Comic Connect Grading?

[Bomber-Bob]

The book should be graded based on it's structure. There's no point in downgrading based on page quality. (Unfortunately, this is not the way it is done)

 

I have to respectfully disagree with you. I think Page Quality is the best indicator of the overall preservation of a book and should be taken into account. We have seen that structure can be manipulated but Page Quality is a done deal.

Would you buy a home or used car by simply looking at the exterior ? I'm not sure how much PQ influences the grade with CGC but as far as I'm concerned it's more important than a small crease or tiny stain. Thanks for listening.

[comicdonna]

I was browsing Comic Connect the other day and was wondering about the grades listed on the site. For the books that aren't CGC graded how reliable are the grades listed? Are they graded by the seller or Comic Connect? Has anybody had any experience with non CGC books from Comic Connect?

 

Thanks all.

Comic Connect is Metropolis Comics Sister site...i've been having a heated discussion with Metro regarding the FF 39 double cover listed on both sites.

It was the slabbed 8.5 "mannarino collection" "LIGHT TAN PAGES" book,that will never get higher than a 8.5 due to the poor page quality,and was last sold for $185...yet they full well know that,and have it listed as a 9.0 "RAW" at almost 9.0 GPA...

YOU TELL ME,HOW IS CC's grading???

 

Well, not everyone agrees that LT pages should put an automatic cap on a book at VF+.

+1 Im one of them.

The book should be graded based on it's structure. There's no point in downgrading based on page quality. (Unfortunately, this is not the way it is done)

 

This IS the way CGC does it up to light tan. For some reason they've decided to draw a line at LT to OW as having a cut off and will take PQ into account in the grade but they won't do this with CR-OW or better pages.

Exactly! However, I feel that PQ shouldn't be a factor in the grade of a book. The PQ is noted on the label.

[Bomber-Bob]

However, I feel that PQ shouldn't be a factor in the grade of a book. The PQ is noted on the label.

 

The page quality is noted on the label because it is essentially hidden in the slab.

That should not preclude it from being considered in the grade. A stain does not affect the structure of a book but it is strongly recognized by CGC in the grade.

Foxing does not affect the structure, color loss does not affect the structure,

thumbprints do not affect the structure yet these are all considered in the final grade. Why should PQ be any different ?

[rodan57]

Page quality lets you know how close the comic is to being dust.

[KryptoSpidey]

I was browsing Comic Connect the other day and was wondering about the grades listed on the site. For the books that aren't CGC graded how reliable are the grades listed? Are they graded by the seller or Comic Connect? Has anybody had any experience with non CGC books from Comic Connect?

 

Thanks all.

Comic Connect is Metropolis Comics Sister site...i've been having a heated discussion with Metro regarding the FF 39 double cover listed on both sites.

It was the slabbed 8.5 "mannarino collection" "LIGHT TAN PAGES" book,that will never get higher than a 8.5 due to the poor page quality,and was last sold for $185...yet they full well know that,and have it listed as a 9.0 "RAW" at almost 9.0 GPA...

YOU TELL ME,HOW IS CC's grading???

 

Well, not everyone agrees that LT pages should put an automatic cap on a book at VF+.

+1 Im one of them.

I fully agree,too bad CGC doesn't,and if bought as a 9.0 as listed and slabbed,someone's going to be very disappointed with an 8.5 bought as a 9.0,at 9.0 price,and that Metro knows was a 8.5 with Light Tan Pages previously slabbed.

That was my point

It's actually really bad Ethics on Metro's part.

Would they KNOWINGLY allow a Dupak or Ewert Trimmed book to be listed as Non-Restored? NO But it's OK for them to list a RAW book,knowing what it's previous CGC grade was,and WHY it was at that grade,as a higher grade? BS

 

I don't think the 8.5 cap because of the PQ is necessarily inaccurate, but how does anyone truly know outside of hearing someone from CGC say this? There's no published grading standards. I take it that it's from the experience of a number of people who've submitted books with similar PQ? :shrug: Even so, how does anyone know that CGC won't give a 9.0 to a book with light tan pages?

 

I think it's astounding that CGC has enjoyed the success they've had--and have been in existence for a decade--without published standards (I know this has been batted around a time or two before ).

Read this.. http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1968534&fpart=1

He talked to CGC on the phone,read the whole thread.

[DNAgent]

Page quality lets you know how close the comic is to being dust.

 

+1

[comicdonna]

However, I feel that PQ shouldn't be a factor in the grade of a book. The PQ is noted on the label.

 

The page quality is noted on the label because it is essentially hidden in the slab.

That should not preclude it from being considered in the grade. A stain does not affect the structure of a book but it is strongly recognized by CGC in the grade.

Foxing does not affect the structure, color loss does not affect the structure,

thumbprints do not affect the structure yet these are all considered in the final grade. Why should PQ be any different ?

