Any information on coollinesartwork.com?

[comicartcom]

by the way, I have a comparison for what I'm saying.

 

Many times when you have to go to the bank, you have to stand in line. There is almost always someone in line making remarks about "why are they going so slow" "How long are they going to take" "why don't they open another cashier".

 

I think if I have to wait on line, I just patiently wait on line.

If you can't wait, just move on.. there's another bank on the other corner.

 

the Donnellys aren't the only art dealers out there

If the other dealer doesn't have what you want, but the Donnelly's do. You can make a choice.

If you choose to do business in their bank and you successfully conclude your business - you have no complaint.

By the same token - if you can't conclude any business - I still think you have no complaint.

 

but that's just me.. you can feel however you want.

and then I'll put this picture up again, I'm sure

 

[comix4fun]

Chris, listen.. while I may not agree with the way they do some things, it isn't my position to approve or disapprove. While people may have a gripe wit the "inquire" "price is double" and related issues, what cannot be said is they stole anything from anyone.

 

 

I don't care about any of the "inquire" or price doubling stuff. That's what dealers will do. It can be annoying, it can be a waste of time and I choose not to engage or support it. I also NEVER post about that stuff because it doesn't really matter.

 

However, The two times I did business with them was through EBay.

They have several Ebay accounts and I did not realize either time that I was doing business with them until the auction was over.

 

I know you say that they never "stole anything from anyone". The situation I mentioned with the page that was 1/2 stat happened to me. Before bidding on the auction, I asked a direct question regarding its condition and got an answer that was not truthful. I allowed for the possibility of mistake and contacted the seller upon receipt where they confirmed they knew all about the stat. That means I was lied to, and that deception got me to bid on a page and bid more than I would have otherwise. The seller was defiant when asked for a reasonable solution, and did nothing to rectify the matter. What would you call that Rich?

 

 

Another time I dealt with them they send me the wrong piece of art. It was a piece for my son, a $35 page, and I was charged another $15 in shipping. And they sent a far inferior page than the one I won in the auction. When I contacted them about it they said they could not find the proper page but would look for it. Weeks passed and no word from them. So I emailed again, they said it was "lost" at that point. 2 days later the page was relisted on Ebay.

 

When I brought this to their attention I was given the option of paying for return shipping on the incorrect page and pay for shipping again on the proper page. They wanted me to pay for shipping 3 times, at a cost in excess of the page itself, for something that was ONE THOUSAND PERCENT their problem and their doing.

 

So while you may think it's business as usual I can't imagine if someone lied to your face about the condition of a piece and then threw it in your face confirming that yes they lied while refusing to correct the error reasonably that you might not feel the same. So it's unfair to make a statement affirming that they have been 100% straight up in all their dealings when there are people who have had experiences that could not be more to the contrary.

 

As a past customer it's exactly my position to disapprove when someone comes to this forum asking for information about a certain seller when I have a specific experience that might help someone from having the same thing done to them.

 

If they had done anything like that to you, you would be well within the bounds of good taste to do the same.

[comicartcom]

Chris

 

I can say unequivically that in all the years I have done business with them back and forth, I have never had a bad experience. However, people know that I don't do business that way - in either direction - and that anything requiring too much work on my side was usually not worth my time except in extreme cases.

 

Also, there has never been an item and never will be an item that I will subborn my interests to get.

 

I can also say that I don't know anyone personally who ever told me they were ripped off by the brothers and most of what I do see in complaints does fall along the lines of "I want it so bad but they keep doubling the price" etc.

 

After you got the first item - did you return it? I'm 100% positive you would have been able to do that. If you wanted the item so bad that you wanted to keep it, well Chris - that falls under the "my choice" category. I would tend to agree that they should have told you if the piece was a state etc, but seeing as I can't 1) see any listing for description or 2) read your emails back & forth.. it's really hard for me to take any side at all. It isn't something I would do nor is it something I agree with. But I didn't see it happen so I can't really have a solid opinion on what happened. Like reading a 3 paragraph news article about a mass murder. How can I really and truly know exactly what really did transpire?

 

The second time around - hey.. didn't you learn your lesson yet? You got the item, you're unhappy again... Even I see where that's headed.

