from the worst I think.

 

As far as the hammer price, well, I guess when it comes to one of a kind commodities, all it takes is for TWO people with really deep pockets to want the SAME thing and POOF! And in all fairness who are we to judge what others should or shouldn't be spending (big) money on? Perhaps the two bidders that went down to the wire both had a STRONG nostalgic pull for Miller DD? Certainly people spend bigger money on much less worthy things (than nostalgia) in this world.

 

Also, for what it's worth I genuinely don't think this was a case of market manipulation by some insidious individual or individuals as was insinuated earlier in this thread. Unless of course one or both of the bidders is sitting on the mother-load of Miller DD covers, which I don't think is the case. And though I am (regrettably) far, FAR from a player at that level, I think sales like these are GOOD for the respect of the hobby and when looked at in the context of what some high grade slabs go for, completely justified.

 

And I do think that public sales like this one (there have been plenty of private sales at these levels I think) will certainly push the "general" comfort threshold higher and lead to many more in the years to come. Just the nature of a hobby that is so nostalgia driven. I mean when most of the people buying at these levels simply aren't sellers, what happens when the next BSD wants to get their hands on a primo Miller DD cover, a Byrne X-men cover or something of similar popularity yet small in supply? I think the ultimate, big fall-off will be at the estate sales of our generation of buyers/collectors. I guess our kids will have to worry about that one

 

Sorry for the rambling!

 

-Ken

 

http://www.comicartfans.com/GalleryDetail.asp?GCat=19201

 

 

[stinkininkin]

It's a nice cover, yes.

 

But the 100K is crazy.

 

168 has the be the top dog on his DD's. After that maybe "No More Mister Nice Guy". I wouldn't have put either of those near 100K. But, they've got to be now.

 

You also have to put Wolvie #1 and all the DKR covers above that as well.

 

I'd love to see the DKR#1 cover at auction. Just to see what it would bring.

 

 

DD 181 and 174 just for starters...

 

Scott Williams

[FatComicMafia]

Thank you for the link.

 

 

 

As for the covers, even if one has a favorite published cover, the way the original presents, may surpass, or be inferior to the published version.

 

I feel this # 188 is so complete and sofisticated, it's one of the best Miller Daredevil covers for sure.

 

 

# 168 could be up there, but what does the original look like?

 

Other covers have great action and drama, but can be stark or a bit flat, that's where the original comes in. Also, paste overs, yellowing, damage, white out etc can really distract from a piece, as least visually/ aesthetically flawed.

 

 

This piece looks as if it was nearly a super high end comission work, let alone published.

 

It's one of Miller's all time Best DD covers.

 

 

Wolverine # 1 limited, sure it's great Wolverine etc, but boring by comparision.

 

 

 

If I was a museum curator trying to obtain the best Miller covers, aside from plot significance( and the Dark Knight), this DD # 188 cover has to be one of the very best.