The Anatomy of a Proper Press!

[tth2]

this is a very informative thread. and after seeing the wonders of pressing, i will laugh in the face of anyone who claims that the collapse in prices of high grade books is due to the economy

 

Yeah. 26% of the country being unemployed has nothing to do with the drop in prices.

 

It's just like the housing market. Increase in supply by itself might cause prices to fall by some degree. Similarly, a high unemployment rate by itself might cause prices to fall by some degree.

 

Have a huge increase in supply at the same time as there is a drop off in demand/spending power because of unemployment/poor economy, and you get Meltdown City!

[tth2]

In an effort to show potential clients the qualities of my American Comics and Collectibles LLC. pressing service, I am going to post "before and after" pictures of comic books that have gone through the pressing process.

 

Exactly. This is not some general thread about the pressing process. It's an advertisement. It shouldn't be in General.

 

Removed my business name and edited the first post. Happy now?

Now that it's been removed from General, yes!

 

So why do the 12 other pressing threads get to stay in General?

 

Because this was clearly an advertising thread, notwithstanding KoR's attempt to disguise it as an educational thread. Fortunately the Mods could see through his little charade.

[Ze-man]

I'm not sure what you mean by pressing "down past the create to cover it up."

The only way I can see to make a crease disappear is to crush the paper fibers down just past the crease.

 

Still not getting you--your description makes it sound like the fibers are a bad combover by a balding guy. The humidity and heat relax the fibers and make them pliable; pressure then molds them back to being flat. Not enough pressure is used to "crush" anything.

Oh, really? I'm not trying to be sarcastic here but, this theory has not been proven to me yet. I happen to know a whole lot about wood fibers. Paper fibers are not much different

 

Actually Mike they are.

 

Paper was initially made from a wet, slurry mess of pulp and fibers which is pulled through screen and blotted dry under pressure.

Once it becomes set it retains that initial pressed state, unless totally immersed in water to the point of complete re saturation.

 

So one should not have to "crush" paper to make a crease/bend go away. One just has to re introduce moisture to remind it how it was set originally.

It isn't about re aligning the fibers, it is more about reminding them how they were set initially.

 

Case in point.

 

I saw your questions tonight, so I took a loose interior page.

Which I wrote your name on, crumpled it up, then moisture pressed the page with no heat and minimal pressure.

 

It did not take long.

 

Granted , this was just an interior page and covers and whole books can react differently, as can hard folded creases etc..

But it should serve as an example of how a creased comic can in fact become flat again without crushing it.

 

Heck, I will even send it to you.

 

[DiceX]

Yeah, but can you pull a rabbit out of your ?

 

 

[Ze-man]

Shall I write your name on it and send it to you like last time?

 

 

[DiceX]

That was a gerbil. I'm not impressed with anything smaller than a prairie dog.

 

 

[Hero Restoration]

I'm not sure what you mean by pressing "down past the create to cover it up."

The only way I can see to make a crease disappear is to crush the paper fibers down just past the crease.

 

Still not getting you--your description makes it sound like the fibers are a bad combover by a balding guy. The humidity and heat relax the fibers and make them pliable; pressure then molds them back to being flat. Not enough pressure is used to "crush" anything.

Oh, really? I'm not trying to be sarcastic here but, this theory has not been proven to me yet. I happen to know a whole lot about wood fibers. Paper fibers are not much different

 

Actually Mike they are.

 

Paper was initially made from a wet, slurry mess of pulp and fibers which is pulled through screen and blotted dry under pressure.

Once it becomes set it retains that initial pressed state, unless totally immersed in water to the point of complete re saturation.

 

So one should not have to "crush" paper to make a crease/bend go away. One just has to re introduce moisture to remind it how it was set originally.

It isn't about re aligning the fibers, it is more about reminding them how they were set initially.

 

Case in point.

 

I saw your questions tonight, so I took a loose interior page.

Which I wrote your name on, crumpled it up, then moisture pressed the page with no heat and minimal pressure.

 

It did not take long.

 

Granted , this was just an interior page and covers and whole books can react differently, as can hard folded creases etc..

But it should serve as an example of how a creased comic can in fact become flat again without crushing it.

 

Heck, I will even send it to you.

 

 

BINGO ! (thumbs u

 

Mike, I can understand why you feel the way you do about it. There are two kinds of presser's out there. The one's who use high heat and pressure and the ones who use humidity. It's really as simple as that. Why high heat and pressure work most of the time is there is almost always some humidity already in the book and the high heat eek's it out just barely but results will be inconsistent. Kenny's example shows how you can get all of it out with no heat and just some weight but a little heat is needed for older folds (I believe ) as I have not tryed no heat at all myself on any old defects.

 

Green said it best " It is more Bruce Banner than it is Hulk"

[DrWatson]

 

 

[t3quila]

 

 

 

There it is, proof that Bin Laden presses.

[NewWorldOrder]

this is a very informative thread. and after seeing the wonders of pressing, i will laugh in the face of anyone who claims that the collapse in prices of high grade books is due to the economy

 

Ask Roy.

[comicdonna]

I'm not sure what you mean by pressing "down past the create to cover it up."

The only way I can see to make a crease disappear is to crush the paper fibers down just past the crease.

 

Still not getting you--your description makes it sound like the fibers are a bad combover by a balding guy. The humidity and heat relax the fibers and make them pliable; pressure then molds them back to being flat. Not enough pressure is used to "crush" anything.

Oh, really? I'm not trying to be sarcastic here but, this theory has not been proven to me yet. I happen to know a whole lot about wood fibers. Paper fibers are not much different

 

Actually Mike they are.