 

You know, there are a number of people out there who have ripped me off. Some were my good buddies at some point and some may even be on the list of art dealers. I defy anyone on this board to find any article anywhere where I have disparaged them even one time on or off this board. Even my posts on Danny Dupcak have a certain air of higher ground and he's a complete pos as everyone knows. I don't see the purpose of grinding it into the ground over & over & over. I got ripped off or whatever happened.. That's that. Move one, I have other stuff to do, they'll get theirs. I just don't see a purpose

 

like I said, beating up on the brothers is the same as this:

 

if they've really done all this bad bad stuff, then everyone should just stop doing business with them and then self preservation will make them change their ways. But if you do business with them by choice and you didn't like it, it's your own fault if you wind up feeling like a street walker who was just turned out by her manager

 

 

 

[Claudio]

 

The second time around - hey.. didn't you learn your lesson yet? You got the item, you're unhappy again... Even I see where that's headed.

 

Didn't Chris say it was two different ebay ID and he didn't know they were the seller?

 

 

if they've really done all this bad bad stuff, then everyone should just stop doing business with them and then self preservation will make them change their ways. But if you do business with them by choice and you didn't like it, it's your own fault if you wind up feeling like a street walker who was just turned out by her manager

 

 

 

I think Chris is relating his experiences to warn others and maybe to encourage people to stop dealing with them... The OP was specifically asking about them so why shouldn't he relate his experience?

[thethedew]

... most of what I do see in complaints does fall along the lines of "I want it so bad but they keep doubling the price" etc.

 

Is that an unreasonable complaint?

 

Just because we've heard the complaint before doesn't mean it should be dismissed. If we keep hearing it, it at least suggests a certain pattern of behavior is still going on.

 

if they've really done all this bad bad stuff, then everyone should just stop doing business with them and then self preservation will make them change their ways.

 

Are you suggesting a boycott, Richard?

 

Seriously, though, many collectors seem to already be there, informally at least.

Personally, I doubt any amount of 'withholding of business' will have any effect on the Donnellys. (Though I admit it might be amusing to try) Just by my limited observation, I don't think their business counts on cash flow from art sales to continue.

 

We may have to hope to outlive them... how old are they again?

 

Also, there has never been an item and never will be an item that I will subborn my interests to get.

 

Boy, I wish I were as well-adjusted as you are, Richard!

 

Obviously, being forced to walk away from desired collectibles is painful. It takes discipline, and, in my honest opinion, builds character and sets personal guidelines. But I would still never begrudge someone grumbling about an attempt to take advantage of one's hobby and one's nostalgia.

 

'Holding art hostage' has been discussed in these forums before. Does the Donnellys behavior fall within those parameters?

[Antithesis-migration]

Gentlemen,

 

Just taking some time to weigh in on this....

 

For what it's worth...part of the reason I came to this Forum was to get information of the type that's being discussed in this thread. I'm not what I would call a "big-time" collector (though I love to live vicariously through those of you with, apparently, much deeper pockets than my own) and I'm not especially "connected" with other collectors, dealers, or creators. Thus, when I learn something about who I can and cannot trust in the hobby--I do so through places like this Forum.

 

I have appreciated hearing all the stories about the Donnelly brothers and their business practices from all involved in relating them here. To begin with, I would be unlikely to buy anything from them in the first place (they're simply out of my price range), but after listening to you all...I'd avoid them, even if I was in a position to do so. Frankly, too many of you have similar stories for there not to be some substance to that which most of you allege.

 

I can appreciate what Mr. Halegua is saying about "beating a dead horse" (and there is some substance to that, too). But, for my part, this has been a very good learning experience for me--and I would wager, many other collectors in my "collecting demographic". I would encourage all of you to continue helping those of us out without your experience. I certainly know that I appreciate it.

 

 

casl

 

[edited for poor syntax]

[Rodey]

Basically, what the Donelly's have is poor customer service. That's all I'm reading from all of this.

[comix4fun]

Chris

 

After you got the first item - did you return it? I'm 100% positive you would have been able to do that. If you wanted the item so bad that you wanted to keep it, well Chris - that falls under the "my choice" category. I would tend to agree that they should have told you if the piece was a state etc, but seeing as I can't 1) see any listing for description or 2) read your emails back & forth.. it's really hard for me to take any side at all. It isn't something I would do nor is it something I agree with. But I didn't see it happen so I can't really have a solid opinion on what happened. Like reading a 3 paragraph news article about a mass murder. How can I really and truly know exactly what really did transpire?