Perhaps I am in the minority here. I guess I could see a book with brittle pages getting a deduction in grade. However, if the pages are structually intact with no chipping, I can see no reason for a deduction. I factor in PQ when I make a purchase. If CGC deducts for PQ and the buyer does with his offer/bid, that's a double wammy.

[DNAgent]

However, I feel that PQ shouldn't be a factor in the grade of a book. The PQ is noted on the label.

 

The page quality is noted on the label because it is essentially hidden in the slab.

That should not preclude it from being considered in the grade. A stain does not affect the structure of a book but it is strongly recognized by CGC in the grade.

Foxing does not affect the structure, color loss does not affect the structure,

thumbprints do not affect the structure yet these are all considered in the final grade. Why should PQ be any different ?

 

Totally agree...and (with older books of course)...I would rather have a F/VF 7.0 with White (or OW/W) pages than a NM 9.4 with CR/OW or anything 'worse' or lesser on the scale...you know what? I'd go for a VG/F 5.0 with OW/W pages than a VF 8.0 with CR/OW or less or any tanning whatsoever.

 

The 'state of preservation' of pages (and back/front cover) is important and can tell a lot about a book, what Rodan says is pretty much true. Structural damage is obviously important...

[comicdonna]

However, I feel that PQ shouldn't be a factor in the grade of a book. The PQ is noted on the label.

 

The page quality is noted on the label because it is essentially hidden in the slab.

That should not preclude it from being considered in the grade. A stain does not affect the structure of a book but it is strongly recognized by CGC in the grade.

Foxing does not affect the structure, color loss does not affect the structure,

thumbprints do not affect the structure yet these are all considered in the final grade. Why should PQ be any different ?

 

Totally agree...and (with older books of course)...I would rather have a F/VF 7.0 with White (or OW/W) pages than a NM 9.4 with CR/OW or anything 'worse' or lesser on the scale...you know what? I'd go for a VG/F 5.0 with OW/W pages than a VF 8.0 with CR/OW or less or any tanning whatsoever.

 

The 'state of preservation' of pages (and back/front cover) is important and can tell a lot about a book, what Rodan says is pretty much true. Structural damage is obviously important...

This is what I am talking about. You have given grades and PQ examples. You as the buyer can now make a choice as to which book you want. (thumbs u Now, if CGC gave that 9.4 an 8.0, is that fair to the book?

[KryptoSpidey]

However, I feel that PQ shouldn't be a factor in the grade of a book. The PQ is noted on the label.

 

The page quality is noted on the label because it is essentially hidden in the slab.

That should not preclude it from being considered in the grade. A stain does not affect the structure of a book but it is strongly recognized by CGC in the grade.

Foxing does not affect the structure, color loss does not affect the structure,

thumbprints do not affect the structure yet these are all considered in the final grade. Why should PQ be any different ?

 

Totally agree...and (with older books of course)...I would rather have a F/VF 7.0 with White (or OW/W) pages than a NM 9.4 with CR/OW or anything 'worse' or lesser on the scale...you know what? I'd go for a VG/F 5.0 with OW/W pages than a VF 8.0 with CR/OW or less or any tanning whatsoever.

 

The 'state of preservation' of pages (and back/front cover) is important and can tell a lot about a book, what Rodan says is pretty much true. Structural damage is obviously important...

This is what I am talking about. You have given grades and PQ examples. You as the buyer can now make a choice as to which book you want. (thumbs u Now, if CGC gave that 9.4 an 8.0, is that fair to the book?

Is it any different than inside cover tanning? That CGC whacks! Many 9.6/9.4 structure books are sitting in 9.0/8.5 holders.i know that for a FACT.

[DNAgent]

However, I feel that PQ shouldn't be a factor in the grade of a book. The PQ is noted on the label.

 

The page quality is noted on the label because it is essentially hidden in the slab.

That should not preclude it from being considered in the grade. A stain does not affect the structure of a book but it is strongly recognized by CGC in the grade.

Foxing does not affect the structure, color loss does not affect the structure,

thumbprints do not affect the structure yet these are all considered in the final grade. Why should PQ be any different ?

 

Totally agree...and (with older books of course)...I would rather have a F/VF 7.0 with White (or OW/W) pages than a NM 9.4 with CR/OW or anything 'worse' or lesser on the scale...you know what? I'd go for a VG/F 5.0 with OW/W pages than a VF 8.0 with CR/OW or less or any tanning whatsoever.

 

The 'state of preservation' of pages (and back/front cover) is important and can tell a lot about a book, what Rodan says is pretty much true. Structural damage is obviously important...

This is what I am talking about. You have given grades and PQ examples. You as the buyer can now make a choice as to which book you want. (thumbs u Now, if CGC gave that 9.4 an 8.0, is that fair to the book?

 

Ahh, I see...there is no simpleasy answer...it would be fair to some...but unfair to others...

[Foolkiller]

Though I am big on page quality, I do think it's funny how much emphasis people put in the CGC designations based on their consistency in assigning them. After a few discussions I've had recently, I've come to look at each book to get signals as to page quality in a CGC holder. I can tell you I no longer worry about cr/ow.