 

Paper was initially made from a wet, slurry mess of pulp and fibers which is pulled through screen and blotted dry under pressure.

Once it becomes set it retains that initial pressed state, unless totally immersed in water to the point of complete re saturation.

 

So one should not have to "crush" paper to make a crease/bend go away. One just has to re introduce moisture to remind it how it was set originally.

It isn't about re aligning the fibers, it is more about reminding them how they were set initially.

 

Case in point.

 

I saw your questions tonight, so I took a loose interior page.

Which I wrote your name on, crumpled it up, then moisture pressed the page with no heat and minimal pressure.

 

It did not take long.

 

Granted , this was just an interior page and covers and whole books can react differently, as can hard folded creases etc..

But it should serve as an example of how a creased comic can in fact become flat again without crushing it.

 

Heck, I will even send it to you.

 

Your post reminds me of making a piece of paper in science class back in 1977! Everyone in the class signed it.

 

I will try to keep an open mind about pressing until scientific studies show the effects that pressing has on vintage paper.

 

Thanks for the demonstration, Kenny!

 

 

 

[fantastic_four]

I will try to keep an open mind about pressing until scientific studies show the effects that pressing has on vintage paper.

 

Those studies have already been linked to, quoted, and discussed multiple times in this very forum; the best thing you can do now is search here or do some googling. The Library of Congress web site has a TON of excellent articles about all of this, as do many university and paper conservation web sites. All of the elements of pressing are already part of the natural environment comics are already in; the increased humidity, heat, and pressure aren't extreme enough to do anything more than act as a more focused, cumulative version of what the heat and humidity in the air or the pressure from bags, boxes, other comics, or people are already doing to the books anyway, assuming the work is done carefully and in moderation. These are key reasons a lot of people don't consider it to be restoration.

[VintageComics]

That was a gerbil. I'm not impressed with anything smaller than a prairie dog.

 

 

He wrote your name on a gerbil?

 

Mods notified!

[VintageComics]

this is a very informative thread. and after seeing the wonders of pressing, i will laugh in the face of anyone who claims that the collapse in prices of high grade books is due to the economy

 

Ask Roy.

 

You're right John. We're experiencing one of the greatest economic meltdowns and the greatest transfer of wealth that the world has ever seen including entire cities in the US being evacuated because people can't pay for their homes, but I'm wearing a tin foil hat.

 

 

It's just like the housing market. Increase in supply by itself might cause prices to fall by some degree. Similarly, a high unemployment rate by itself might cause prices to fall by some degree.

 

Have a huge increase in supply at the same time as there is a drop off in demand/spending power because of unemployment/poor economy, and you get Meltdown City!

[fantastic_four]

People always feel the need to oversimply the complexity of the world. A drop in market prices is quite often a multi-variable equation, not a single-variable equation. Supply (increased by pressing and natural raw slabbing) and demand (decreased by a cruddy economy) always both affect market pricing.

[etanick]

amen

 

I will add one other component...crazy and unrealistic run up on the prices of many books to start before more UHG books are pressed up/discovered and the bad economy.

 

[joeypost]

People always feel the need to oversimply the complexity of the world. A drop in market prices is quite often a multi-variable equation, not a single-variable equation. Supply (increased by pressing and natural raw slabbing) and demand (decreased by a cruddy economy) always both affect market pricing.

 

Like pressing causing the housing market crash?

[Rawhide]

I will try to keep an open mind about pressing until scientific studies show the effects that pressing has on vintage paper.

 

Those studies have already been linked to, quoted, and discussed multiple times in this very forum; the best thing you can do now is search here or do some googling. The Library of Congress web site has a TON of excellent articles about all of this, as do many university and paper conservation web sites. All of the elements of pressing are already part of the natural environment comics are already in; the increased humidity, heat, and pressure aren't extreme enough to do anything more than act as a more focused, cumulative version of what the heat and humidity in the air or the pressure from bags, boxes, other comics, or people are already doing to the books anyway, assuming the work is done carefully and in moderation. These are key reasons a lot of people don't consider it to be restoration.

 

All the elements of pressing are in the making of the original paper for the books to begin with during the paper making process.

 

The pulp comes out of the headbox (that one should make the out of context thread... ) and on to a fourdrinier table (or some variation). The purpose of the fourdrinier table is to "align" the fibers of the pulp for papermaking.

 

From here the pulp enters the press section of the paper machine (typically two or three presses with varying PLI). This is where the majority of the water is pressed out of the fibers. From the press section the "paper" goes to a series of dryer cans which are basically steam heated to remove the remaining water out of the paper. Not all the water is pulled out of the paper obviously.

 

Papermills try to sell paper with as much water as possible to increase their tonnage of paper sold while decreasing their product produced.

 

This is an overly simplified description of the process, but that is "basically" how paper is made minus the pulpmill process description of "breaking" down the wood chips to pulp.

 

I'm not getting into the pressing debate, but could see your point of "natural environment" also corresponding to the natural process of paper making.

[buttock]

I have a question. What does pressing do to the fibers in the paper? It would seem to me that the fibers would need to be pressed down past the crease to "cover it up". Surely, this would forever change the fibers in the paper and put the comic at risk for a much shorter life span?

 

The fibers were damaged with the crease. Pressing is putting them back into place, but not causing any further damage. Why would you think it would put it at risk?

[cgcmod4]

That was a gerbil. I'm not impressed with anything smaller than a prairie dog.

 

 

He wrote your name on a gerbil?

 

Mods notified!

 

 

Mods mortified!