 

Well it's a good thing I wasn't asking for validation from you.

 

Given that you are assuming that the seller was telling the truth, and stating with 100% certainty how they would have refunded my money in full without actually knowing how they handled my situation specifically and without knowing anything about my transaction, it odd that you would say that you can't then form an opinion as to whether they lied to me because you don't have enough facts. That's a pretty selective crystal ball you have there.

 

Unless you are privy to ALL of their deals, in person, at conventions, on all of the various Ebay screen names I don't know how you can rationalize making blanket statements of 100% certainty to back them up while in the same breath casting doubt over what I am relating first hand because you weren't there to see it.

 

Frankly, I am not asking you to believe me. I don't need your validation. The OP and the people I know in the hobby, and who know me, are free to form their own opinions based on my opinions and the factual retelling I have stated here. The ultimate truth in this matter is , thankfully, not reliant on whether you think it happened

 

Given what I was told before bidding, given what I received in the mail and given the responses subsequent to contacting the seller with regards to the condition issues I had an opinion that I could have no faith whatsoever in anything told to me from that point on. Even if a full refund including all shipping costs was offered (which was not offered to me) how was I supposed to rely on that actually occurring ?

 

Someone I knew saw the page and liked it even with the massive flaw. I took a loss on the page and sold it to them for less than I paid. Once I was lied to I vowed to never deal with them again for any reason.

 

 

The second time around - hey.. didn't you learn your lesson yet? You got the item, you're unhappy again... Even I see where that's headed.

 

Multple Ebay accounts, multiple screen names, no identification of the seller until after the auction was over. If I knew it was them the second time around they would have never had another chance to get my money and haven't since. I wonder why they had all those different ebay accounts?

 

"The second time around" THEY SENT THE WRONG PAGE. That's not me being unhappy with the item, that is, in my opinion, GROSS incompetence. Given that the page that was sent was inferior to what I had bought, that may be putting it lightly.

 

They are your friends, I get that now. There's no other way to explain you defending them sending the wrong artwork and then placing the entire onus on the buyer to correct something that was 100% their mistake.

 

I didn't return it because I was out enough money already and with their refusal to refund my shipping or pay for return shipping they would have collected almost 3 times the pieces worth from me and double what I had agreed to pay them all for something that was entirely their error.

 

I'd rather burn the page than lay out another dime to fix their mistake.

 

You can "see where this is headed" ? Really?

 

For someone who says they are careful not to form an opinion based on incomplete knowledge you are certainly casting opinions as to "seeing where this is headed" alluding to me being a problem buyer without ever dealing with me or knowing the first thing about my reputation in this hobby. Is your responsible patience, and care, limited to your dealings with the Brothers?

 

I've dealt with EVERY major dealer in this hobby and ALL the auction houses. I've bought, sold, traded and commissioned artwork with pretty much every rep, agent and dealer you can name. I've NEVER had this problem with ANYONE else.

 

Don't try to put this on me as being a bad buyer, just because you've never had a problem. Simply because you've never seen it doesn't mean it didn't happen this time. I am pretty sure the world keeps turning and sun keeps rising without your confirmation.

 

I can give you a list of references longer than my arm of collectors, dealers, reps, agents and creators who have dealt with me in the last 20-25 years that have never had an issue with me. But I don't have to, because you have your opinion based on your experience and I have mine. The difference between us is, I am not telling you that your opinion is invalid because it disagrees with mine. I think it's overstated because there's no way you can state with 100% certainty what they would or would not do in every situation for all time, but as it relates to your personal dealing with them and what you've actually witnessed you can form any opinion you want.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[mister_not_so_nice]

 

This thread was started December 30th, 2010.

So as of less than 4 weeks ago at least 1 OA collector hadn't got the word about the Donnelly brothers practices(or how to use the SEARCH function, but that's a topic for another thread ).

 

Aside from sharing great art I think this forum should be used to share great art info . Until there is no need to discuss bad OA dealers let the thread flourish

[bocaratondefense]

If you don't want to go through all of that, the answer is simple - don't contact them! I am absolutely positive that neither one of them will give a hoot if someone doesn't want to deal with them.