[benz]

I was browsing Comic Connect the other day and was wondering about the grades listed on the site. For the books that aren't CGC graded how reliable are the grades listed? Are they graded by the seller or Comic Connect? Has anybody had any experience with non CGC books from Comic Connect?

 

Thanks all.

Comic Connect is Metropolis Comics Sister site...i've been having a heated discussion with Metro regarding the FF 39 double cover listed on both sites.

It was the slabbed 8.5 "mannarino collection" "LIGHT TAN PAGES" book,that will never get higher than a 8.5 due to the poor page quality,and was last sold for $185...yet they full well know that,and have it listed as a 9.0 "RAW" at almost 9.0 GPA...

YOU TELL ME,HOW IS CC's grading???

 

I think the least Metro can do about this is do a full disclosure. "This book was previously slab by CGC and graded a 8.5 with light tan pages. However our opinion is the book grades a 9.0" In that case then I would be ok with it but without them disclosing it is a deceit for me. BUT that's just me.

[KryptoSpidey]

I was browsing Comic Connect the other day and was wondering about the grades listed on the site. For the books that aren't CGC graded how reliable are the grades listed? Are they graded by the seller or Comic Connect? Has anybody had any experience with non CGC books from Comic Connect?

 

Thanks all.

Comic Connect is Metropolis Comics Sister site...i've been having a heated discussion with Metro regarding the FF 39 double cover listed on both sites.

It was the slabbed 8.5 "mannarino collection" "LIGHT TAN PAGES" book,that will never get higher than a 8.5 due to the poor page quality,and was last sold for $185...yet they full well know that,and have it listed as a 9.0 "RAW" at almost 9.0 GPA...

YOU TELL ME,HOW IS CC's grading???

 

I think the least Metro can do about this is do a full disclosure. "This book was previously slab by CGC and graded a 8.5 with light tan pages. However our opinion is the book grades a 9.0" In that case then I would be ok with it but without them disclosing it is a deceit for me. BUT that's just me.

+1 this was my point to them as well.

[chrisco37]

Though I am big on page quality, I do think it's funny how much emphasis people put in the CGC designations based on their consistency in assigning them. After a few discussions I've had recently, I've come to look at each book to get signals as to page quality in a CGC holder. I can tell you I no longer worry about cr/ow.

 

Thank you!!!!

 

You guys really need to get off the PQ hang ups. Especially Old Label stuff.

 

I've said before, CGC is wildly inconsistent over the years with regards to PQ.

 

 

I've got a Hulk #181 CGC 7.0 with OW pages. How much would you pay for it?

 

How much would you pay if I told you it used to be a 6.0 with LT-OW pages?

 

 

If this double cover was indeed a LT in a previous slab, it could get a higher PQ designation upon next slabbing. Then what? It's suddenly a book you might now consider?

 

So, anyone that won't consider a book with anything other than WP is being a little too silly, IMO. Don't put all your eggs in the PQ basket. Many, many books have rec'd a PQ bump over the years.

 

[Bosco685]

I've got a Hulk #181 CGC 7.0 with OW pages. How much would you pay for it?

 

How much would you pay if I told you it used to be a 6.0 with LT-OW pages?

 

That's some variance in PQ results.

[chrisco37]

No kidding. Book was pressed, so I knew I'd get the grade jump and I was praying for a PQ bump up to cr/ow. But, when I got that, I was floored (happy, but floored).

 

That was the day I realized some of the cr/ow books I had were just fine. Now, I have absolutely no problem with cr/ow books. Especially with the PQ premium that seems to be the norm.

[G.A.tor]

I have bought 5 raw books from CC that were "verified"...all 5 sent to cgc...4 of them cc hit the cgc grade on the nose!

1 of them they were off by 1.5 (they had as a 8.5 and cgc called 7.0 due to stain)

 

What happened with that? Does comic connect give some sort of money back guarantee?

don't get me wrong, the book "looks" 8.5, cgc downgrades heavily for the stain that CC doesn't ...

it is a rare pedigree book, so there was no return requested on my part, but I believe CC has a return policy of some time frame (one could easily enough look it up on their site, I don't recall off the top of my head)

[swapto]

I've purchased a few raw books from ComicConnect...I've had 2 of them graded:

 

 

TALES TO ASTONISH #62 F/VF 7.0 (1st Leader)

Came back a Universal CGC 9.0

+2.0

 

 

AVENGERS #4 VG 4.0 (1st SA Cap)

Came back a Sig Series CGC .5 incomplete, missing a page. Likely would have been a 4.5 if it weren't missing p.12

-3.5 and a lot of $$$

 

 

...buy at your own risk (thumbs u

 

this post says it all i think.

very disheartening....

[G.A.tor]

I just got my 6th raw submission grade from cgc... 5.5 (and yes, that is what cc advertised it as)...

so, they are 5 out of 6 for me...maybe I am lucky