 

I do agree with you here. Not worth the headache.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[oceans11]

The only thing I observe is that there are multiple, consistant stories of difficult dealings with the Donnellys. Sure, there may be one or two stories out there about other art dealers, but not to the extent that the Donnelly brothers have racked up. Sure.. if it was one or two, then I could view it as being buyer/seller disagreement, miscommunication, and different perception of the deal. Unfortunately that's not the case here. Multiple stories of varied problems ranging from condition of artwork to pricing to holding artwork "hostage". Maybe there's some truth to these stories after all?

 

Being still relatively new to this hobby, I appreciate these type of postings as it gives me information on dealers and their practices. (Yes.. I know how to use the search function and have, but still appreciate seeing recent postings like this).

 

Collecting isn't only about acquiring or owning the piece of art, but also the experience that it took to get that piece into your collection. So discussion of good/ bad experience seems pretty important to the hobby. If a dealer is selling pages that are half stats and not communicating this, and in turn no one talks about it, then this propagates that behavior and ultimately many people end up getting burned in the process. Once discussed, this allows the collector to decide if they want to buy from the dealer or not. It's like those old public service announcements on TV..."The more you know..."

 

 

[groovyedwin]

A good website to see the history of ebay dealings so you can make an informed decision if you know the ebay ID

 

http://www.toolhaus.org/cgi-bin/negs?User=valnstevez.aol&Dirn=Received+by

 

Play around with the various search functions and make up your own mind.

 

Edwin

[Romain]

Great tool !!!! When I think of the time I spent looking back at several hundred pages of feedbacks to find the negs .... (thumbs u

 

[mercuryspeed-migration]

I suspect those who are defending the Donnellys are those who have benefitted from business relationships with them, period. For those of us who only collect, interactions with them are decidedly more difficult because they choose to operate in the gray. Now, you may believe it is well within the right as a salesman/businessman to use whatever means he can to sell his product. After all, he is there to make money to feed his family, pay the bills, etc., and if he has to lie to sell a page, if he has to decieve someone as to the worth of something, if he has to pretend he lost something when in reality he had regrets about selling it at a certain price and this was a clever way to renege on the deal, he will do it.

 

The problem is, IT IS WRONG. I don't care whether you characterize the Donnellys as immoral or amoral, the bottom line is they are wrong. And before you say "Every OA dealer does this or that," I'd like to say, yes, every dealer has a certain sales "style" but NONE of the others (Will, Mike, Dave, Bechara, etc etc) outright lie the way the Donnellys do.

 

Rich can go and post the "dead horse" pic if he likes, but I don't mind posting every day for a year if it keeps ONE new person entering the hobby from contacting them and being burned.

[blowout]

While I have no direct evidence to report in this instance, I wholeheartedly agree with the previous poster that these types of threads are just as valuable as those that sing the praises of certain dealers.

 

This type of information allows collectors to make an informed decision. If there are those that don't like to hear information repeated, why not just stay out of the thread?

[Romain]

I don't want to seem to be defending the Donnelly's more than I did already though I love to be the Devil's advocate in any case BUT I hope everyone here realize the most praised dealers we all love more or less actually DO business with them as we can often see pieces go from one site to another .....And once more I repeat I personnally had bad experiences with very respected sellers I won't name because simply I need to be able to deal with them in the future and in my case the Donnelly's fit perfectly but I find it odd that we don't have threads regarding other art dealers or ebay sellers ...

Finally I must admit the amount of evidence gathered here made me change my CAF home page and I don't promote SD anymore as I used to do ...hope he won't triple my price when the time will come !!!!

 

 

[mister_not_so_nice]

.....And once more I repeat I personnally had bad experiences with very respected sellers I won't name because simply I need to be able to deal with them in the future and in my case the Donnelly's fit perfectly but I find it odd that we don't have threads regarding other art dealers or ebay sellers ...

 

The reason we don't have threads devoted to the bad practices of other dealers is most don't need it.

 

Start a thread titled "Any information on (Name your dealer here).com?" and I'll bet a majority have had a positive transaction with them. Which is about the exact opposite when referring to Coollines(or a alias they decide to use at the time)

 

 

 

<-----this is me waiting to comment in the other dealer threads